OT: 2023 Soccer and Vancouver Whitecaps Thread

[Bubbles]

Really shows how deluded some fans were.

Completely outclassed this game and the worst CONCACAF team by a wide margin thus far in this tournament. Midfield is below average and we probably have the worst backs out of all particpating countries.

Objective was to score a goal. Mission done. Maybe win a game in 2026.

Our country still has a very long way to go until they can become a credible soccer nation.

Those fans would be the casuals.

For me, getting into the WC was the sundae. Getting a goal was the sprinkles, and a win/draw would have been the cherry. So we got the sundae and sprinkles, which was more than enough. It's only the casuals and the media who think that Canada could punch above their weight.

Mexico always get hammered by the Europeans and S. Americans, and they're arguably the best CONCACAF team. And FIFA rankings are absolutely useless in any sense.

My key observation is that Canada's midfielders left big gaps between them and our back line, which Belgium exploited many times. Herdman's attack mentality works in CONCACAF but when they face disciplined, counter attacking teams, they have no answer.

 

[VanJack]

If you're an optimist then a glimpse into the future of Canadian men's soccer might have played out in Spain this same weekend--where a couple of young tennis stars born and bred in Canada helped this country win its first Davis Cup.

It bears repeating that countries like Belgium, Croatia, Switzerland and Costa Rica have populations of 11 million or less. That makes Canada more than three times as large. So it all comes down to player development.

And with leagues like MLS and the CPL for young players coming up, it's hard not to see this country getting a lot better in the coming years.

 

[Frostage]

If you're an optimist then a glimpse into the future of Canadian men's soccer might have played out in Spain this same weekend--where a couple of young tennis stars born and bred in Canada helped this country win its first Davis Cup.

It bears repeating that countries like Belgium, Croatia, Switzerland and Costa Rica have populations of 11 million or less. That makes Canada more than three times as large. So it all comes down to player development.

And with leagues like MLS and the CPL for young players coming up, it's hard not to see this country getting a lot better in the coming years.

I think culture is more important than population.

Canada is great at hockey but not a large population. New Zealand is a dominant rugby country, about 5 million people. Conversely China is giant 1.4 billion and not very good at soccer.

I do agree with you and think player development could be improved greatly here. I hope the MLS and CPL academies help in that regard and that CSA is able to build on the success here.

Fingers crossed for a good final game against Morocco.

 

[Hit the post]

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

I think culture is more important than population.

Canada is great at hockey but not a large population. New Zealand is a dominant rugby country, about 5 million people. Conversely China is giant 1.4 billion and not very good at soccer.

I do agree with you and think player development could be improved greatly here. I hope the MLS and CPL academies help in that regard and that CSA is able to build on the success here.

Fingers crossed for a good final game against Morocco.

Need to really start development at age 5 and establish a curriculum. It's pretty much longball football until U14.

 

[Hit the post]

Need to really start development at age 5 and establish a curriculum. It's pretty much longball football until U14.

And it's VERY budget friendly compared to some other sports.

 

[God]

Ronaldo celebrating that goal like he scored it is maybe peak Ronaldo behaviour. Barely touched his hair.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Herdman looked like a clown before, during and after the game.

Also, I understand celebrating Canada scored, but Jesus. After the first 15 minutes, they got their ass handed to them. Maybe discuss that.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

And it's VERY budget friendly customer compared to some other sports.

Budget friendly for sure. However there's an incredible amount of bureaucracy that limits the ability to set up any rec leagues here. An organizer needs to book a field, get insurance, hire sufficient staff or get volunteers, etc...which really ups the costs considerably. It's too much of a hassle for the schools to do, since they are already short-staffed and dealing with teachers or volunteers that don't want to work after hours. Additionally, kid participation in sports is tanking right now as parents are getting increasingly lazy.

 

[hookshott]

It was pretty obvious going into the tournament that they needed a result against Belgium because they would pose no threat to Croatia.

The world rankings nonsense is all bullshit. Belgium sucks.

The jubilation of the first goal was an unreal experience but you knew that we didn't have the horses to nurse a lead against that level opposition. Our best hope was pinching a quick second before they responded, and then bringing on Piette to stop their midfield penetration but that was always going to be a miracle.

Kind of sucks, because I was excited to see the Morocco - Canada fixture if there was more riding on it. Also getting a win in the first game probably shifts Herdman's approach to be more damage limitation for goal differential tiebreakers. Maybe we play with a more structured setup and don't get beat 4-1. Who knows.

I don't think this veteran Croatia team needed any extra motivation. Herdman saying what he said to the media in the heat of the moment wasn't great, but the bigger problem was that he didn't select the order of penalty kickers before the tournament. Letting players deliberate has never been a good idea. He also didn't get things right in the game today either, but they were in a tough spot and I'm not sure we should be over-analyzing this game as a reflection of Herdman. At all.

Agreed about having already determined who would take the penalty kick before the game begins. Poor coaching to allow the players to decide at that critical moment....that is not good preparation which is an integral part of coaching. I also hope the team had practiced penalty kicks (I get the feeling they did not if they just allowed the decision to be made at the time). Also not good coaching......it is a certainly a practicable skill much like a free throw is in basketball. Just because players take shots at a goal or a basket all the time, does not mean they are ready for the open shot presented in the penalty kick/free throw situation.....it needs to be practiced....I have seen it described as "purposeful practice".

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Agreed about having already determined who would take the penalty kick before the game begins. Poor coaching to allow the players to decide at that critical moment....that is not good preparation which is an integral part of coaching. I also hope the team had practiced penalty kicks (I get the feeling they did not if they just allowed the decision to be made at the time). Also not good coaching......it is a certainly a practicable skill much like a free throw is in basketball. Just because players take shots at a goal or a basket all the time, does not mean they are ready for the open shot presented in the penalty kick/free throw situation.....it needs to be practiced....I have seen it described as "purposeful practice".

It completely depends on how much time a team has to practice. If they are at there own training facility and have unlimited time to practice, then yes penalties should be worked on as much as possible. But if a team has limited practice time and especially when for a lot of the time the players play for different teams then there are so many other things to prioritize than penalties that don't happen every game.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Frankly I think we are going to end up with 0 points. My expectations are firmly on seeing this squad score and keep up with these world class squads.

Morocco has Hakimi and Mazraoui on wings that will feast on the weak Canadian CB's. They are certainly having a golden generation and are better all around than Canada.

Croatia continues to be world class with the ageless Modric owning the midfield. Their back end will be tough to crack.

Belgium is a team that could come out and win the entire thing or completely crash out. They have been horribly inconsistent. They should easily beat Canada if they show up and want to win.

0 points it is.

We have shown we cannot keep up with the worlds best teams. Frankly, not sure what can be done between now and 2026 because we literally need an entire backline and midfield to at least have a prayer or escaping any groups.

We got a goal at least but this went way worse than expected.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

0 points it is.

We have shown we cannot keep up with the worlds best teams. Frankly, not sure what can be done between now and 2026 because we literally need an entire backline and midfield to at least have a prayer or escaping any groups.

We got a goal at least but this went way worse than expected.

It's gone exactly as expected. It was just a number of people getting caught up in the fact they won the CONCACAF region in a year when both Mexico and the US were not up to their best.

They've played boldly and hopefully it's a huge learning experience to take into 2026.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

It's gone exactly as expected. It was just a number of people getting caught up in the fact they won the CONCACAF region in a year when both Mexico and the US were not up to their best.

They've played boldly and hopefully it's a huge learning experience to take into 2026.

I knew they were still the 3rd best CONCACAF team despite the standings. We managed to beat up the lower echelon of CONCACAF teams while barely getting results against Costa Rica and Mexico in a frigid environment.

There were some signs that this group was not as good as the CONCACAF record suggested. Got completely outclassed by Uruguay in September and had several not-so impressive results against Bahrain, Japan and Panama.

Still, I expected better individual performances. Your best players in David and Davies really had meh tournaments. David was incredibly disappointing to watch considering the quality he's been showing at the club level.

Our midfield really blows without Eustaquio. Hopefully Kone continues to progress because Kaye and Osorio are just not viable options at this level. We at least need 2-3 more options there.

Our backline just outright sucks. You are going nowhere as a football nation when you have an entire backline that cannot defend and anticipate developing attacks. I have a feeling Celtic may not fancy Alistair Johnston anymore....

Milan Borjan was below average.

The hope is that we get a cast of new players to come forth in 2-3 years so we have a chance of at least getting a result in the group stage in 2026. The draw SHOULD be more favorable due to the pot structure and potential higher rankings but there's major work to be done between now and then.

 

[Jyrki]

At least we aren't Belgians. Imagine having lofty expectations and scoring less goals than we did...

 

[Jyrki21]

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Germans out. Beautiful.

 

[Javaman]

Well, let's hope this holds true in 2026.

 

[M2Beezy]

Lionel Messi

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Lionel Messi

Brock Messi.

 

[Bubbles]

At least we aren't Belgians. Imagine having lofty expectations and scoring less goals than we did...

Their so called "golden generation" accomplished nothing. It may be sometime before they get back to true contender status.

Germans out. Beautiful.

One thing about Germans, they'll always come back.

This was the last gasp for the remnants of the 2014 squad. It's time for the new generation to take over the national team. But I don't see too many young stars in their squad that match the quality of the past gen.

 

[Bubbles]

Credit to the Croatia keeper, but those were some terrible penalties by Japan. No pace, not anywhere near the corners.

 

[Bubbles]

Bono Edges Spain.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Bono Edges Spain.

Spain channeled their inner England.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Their so called "golden generation" accomplished nothing. It may be sometime before they get back to true contender status.



One thing about Germans, they'll always come back.

This was the last gasp for the remnants of the 2014 squad. It's time for the new generation to take over the national team. But I don't see too many young stars in their squad that match the quality of the past gen.

Musiala the only legit star out of the young ones.