Transfer: 2023 Summer Transfer Window - Open Window Edition

[Gecklund]

Old enough to remember Adnan Januzaj's first 9 games.

He was my favorite player for United for a minute. Loved him.

 

[Voight]

ESPN has to do a 30 for 30 on the epic failure thats been PSG the last decade. Especially the Neymar Era.

Old enough to remember Adnan Januzaj's first 9 games.

 

[I Eat Crow]

United's going to feck this up..

I'm fine with Arambat. The player apparently wants the move to United. Fred is gone so it should be a no brainer to get this across the line in a few days.

Still think the Gravenberch report from yesterday is to get Fiorentina to lower their ask to 25 million from the reported 30 million valuation. Silly thing to do over 5 million, especially since the players aren't really similar.

 

[Jussi]

I'm fine with Arambat. The player apparently wants the move to United. Fred is gone so it should be a no brainer to get this across the line in a few days.

Still think the Gravenberch report from yesterday is to get Fiorentina to lower their ask to 25 million from the reported 30 million valuation. Silly thing to do over 5 million, especially since the players aren't really similar.

Need to get rid of Donny or Maguire first. Doesn't look like anything is happening those fronts.



So basically United are skint.

 

[Satan]

He was my favorite player for United for a minute. Loved him.

world class diver

 

[bleedblue1223]

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Would prefer Amrabat over McTom as the Casemiro backup. I'm shocked, shocked I tell you that not taking West Ham's offer of 30 for McTom blew up in their face.

 

[cgf]

nvm, the joke doesn't work.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Would prefer Amrabat over McTom as the Casemiro backup. I'm shocked, shocked I tell you that not taking West Ham's offer of 30 for McTom blew up in their face.

I wouldn't sell McTominay if Amrabat isn't coming. But yeah, an indirect straight across swap would've been an upgrade.

I'm more upset with not getting Todibo because of no money from a Maguire transfer than not getting Amrabat because of no money for McTominay, however.

 

[cgf]

I think you take what you read and then fill in the gaps with your own biases. I think everyone has a tendency to do that, but it's important to be aware of that. Paul Joyce is a respected journalist, but he's still not in those meetings or privy to everything going on behind closed doors. I say that because it's very easy to craft narratives on the back of very limited information.

I think there's a few obvious problems for Liverpool:
- Inability to outspend domestic competition
- Instability at the DoF position
- Necessity to rebuild the squad on the fly

Given the tendency of Liverpool's competition to spend like there's an infinite amount of funding available, it's a tricky situation. It'd require an extraordinary commitment to spending to beat them for players, and you'd need to put an extraordinary amount of trust in a DoF who will probably be back in his Black Forest mansion soon enough (and knows it). Add to that it's widely known in the industry that you need to make impact signings, in other words the biggest leverage a customer has - the ability to walk away - is greatly reduced. The football industry is of course a shark tank and everyone knows these things about Liverpool - in other words, it's a perfect scenario for Liverpool to be taken advantage of by dodgy player agents and greedy club owners.

The only way to avoid this scenario would have been to have a better transfer market performance over the last 3-4 seasons. But perhaps there is also a deeper truth here that Liverpool can't expect to be perennially good in a league where some teams have significantly deeper pockets and aren't afraid to reach into them time and time again. So maybe Liverpool simply have completed a cycle and the window is shutting, and there's not much to be done about it.

There's some truth to what you're saying about clubs punching above their financial weight having a difficult challenge to continue beating the odds just to stay in the mix.

But when random internet schmucks like us can see the problem coming...like we have over these past 3-4 summers where Liverpool have not done enough to refresh their squad or prepare for the future...it's fair to lay the blame at the sport director's feet for the current situation.

This was avoidable, but instead of buying a couple guys here and a couple there along the way, they pinched their pennies while promising their fans Jude, and ended up needing to rejuvenate half the squad all at once while watching Bellingham go to Real instead.

 

[les Habs]

Two interesting rumors concerning Madrid:

-They’re being linked with Laporte.
-I was literally thinking this yesterday and did not post it, but they are also linked with…. Lukaku.

 

[Savant]

Fee that doesn't match the player's CV? What fee do you think matches it?

£30M for a guy with 600 mins of first team football is ridiculous. The guy doesn’t even have a nailed on position at this point.

What JF said

But yeah I just think it’s weird you have two “trust me I’m not” PIF clubs selling to each other at an inflated price. Not that it’s the be all/end all but TM has Hall at 10m Euros; which I think is certainly closer to his fair value than 30m

And if you are looking at Newcastle, they basically have Elliott Anderson in house who they LOVE who is a better version of Hall, and is a bit jammed up himself. So yeah I think it’s a little weird

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

There's some truth to what you're saying about clubs punching above their financial weight having a difficult challenge to continue beating the odds just to stay in the mix.

But when random internet schmucks like us can see the problem coming...like we have over these past 3-4 summers where Liverpool have not done enough to refresh their squad or prepare for the future...it's fair to lay the blame at the sport director's feet for the current situation.

This was avoidable, but instead of buying a couple guys here and a couple there along the way, they pinched their pennies while promising their fans Jude, and ended up needing to rejuvenate half the squad all at once while watching Bellingham go to Real instead.

Well I acknowledged that, but that choice 'do we hold out for the big name or do we instead spread it out and spend on a number of guys over time' is one you need to make when your budget doesn't allow you to simply do both. Liverpool have spending power, but not the kind where Klopp can write down a few names and knows he'll get 80% of them every window. That's a distinction of note.

And let's not forget Liverpool built its great team under Klopp with retreads and second tier acquisitions. They didn't go out and bought the hottest name on the market, because quite frankly they could never do that. Let's not forget the wilderness that club was in for a long time.

 

[bluesfan94]

What JF said

But yeah I just think it’s weird you have two “trust me I’m not” PIF clubs selling to each other at an inflated price.

And if you are looking at Newcastle, they basically have Elliott Anderson in house who they LOVE who is a better version of Hall, and is a bit jammed up himself. So yeah I think it’s a little weird

Chelsea is a trust me I'm not PIF club?

Okay

 

[Spring in Fialta]

9 games 55 millions hahahahaa

Chelsea fans are going crazy this summer

 

[Savant]

Chelsea is a trust me I'm not PIF club?

Okay

Clearlake

 

[bluesfan94]

They didn't go out and bought the hottest name on the market, because quite frankly they could never do that. Let's not forget the wilderness that club was in for a long time.

They spent a record fee on Van Dijk and Alisson.

 

[Savant]

Hmmm

Dodgers spend big on international players

The rules of the new international signing period, which began Thursday, left the Dodgers with a choice: They could stay under their bonus-pool limit of about $2 million and keep their future options open, or they could blow past it with a flurry of signings this year.

www.latimes.com

Probably just a coincidence

 

[bluesfan94]

Clearlake

Clearlake isn't the PIF. This has been explained ad nauseum. PIF having money in a large PE Fund doesn't mean anything. They probably have money in Redbird Capital, too. Ah no, RedBird is in bed with City Football Group: #8 How Clubs are Connected by Minority Investors

 

[Savant]

Clearlake isn't the PIF. This has been explained ad nauseum. PIF having money in a large PE Fund doesn't mean anything. They probably have money in Redbird Capital, too.

Yes Chelsea told everybody that there is no relationship.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

They spent a record fee on Van Dijk and Alisson.

They spent a lot, and as I said, they can spend a lot in selected scenarios, but they do need to select them. It's a different playbook than just outbidding everyone on every target.

 

[bluesfan94]

Yes Chelsea told everybody that there is no relationship.

This is how private equity funds work. I know you probably have no experience with them, but I do this shit on a daily basis. PIF is almost certainly an LP in Clearlake and has no control whatsoever. This stuff is normal. Same as RedBird Capital being in bed with the City Football Group while owning AC Milan, Toulouse, and FSG. Meanwhile Arctos owns Atalanta and is in bed with the owners of Augsburg and Crystal Palace. Shit, Silver Lake manages PIF funds and owns part of City, too.

In other words, RedBird Capital, an investor in FSG, the owners of Liverpool, are in bed with the owners of City, some of whom are backed by PIF. But I'm sure Liverpool says there is no relationship.

This is the private equity world at the top.

They spent a lot, and as I said, they can spend a lot in selected scenarios, but they do need to select them. It's a different playbook than just outbidding everyone on every target.

Sure, but they went out and got the hottest CB and GK names and spent to do it. Saying they didn't is rewriting history.

 

[cgf]

So, fans in Germany don't care that 1 teams has won 11 straight titles and parity doesn't exist? And 20 titles over the past 27 seasons. I mean, come on...

Not really. I mean Bayern and Dortmund fans care. But who cares what those whores think? Other fans care a lot more about being able to attend each match, the game-day experience, and how their club does, than who lifts the salad bowl.

The main thing is still what I wrote above, the game-day experience of supporting your community, but I did want to expand on this a little more cause I'm procrastinating until the rain clears up, but what big league actually has parity?

Is City slipping up once in 6 years while the same 6 teams claim the CL spots every year...until a new club gets bought by a foreign state or billionaire...really all that different than Bayern only almost-slipping-up while half the league has finished in a CL spot?

In either league the only fans with title expectations are the fans who know they're going to win unless something crazy happens (Bayern & City) and the fans of the also rans who are either delusional enough to think they can win without something crazy happening (Dortmund & Arsenal), or who are praying that something crazy happens (Leipzig & Newcastle/ManU).

The rest of us are just hoping we can be proud of our clubs at the end of the day. And at least as a BuLi fan I can have some realistic hopes for a CL spot while supporting a club that prioritizes the fanbase and what we stand for over profits...without my annual membership dues and ticket prices being expenses that I have to think about budgeting for.


Plus we've seen historic giants get relegated from the BuLi because they couldn't just throw money at their problems until they got their s*** together, like ManU has. And I don't just mean clubs that were relevant when our grandparents were young. Schalke, HSV, Hertha, Hannover, Köln, are still massive clubs and/or funded by a wealthy benefactor.

So Bayern haven't dominated by default, they've dominated because Pep built an absolute monster on the back of a treble-winning side; that they were able to shrewdly maintain until Kahn & Brazzo did their best to f*** everything up. And the moment they started f***ing around again their run almost ended.

...although we failed to capitalize on that opportunity because we lost our focus for a few weeks when clinching a CL spot started to become a reality.

 

[cgf]

Well I acknowledged that, but that choice 'do we hold out for the big name or do we instead spread it out and spend on a number of guys over time' is one you need to make when your budget doesn't allow you to simply do both. Liverpool have spending power, but not the kind where Klopp can write down a few names and knows he'll get 80% of them every window. That's a distinction of note.

And let's not forget Liverpool built its great team under Klopp with retreads and second tier acquisitions. They didn't go out and bought the hottest name on the market, because quite frankly they could never do that. Let's not forget the wilderness that club was in for a long time.

Failing to recognizing their financial standing is on them. They should've known that they'd be outspent if they shot for the top of the pile. That's not how they put most of their trophy winning team together and it was never going to be how they could maintain that level.

They needed to be realistic about their muscle on the transfer front and continue buying shrewdly; spreading acquisitions out over time so that fresh blood could be integrated without being rushed or the team stagnating.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The main thing is still what I wrote above, the game-day experience of supporting your community, but I did want to expand on this a little more cause I'm procrastinating until the rain clears up, but what big league actually has parity?

Is City slipping up once in 6 years while the same 6 teams claim the CL spots every year...until a new club gets bought by a foreign state or billionaire...really all that different than Bayern only almost-slipping-up while half the league has finished in a CL spot?

In either league the only fans with title expectations are the fans who know they're going to win unless something crazy happens (Bayern & City) and the fans of the also rans who are either delusional enough to think they can win without something crazy happening, or who are praying that something crazy happens (Dortmund/Leipzig & Arsenal/Newcastle).

The rest of us are just hoping we can be proud of our clubs at the end of the day. And at least as a BuLi fan I can have some realistic hopes for a CL spot while supporting a club that prioritizes the fanbase and what we stand for over profits...without my annual membership dues and ticket prices being expenses that I have to think about budgeting for.


Plus we've seen historic giants get relegated from the BuLi because they couldn't just throw money at their problems until they got their s*** together, like ManU has. And I don't just mean clubs that were relevant when our grandparents were young. Schalke, HSV, Hertha, Hannover, Köln, are still massive clubs and/or funded by a wealthy benefactor.

So Bayern haven't dominated by default, they've dominated because Pep built an absolute monster on the back of a treble-winning side; that they were able to shrewdly maintain until Kahn & Brazzo did their best to f*** everything up. And the moment they started f***ing around again their run almost ended.

...although we failed to capitalize on that opportunity because we lost our focus for a few weeks when clinching a CL spot started to become a reality.

My critque of lack of parity in Bundesliga is not isolated to them, most leagues have massive issues with this, EPL as well. City's little run here is no way comparable to what happens in Spain, Germany, Italy, or France though, I'll just stick to the bigger leagues. Before City's run, there was a time when United and Chelsea were going back and forth, and before that United and Arsenal. Liverpool and Leicester have also won a title in that period.

The sport has a massive money/spending inequality issue, and it's been like that for awhile. I much prefer the NA system, where everyone has a more or less equal opportunity, and it's up to the club to perform. It's impossible to really implement any of that, but that doesn't mean that parity isn't an issue. And unless the entire league gets brought up a level like the EPL has, it's not like the leagues are incentivized to have parity, since on some level, they want the powers at the top to be successful in Champions League, as opposed to bringing those few teams down to make their domestic league more competitive and fair.

In Euro soccer today, if you are a club without money, you have an extremely small chance of ever winning, and essentially 0 chance of sustaining success over multiple seasons. It's like college football over here in the States. I'll always cheer and enjoy my team, but there's a massive difference between being an Alabama fan and expecting championships routinely and being a Mizzou fan, where that's never going to realistically happen, the best is hoping to get to a conference championship game.