2023 Tank Thread (Mod post Page 60)

[GunnarStahl]

Since it seems the Ducks will likely finish bottom 5 this year, I figured we should have a thread for discussing the implications of where the f***s will finish in the standings. As well as what factors could affect where they finish.

Tonight was interesting as all bottom 5 teams earned 2 points sans the Ducks and the Hawks.

Hey Folks,

Want to clear some of the air here, Tank talk is not an issue, please talk tank to your heart’s content here, totally understand how critical it is for that Future Potential Top pick. The issue is posting in the GDT, like you want the team to lose or make posts that you are angry they are winning or won the game, or bashing the team for not tanking.

The main reason is, to respect your fellow members. The GDT is about discussion of the game on a live basis and then post game discussion and opinions. A lot of fans are not rooting for the team to lose, and everyone has their views and opinions towards tanking, and may not want to discuss tanking in the GDT

If you guys have any concerns, feel free to PM me or another mod, and would be happy to explain more in detail.

Thanks!

Leo

Click to read more...

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

Russia to soon introduce electronic call-up papers in crackdown on draft dodgers after parliament vote

Russia is poised to introduce electronic military draft papers for the first time in its history in an effort to make it harder for men to avoid being drafted after the lower house of parliament gave its backing to the legislation on Tuesday.

www.reuters.com

Once the electronic summons is received, under the legislation, citizens who fail to show up at the military enlistment office would be automatically banned from travelling abroad.

Not related to a second mobilization, they say. The Duma is just modernizing the mobilization system because they've got time on their hands.

 

[JonathnTaylorTavares]

I don’t care if Bedard is able to drag us to the SC on his back or not. I just want something exciting to watch every game

 

[Yemeth]

Looks like I picked the wrong week to:

 

[Leonardo87]

 

[Duck Off]

If the Ducks get two points tomorrow night, they will pass San Jose IMO. crazy how impactful those two OTL points over the weekend were. Franchise altering, potentially.

I think people are making a big deal about that because it was 2 OT losses, which I agree sucks. However, I think most here expected a win over Arizona, so if we win that one and lose in regulation to the Avs, which we should have, we're in the exact same spot points wise. We were never going to finish lower than Chicago after their deadline moves. It sucks, but their GM embraced the tank more than ours.

The reality is McDavid hasn’t come close to a cup and he is arguably the best player in the NHL.

Without Makar, McKinnon might still be a 2nd rounder.

Matthews has never even won a series.

I would hate to miss on Bedard, or a top 3, due to meaningless points, but a generational player does not bring a SC lock.

John

I agree, but there's a few things that make it sting more than normal (beyond it's our team):

All 3 of those teams you referenced always have larger budgets than we do, by a wide margin. Meaning drafting is more critical to our success than theirs (not that it isn't important to theirs by any means).

Imagine Edmonton and Toronto without McDavid and Matthews. They're considerably worse off.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

I think people are making a big deal about that because it was 2 OT losses, which I agree sucks. However, I think most here expected a win over Arizona, so if we win that one and lose in regulation to the Avs, which we should have, we're in the exact same spot points wise. We were never going to finish lower than Chicago after their deadline moves. It sucks, but their GM embraced the tank more than ours.




I agree, but there's a few things that make it sting more than normal (beyond it's our team):

All 3 of those teams you referenced always have larger budgets than we do, by a wide margin. Meaning drafting is more critical to our success than theirs (not that it isn't important to theirs by any means).

Imagine Edmonton and Toronto without McDavid and Matthews. They're considerably worse off.

Can't speak to Toronto but Edmonton with Eichel as proposed earlier still has arguably the best 1-2 center punch in the league, and definitely the best 1-2-3. Their task would be the same, to build a depth core.

Tbh I don't think that team is materially different than the current one. Less interesting but not worse.

 

[FlyingV09]

The reality is McDavid hasn’t come close to a cup and he is arguably the best player in the NHL.

Without Makar, McKinnon might still be a 2nd rounder.

Matthews has never even won a series.

I would hate to miss on Bedard, or a top 3, due to meaningless points, but a generational player does not bring a SC lock.

John

McDavid and Matthews still have lots of career left.

My question for you is….how many elite players in the history of the NHL never won a cup? The list is pretty short. Do they always win it with the team that drafted them? No, not necessarily. But they almost always win a cup sometime in their career.

 

[Duck Off]

Can't speak to Toronto but Edmonton with Eichel as proposed earlier still has arguably the best 1-2 center punch in the league, and definitely the best 1-2-3. Their task would be the same, to build a depth core.

Tbh I don't think that team is materially different than the current one. Less interesting but not worse.

I agree that it's still the best 1-2 center punch in the league but disagree they wouldn't be worse. McDavid has earned that team several wins almost entirely on his own. Eichel is a top 5 center in the game, but McDavid is likely going to enter the "goat" conversations before his career is done. I think having McDavid over Eichel makes them much better. I understand what you're getting at though.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

I think having 2 of Mintyukov/Zellweger/Luneau pan out will be more important for the future of the franchise than even landing Bedard but damn do I want a top 3 pick

 

[Ducks DVM]

I agree that it's still the best 1-2 center punch in the league but disagree they wouldn't be worse. McDavid has earned that team several wins almost entirely on his own. Eichel is a top 5 center in the game, but McDavid is likely going to enter the "goat" conversations before his career is done. I think having McDavid over Eichel makes them much better. I understand what you're getting at though.

But not enough important wins though.

Also, there’s still his defense. 151 points, +22 vs 65 points and +25 this year. Yes, I know, it’s a team stat, but he has 82 ES points - he’s been on the ice for 60 goals against this season. 25th worst for forwards. Draisail is 11th with 79. Worst is a tie between Kyrou and Little Johnny at 92, with third being our own lovable scamp Trevor at 87 (up from 72 last year, because he’s no longer being sheltered, meaining this likely IS a reflective of him being “better but not good” at D)

I’d take either of them here.

 

[robbieboy3686]

I’m going out on the limb and saying since the last place team has been able to keep the 1st pick for 2 straight years, that there’s no way in hell it happens 3rd straight year. And also in that time. The second worse team, I believe has dropped each year. I’m going to say the 2nd to last or 3rd to last team picks bedard.

 

[70sSanO]

Ok, but imagine Oilers with Eichel. With McDavid they at least have a shot at Cup.

Avs best player and the most important player is MacKinnon WHO IS #1 OVERALL. : )
Of course landing Makar is also important, but Avs were tanking for MacKinnon not Makar...

They may have tanked for McKinnon, but Makar was the piece. Obviously Kadri having a career year helped.

But you take Makar off this year’s team and they look anything but SC champs.

Granted not having McKinnon does the same, but it does take putting together a complete team, not a player.

John

 

[Terry Yake]

I’m going out on the limb and saying since the last place team has been able to keep the 1st pick for 2 straight years, that there’s no way in hell it happens 3rd straight year. And also in that time. The second worse team, I believe has dropped each year. I’m going to say the 2nd to last or 3rd to last team picks bedard.

i still think it'll be a team like the flyers, wings, canucks, caps, or blues that ends up with him

 

[Ducks DVM]

They may have tanked for McKinnon, but Makar was the piece. Obviously Kadri having a career year helped.

But you take Makar off this year’s team and they look anything but SC champs.

Granted not having McKinnon does the same, but it does take putting together a complete team, not a player.

John

They look like they looked last night…which ain’t gonna get it done next week.

 

[Kalv]

Avs were not tanking for Makar... what?

That's 21 point behind the second worst team... they hillariously fell in the draft lottery (just like it can happen to teams this year). Well, as faith would have it they ended up with the best player anyway, but to say they were tanking for McKinnon and not for Makar... idk, man.

 

[Duck Off]

But not enough important wins though.

Also, there’s still his defense. 151 points, +22 vs 65 points and +25 this year. Yes, I know, it’s a team stat, but he has 82 ES points - he’s been on the ice for 60 goals against this season. 25th worst for forwards. Draisail is 11th with 79. Worst is a tie between Kyrou and Little Johnny at 92, with third being our own lovable scamp Trevor at 87 (up from 72 last year, because he’s no longer being sheltered, meaining this likely IS a reflective of him being “better but not good” at D)

I’d take either of them here.

Not important wins? I’ve watched 3 of their games this year that he’s pretty much won by himself. That’s just what I watched. Those 3 wins are likely going to be the difference in home ice in the playoffs. Last years playoffs, he was dominate. He’s also been supported by arguably the worst management group during most of his career. To be fair, so has Eichel.

I would absolutely take both, but I think there’s a significant difference in the impact of McDavid and Eichel have. That could just be me though.

 

[Ducks DVM]

Avs were not tanking for Makar... what?

View attachment 685820


That's 21 point behind the second worst team... they hillariously fell in the draft lottery (just like it can happen to teams this year). Well, as faith would have it they ended up with the best player anyway, but to say they were tanking for McKinnon and not for Makar... idk, man.

I think it is fair to say they were tanking, but not for Makar

 

[Ducks DVM]

Not important wins? I’ve watched 3 of their games this year that he’s pretty much won by himself. That’s just what I watched. Those 3 wins are likely going to be the difference in home ice in the playoffs. Last years playoffs, he was dominate. He’s also been supported by arguably the worst management group during most of his career. To be fair, so has Eichel.

I would absolutely take both, but I think there’s a significant difference in the impact of McDavid and Eichel have. That could just be me though.

I meant playoffs. I think Drai has been the better playoff guy, by a substantial margin (when healthy).

I feel like Eichel is better at making more of his teammates better, whereas McDavid is better at being a human highlight film, and making other elite players better, if that makes sense.

edit - fun, irrelevant stat - McDavid is 1 point short of having twice as many PPP than the Ducks have PP goals as a team.

 

[pbgoalie]

With our already young core of players, we are in a pretty good position compared to many previous “number 1” picks.
Adding one of these top three (plus the other picks) would give us pretty enviable core of kids.
Adding the correct pieces to that core with trades and FA pickups would make us a pretty dangerous and fun team to watch.

Missing on the top three isn’t a death sentence, but man would it set an incredible path.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

Not sure if having Nesterenko, LaCombe, Helleson and Groulx play is good or bad for our chances. They're all green but probably hungry to prove themselves.

 

[Terry Yake]

Not sure if having Nesterenko, LaCombe, Helleson and Groulx play is good or bad for our chances. They're all green but probably hungry to prove themselves.

better for our chances of losing i'd say. the problem is guys like strome/vatrano/henrique with the way they've all been playing lately, as if the ducks are making a playoff push

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

better for our chances of losing i'd say. the problem is guys like strome/vatrano/henrique with the way they've all been playing lately, as if the ducks are making a playoff push

I don't fault Henrique but yeah Strome and Vatrano need to have a seat

If Pat's really committed to the tank he'll slot Groulx in for Strome as punishment for his abhorrent, distasteful water bottle throw last game

 

[Mr Rogers]

I like how Vatrano's been playing for some time actually after that goal drought he had earlier in the year. Strome is annoying because he's been awful all year, Rico is annoying because his impact upon returning from injury was predictable as hell and is coming when we least need it.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I think having 2 of Mintyukov/Zellweger/Luneau pan out will be more important for the future of the franchise than even landing Bedard but damn do I want a top 3 pick

I don't see a true #1, but I see a lot of potential 2nd liners within our blue line prospects. We do have more than the three mentioned, which can give us balance and talent depth. The three you mentioned are more known for their offense.

LD/RD LaCombe is a two-way D who skates just as fast as Zellweger.
LD/RD Hinds is my fav secret gem. His defensive game mimicks Lindholm! We need more of him.
RD Helleson... his scoring is up and he's been a good pair with MDZ, but still can't say much about his defensive game.
RD Andersson... good defenseman, but made out of glass. If he was healthy for the past two seasons, then he'd be in the NHL halfway through this season.
RD Moore is a shutdown D developing offense at Harvard, finished 2nd in scoring behind Thrun. He's going into his junior season. Moore is like Lacombe, a high school draftee and developing at the NCAA. We need to sign him.
RD Warren is our biggest shutdown guy at 6'5 and 225 lbs. He's a long term project. If he's just a shutdown guy at the NHL level, then that's a significant win for us.

We need defensive d-men in our system to pan out as equally as our OFD's in Minty, Zell, and Luneau.

 

[70sSanO]

Rico is annoying because his impact upon returning from injury was predictable as hell and is coming when we least need it.

If you take a step back, it is hard to fault a UFA veteran who was placed on waivers a couple years back and has played better than Strome, his replacement, for most of the year.

Henrique is probably trying to get back to the Devils, or to another contender, and doing what he can to get there. At $4m or so, he would be a bargain for a lot of teams.

John