Rumor: 2024-2025 Trade Rumors and Free Agency - Offseason Edition

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The Abusement Park

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Jan 18, 2016
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Again I don't disagree but you have to find a way to break through. You're going to play elite goalies, this core has shown time and time again they can't beat them so why run it back with them? Swayman, Shesterkin, Bobrovsky and Vasilevskiy aren't going anywhere.

Agreed here but the defending and goaltending hasn't actually been the cause of their demise. We can say the defensemen don't transition well enough, but that's not really the argument right now though it is a big reason why those forwards struggle - though William Nylander performing exactly the same as his regular season totals throws a wrench into that argument.
And I’m saying it should be the main argument alongside the core not performing. If you put that Dcore behind this current Avs team, we are probably a 1st round exit pretty consistently as well. Now our core guys still outperform them I’d gather but they have guys built to play a similar system to ours with no one to get them the puck.
 

dahrougem2

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And I’m saying it should be the main argument alongside the core not performing. If you put that Dcore behind this current Avs team, we are probably a 1st round exit pretty consistently as well. Now our core guys still outperform them I’d gather but they have guys built to play a similar system to ours with no one to get them the puck.
But why does William Nylander seem to continue his regular season output while the other two continue to falter? Not counting Tavares because he is cooked.

The Oilers even prior to Ekholm didn't have a who's who of defensemen yet their top guys continued to produce and produce well. That is a team let down by supporting cast/goaltending. The Leafs are a team let down by their offense.
 

The Abusement Park

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But why does William Nylander seem to continue his regular season output while the other two continue to falter? Not counting Tavares because he is cooked.

The Oilers even prior to Ekholm didn't have a who's who of defensemen yet their top guys continued to produce and produce well. That is a team let down by supporting cast/goaltending. The Leafs are a team let down by their offense.
I’m just saying it’s a mix. Matthews and Marner can be disappointing while also having defense that isn’t conducive to producing offense.

Also the Oilers defensively have way better puck movers than the leafs have. Bouchard’s great, Ekholm is not a savant or anything but he’s decent enough(especially next to Bouchard), Nurse while obviously a problem at his price is fine with the puck, and Kulak even moves the puck pretty decently for a 3rd pairing guy. The Oilers d has plenty of problems but they can get by far better in transition than the leafs guys.
 

Chiarelli

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Jan 27, 2019
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But why does William Nylander seem to continue his regular season output while the other two continue to falter? Not counting Tavares because he is cooked.

The Oilers even prior to Ekholm didn't have a who's who of defensemen yet their top guys continued to produce and produce well. That is a team let down by supporting cast/goaltending. The Leafs are a team let down by their offense.
Nylander is at best the 3rd thing that will be focused on by an opposing team.
Oilers didn't play anywhere near the talent Leafs did, and when they have - they lost quite easily (Vegas last year/Avs 2022, and even lost to the jets in 2021 which was not a good team)
Also Matthews despite being great isn't McDavid.
 
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AvsFan2123

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Thinking out loud. We’ll be down 1 top 6 F at least to start the year. Sounds like LOC will be ready for camp so that’s good. However, we still aren’t sure if Landy is ready for game 1, and he’s definitely not gonna be a top 6 quality to start. So value/bargain bin shopping. Do Avs circle back to PKane? I genuinely don’t know what he or DET wants, but it does appear he has some good hockey left. Made only 2.75M last year. Sign him to 1x2.5?
 

Mighty Makar

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Thinking out loud. We’ll be down 1 top 6 F at least to start the year. Sounds like LOC will be ready for camp so that’s good. However, we still aren’t sure if Landy is ready for game 1, and he’s definitely not gonna be a top 6 quality to start. So value/bargain bin shopping. Do Avs circle back to PKane? I genuinely don’t know what he or DET wants, but it does appear he has some good hockey left. Made only 2.75M last year. Sign him to 1x2.5?
Guys on Spittin’ Chiclets were saying they heard Kane is going to the Bruins. I wouldn’t mind him on a 1 year deal for $2.5M.
 

Pokecheque

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But why does William Nylander seem to continue his regular season output while the other two continue to falter? Not counting Tavares because he is cooked.

The Oilers even prior to Ekholm didn't have a who's who of defensemen yet their top guys continued to produce and produce well. That is a team let down by supporting cast/goaltending. The Leafs are a team let down by their offense.
Nylander is an effective playoff scorer for the same reason the Avs offense seemingly dries up at the worst possible times—he’s very, very good at scoring in the net-front area. Matthews is possibly the best shooter in the game, and Marner can shoot it but he’s known more for his playmaking ability. Like the Avs, it’s just too easy to box them out come playoff time.

But yes, the Leafs have chipped away at their own offensive dynamic for a long time now and they basically can’t win unless one of the “core four” just takes over the game. They have to do everything now.
 

Pokecheque

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This would explain a few things
IMG_2460.jpeg
 

henchman21

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Meh call me crazy but I won't give up on Kakko until he gets a change of scenery. Sam Bennett is a good example here.
Bennett's game has always been there. He's not a big time scorer and that didn't really change going to Florida. His minutes and PP time went up. His style of play of being a nasty disposition, hard 2 way player was there in Calgary too. He always showed up in the playoffs for them.

IMO Kakko doesn't play a hard enough game to be a bottom six guy here and be successful. Then he's not nearly skilled enough to be a top 6 forward in the NHL. Which leaves him in kind of a no man's land. If the Avs played a different style in the bottom 6, maybe he could be successful here in that role... but his game just isn't suited to how the Avs play in that role. He'd likely end up a bad 2nd liner here.

Kakko's the new "I can fix him" Pizza Boy.
 

LurkerMcgee

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Oct 6, 2020
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Bennett's game has always been there. He's not a big time scorer and that didn't really change going to Florida. His minutes and PP time went up. His style of play of being a nasty disposition, hard 2 way player was there in Calgary too. He always showed up in the playoffs for them.

IMO Kakko doesn't play a hard enough game to be a bottom six guy here and be successful. Then he's not nearly skilled enough to be a top 6 forward in the NHL. Which leaves him in kind of a no man's land. If the Avs played a different style in the bottom 6, maybe he could be successful here in that role... but his game just isn't suited to how the Avs play in that role. He'd likely end up a bad 2nd liner here.

Kakko's the new "I can fix him" Pizza Boy.
Agreed. Watching Kakko it seems to be clear he isn’t going to blossom anywhere really. He gets touched and immediately looks for a call, that screams entitlement. Maybe he got to the nhl by always just being the most skilled player on the ice, now he isn’t and it shows. His hockey iq and overall willingness to work hard isn’t there. But I could and probably am wrong
 

Vaslof

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Agreed. Watching Kakko it seems to be clear he isn’t going to blossom anywhere really. He gets touched and immediately looks for a call, that screams entitlement. Maybe he got to the nhl by always just being the most skilled player on the ice, now he isn’t and it shows. His hockey iq and overall willingness to work hard isn’t there. But I could and probably am wrong
Interesting. Back in draft year he used to be very good at protecting the puck. The kind of player that can open up space in the offensive zone. At least back then he had high hockey IQ too, he was always in the right place at the right time to score goals. He was also skilled at creating chances by himself with dekes and wrap arounds.

I've no idea how his development has gone in the NHL years. The massive upside he had must still exist. If we can get him for cheap I believe we should 100% go for it. He's exactly the kind of player we need to look for to make the team stronger under cap pressure.
 
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henchman21

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Agreed. Watching Kakko it seems to be clear he isn’t going to blossom anywhere really. He gets touched and immediately looks for a call, that screams entitlement. Maybe he got to the nhl by always just being the most skilled player on the ice, now he isn’t and it shows. His hockey iq and overall willingness to work hard isn’t there. But I could and probably am wrong
He was one of the more skilled players, but I think a bigger part of it was he developed strength early and he could overpower in Finland.
Interesting. Back in draft year he used to be very good at protecting the puck. The kind of player that can open up space in the offensive zone. At least back then he had high hockey IQ too, he was always in the right place at the right time to score goals. He was also skilled at creating chances by himself with dekes and wrap arounds.

I've no idea how his development has gone in the NHL years. The massive upside he had must still exist. If we can get him for cheap I believe we should 100% go for it. He's exactly the kind of player we need to look for to make the team stronger under cap pressure.

I think the real lesson here is he simply didn't have massive upside to begin with. He was an early developer who everyone labeled with the 'he's this strong now, imagine at 23 when he gets his man strength!' label... when he already had his man strength. In the NHL that advantage is completely negated where 90+% of players are strong and most at as strong, if not stronger than him. Combine that with not a supreme skill set to counter with, you end up with a pretty average hockey player. He's a legit NHLer, but I don't think he's a good one.

Personally my biggest disappointment with Kakko is his shot. It was a weapon in Finland. What I didn't recognize and really should have is that while it is powerful... it isn't accurate, and more than that, it has a weird hitch to it. Which makes so goalies have a clear tell when he's going to shoot and gives them a read. At the NHL level, most goalies can take advantage of that read where lower levels they can't. Unless that can be ironed out, I don't think his goal scoring will take a dramatic jump. He's not a smart enough player or have good enough hands/passing skill to really be a much better playmaker.

I don't think he's as bad as this year showed, but I also don't think he's much, if any better than a 20-25 guy. Maybe that moves to 25-30, but seems like a stretch at this point.
 
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Balthazar

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I don't know if he's going to get any good one day but I do think Kakko would benefit from playing on another team. If anything, what's happening with Lafreniere right now is a sign that the kids were mishandled in NY and not put in the best position to succeed.

Half the Rags board is screaming at the coach to put Laf on the PP. He's currently their best playoff forward and he still isn't on the PP. This is just another sign that the kids don't get the best opportunities there (which is common for cup contenders).
 
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Vaslof

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He was one of the more skilled players, but I think a bigger part of it was he developed strength early and he could overpower in Finland.


I think the real lesson here is he simply didn't have massive upside to begin with. He was an early developer who everyone labeled with the 'he's this strong now, imagine at 23 when he gets his man strength!' label... when he already had his man strength. In the NHL that advantage is completely negated where 90+% of players are strong and most at as strong, if not stronger than him. Combine that with not a supreme skill set to counter with, you end up with a pretty average hockey player. He's a legit NHLer, but I don't think he's a good one.

Personally my biggest disappointment with Kakko is his shot. It was a weapon in Finland. What I didn't recognize and really should have is that while it is powerful... it isn't accurate, and more than that, it has a weird hitch to it. Which makes so goalies have a clear tell when he's going to shoot and gives them a read. At the NHL level, most goalies can take advantage of that read where lower levels they can't. Unless that can be ironed out, I don't think his goal scoring will take a dramatic jump. He's not a smart enough player or have good enough hands/passing skill to really be a much better playmaker.

I don't think he's as bad as this year showed, but I also don't think he's much, if any better than a 20-25 guy. Maybe that moves to 25-30, but seems like a stretch at this point.
Question is can we get a better guy than him on a cheap deal to play RW behind Rants? Better not let perfect be the enemy of good. We'll need a guy in that spot with Nuke stuck in limbo. I think they're either going to sign Drouin and shift Landeskog to RW and/or promote LOC, or they'll let Drouin go and get a new guy for 2RW. Kakko specifically is a top six or bust player imo. That's a tough position to be in when you haven't earned 2nd line minutes yet, but playing in lower lines isn't going to make you look good.
 

Freaky Styley

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Bennett's game has always been there. He's not a big time scorer and that didn't really change going to Florida. His minutes and PP time went up. His style of play of being a nasty disposition, hard 2 way player was there in Calgary too. He always showed up in the playoffs for them.

IMO Kakko doesn't play a hard enough game to be a bottom six guy here and be successful. Then he's not nearly skilled enough to be a top 6 forward in the NHL. Which leaves him in kind of a no man's land. If the Avs played a different style in the bottom 6, maybe he could be successful here in that role... but his game just isn't suited to how the Avs play in that role. He'd likely end up a bad 2nd liner here.

Kakko's the new "I can fix him" Pizza Boy.
I'm not disagreeing with you but would just like to see him in a new situation before writing him off completely. Look at Drouin. There's lots of cases where guys look like crap in one situation and change completely in a new one, even if the signs aren't there.

To me the biggest thing is his skating. He's got the checking ability and the natural talent to find a scoring touch again if he can get up and down the ice efficiently. That's what I'd drill into him.

Needless to say I wouldn't pay a high price, but he's not a bad potential low-risk pickup as like a secondary or tertiary move this offseason
 
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