HF Habs: 2023 Roster, Schedule & Standings Thread

[MarkovsKnee]

I don't think the bottom is in play this year given how bad a handful of other teams are. We are tanking by default with glaring holes in our lineup. I don't believe any team tries to tank early on regardless. Usually by game 20 the losers stop trying as hard.

I mean Chicago & Arizona are definitely tanking on purpose. We're doing it because a quarter of the team left via FA in 2021, and another quarter were so banged up they couldn't or could barely continue playing (Price, Weber, Edmundson & Byron).

 

[Rapala]

I mean Chicago & Arizona are definitely tanking on purpose. We're doing it because a quarter of the team left via FA in 2021, and another quarter were so banged up they couldn't or could barely continue playing (Price, Weber, Edmundson & Byron).

Both Markets are well versed at it.

 

[Rapala]

How about players who were young and active in a year that started with 2***?

How about Buffalo, Arizona, Edmonton? How about Ottawa constantly spinning its wheels? How about Toronto that doesn't know how to win despite and incredible amount of talent?

Do you make things up to justify tanking? Is there any evidence that losing games means winning more games later?

First of all most fans would give an eye tooth to have the talent Toronto has. They would also die to have a McDavid Draisaitl combo to watch every home game. The failures you mention fall squarely on a front office unable to surround the assets they do have because of poor cap management or vision.

The strategy itself has been proven more than once resulting in multi Cups, we've had this argument ad naseum. It boils down to how much faith you put into your organization's ability to lose/to win. I like many others foresaw a minimum two years of hardship to build a proper foundation for the future. Last year was never supposed to be a tank but circumstances and coaching made it so. The players all realized early on that we were dead in the water and went throught he motions until MSL showed up and gave them a reason to get back to work. This year is all about development at all levels not points. So it isn't a tank per se but our intentions are far closer to a tank than they ever were at the outset of last season. Chill out and look for decent consistent hockey plays growth and maturity from the kids instead of the standings.

 

[Perratrooper]

You retain salary on an expiring contract, not on one that has years to go. When you retain salary, it's for the duration of the contract and you don't want to be tied up for years like in Anderson's case. Since you only have 3 retainers, tying you up for a long time isn't good business.

I see retaining salary on Dadonov, Drouin and Monahan this year, because we'll be free at the end of the season. Hoffman can wait for next year.

I understand that retaining on expiring contracts is typically the norm, but we’ve seen instances in recent years where retention was used on longer term contracts (OEL, Burns, M. Murray and Lucic). Now I’m not saying that isn’t more likely that they use their retention slots on the players you mentioned, but there’s also the potential that the Habs need to get out of a contract such as Gallagher or Anderson in future years.

I get not being able/wanting to put value to Anderson retained, but there are examples of the exact scenario

 

[JC Superstar]

I understand that retaining on expiring contracts is typically the norm, but we’ve seen instances in recent years where retention was used on longer term contracts (OEL, Burns, M. Murray and Lucic). Now I’m not saying that isn’t more likely that they use their retention slots on the players you mentioned, but there’s also the potential that the Habs need to get out of a contract such as Gallagher or Anderson in future years.

I get not being able/wanting to put value to Anderson retained, but there are examples of the exact scenario

I don't think the Habs are up against a wall enough to do so.

 

[JC Superstar]

I mean Chicago & Arizona are definitely tanking on purpose. We're doing it because a quarter of the team left via FA in 2021, and another quarter were so banged up they couldn't or could barely continue playing (Price, Weber, Edmundson & Byron).

They and San Jose might have worst teams but they are up against an easier division, which gives the Habs an edge.

 

[HabzSauce]

Tankists sometimes lose the forest for the trees... it's not enjoyable to watch a crappy team play crap hockey. People lose interest, players who are fighting for contracts lose interest or worse get mad. Young players, especially defencemen and goalie, lose confidence. It's just awful all around. And worst of all: there's always the risk of turning into Deadmonton and Buffalose.

And as we've seen, there is hardly an immediate reward for a full year's worth of losing and tanking anyway. There's no guarantee that even the 1OA leads to any positive impact to the bottom line (w%/pt%/playoff round wins) in the foreseeable future. It could be a "bad draft year" , it could be a player that'll take a few years to get going (and by that point you have other holes to fill and have a net gain of 0), it could be a litany of excuses for why rebuilds get derailed.

I can't imagine MSL will be happy if the Habs' pt% is 0.125 or the win% is 0.00... I can't imagine he would retain his chippy, happy, positive, confidence self if he goes through a brutal 82 game marathon...

I think Tanking can be done for a maximum of 2 seasons. Any more leads to negative outcomes. Be careful what you wish for.

If we can land a top 5 pick this year I think we will be set for a long time. So I am very on board for one more year of suck, (since we sill suck anyways).

Might not be too miserable either under MSL. I'm sure the kids love being able to be creative and take chances with little repercussion.

 

[Tyson]

Based on the lines today it seems training camp is still ongoing

 

[SlafySZN]

Based on the lines today it seems training camp is still ongoing

I think it’s the most logical lines to be honest. Other than the 4th line.

 

[morhilane]

I think it’s the most logical lines to be honest. Other than the 4th line.

Who did you want on the 4th? Pezz and Dadonov were alternating and once Armia is back, he probably takes that spot. Dadonov is also the only member of the Triplets who can play on a 4th line. As a bonus, he doesn't care where he plays, so he won't pout.

 

[Agalloch]

Drouin, Dadonov and Hoffman should rotate in the lineup and the best plays.

I would play Pezzetta wednesday.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

How about players who were young and active in a year that started with 2***?

How about Buffalo, Arizona, Edmonton? How about Ottawa constantly spinning its wheels? How about Toronto that doesn't know how to win despite and incredible amount of talent?

Do you make things up to justify tanking? Is there any evidence that losing games means winning more games later?

Another irrelevant post. You are listing teams with incompetent management/owners. Pittsburgh had no problem, Chicago had no problem. Tampa had no problem. And it didn't hurt most of their players to tank for 2-3 years. The key factor is very competent management. HuGo is definitely that.

 

[SwiftyHab]

Slaf and Dach are well supported with very responsible vets. That’ll be good for both of them

 

[BaseballCoach]

I think it’s the most logical lines to be honest. Other than the 4th line.

Not for me.

I would do these:

Monahan-Suzuki-Caufield
Hoffman-Dvorak-Gallagher
Slafkovsky-Dach-Anderson
Pitlick-Evans-Dadonov or Pezzetta
extras: Drouin, Pezzetta or Dadonov

 

[SlafySZN]

Not for me.

I would do these:

Monahan-Suzuki-Caufield
Hoffman-Dvorak-Gallagher
Slafkovsky-Dach-Anderson
Pitlick-Evans-Dadonov or Pezzetta
extras: Drouin, Pezzetta or Dadonov

With Slaf playing with Dvorak and Gallagher on the 3rd line it helps him start in the NHL with less pressure with 2 vets (and let Dach play himself with a vet instead of a rookie)

if he adjust and is adapting great and he stay with the team longer or for the whole year you can move him on the 2nd line when you feel he is ready and put hoffman on the 3rd so the 2nd line could be Slaf-Dach-Monahan.

Lines will obviously change if they need to but i hope the guys could develop some chemistry instead of bouncing them around.

 

[Kojo]

Not for me.

I would do these:

Monahan-Suzuki-Caufield
Hoffman-Dvorak-Gallagher
Slafkovsky-Dach-Anderson
Pitlick-Evans-Dadonov or Pezzetta
extras: Drouin, Pezzetta or Dadonov

Slaf-Dach-Anderson will happen don't you worry.

 

[BaseballCoach]

With Slaf playing with Dvorak and Gallagher on the 3rd line it helps him start in the NHL with less pressure with 2 vets (and let Dach play himself with a vet instead of a rookie)

if he adjust and is adapting great and he stay with the team longer or for the whole year you can move him on the 2nd line when you feel he is ready and put hoffman on the 3rd so the 2nd line could be Slaf-Dach-Monahan.

Lines will obviously change if they need to but i hope the guys could develop some chemistry instead of bouncing them around.

Until Tiny Caufield is on his right side, I don<t want the lines cemented. I'm not a tanker.

Slaf-Dach-Anderson will happen don't you worry.

Which is great because then they will probably put a LW with Suzy and Gole

 

[CHfan1]

Until Tiny Caufield is on his right side, I don<t want the lines cemented. I'm not a tanker.


Which is great because then they will probably put a LW with Suzy and Gole

Caufield had great production playing his off-wing last season under MSL (17 even strength goals, 25 even strength points in 37 games), why the push to put him back on right wing? As a note only 3 players in the entire league had more even strength goals in that time span (Feb.10 till end of last season).

 

[BaseballCoach]

Caufield had great production playing his off-wing last season under MSL (17 even strength goals, 25 even strength points in 37 games), why the push to put him back on right wing? As a note only 3 players in the entire league had more even strength goals in that time span (Feb.10 till end of last season).

He played both wings last year under MSL. At first, it was Anderson on his off-wing.

But the problem is, both last year, and in exhibitions this year, that Caufield gets bottled up in his own zone when on his backhand trying to fight to get the puck out of his zone. Last year, he was a big minus player on his off-wing. He is small and not in board battles. Give him a break.

Now they can put Byron on LTIR and get the full relief.

But they could have had more space had they switched out Guhle and Harris for Mesar and Barron, for one day.

 

[SlafySZN]

He played both wings last year under MSL. At first, it was Anderson on his off-wing.

But the problem is, both last year, and in exhibitions this year, that Caufield gets bottled up in his own zone when on his backhand trying to fight to get the puck out of his zone. Last year, he was a big minus player on his off-wing. He is small and not in board battles. Give him a break.

He played 31 out of 37 games under MSL on the left. And his games on the right was at the very start when MSL was just arriving.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Mailloux & Heineman both went on SOIR.

In fact, Montreal did everything I said except keep Slafkovsky & put Byron on IR instead of roster. I wasn't sure they had the money for that. I didn't bother to calculate if they did.

Price's $10.5m LTIR is now spent. We used $10.194m of it. We don't get to use that last $400,000.

SOIR is only available to players on 2 way contracts, which ELCs are. We'll get the full benefit of their NHL salaries to give us breathing room to recall players, use IR for other players, etc.

Players on IR still count against the cap, which is why teams are expected to save $1m-$2m for that eventuality. Since a lot of teams have not done that this year, you're going to see a lot of games with reduced in-game rosters & emergency recalls.

Mailloux & Heineman give us $1.795m in salary relief immediately. Otherwise, we'd be in emergency conditions too.

Teams have to apply to NHL for SOIR benefits.

Now, Canadiens can choose to keep Byron on IR, and just use the SOIR pool until both Mailloux and Heineman are healthy and the pool can't be used anymore; in which case Byron goes to LTIR.

Or, put Byron on LTIR tomorrow & bring in a $2m-$2.25m D as replacement leaving +$1m for IR after we lose SOIR (cause both Mailloux & Heineman are healthy).

It gives Montreal options for roster movement since it opens up cap space.

We don't use the last $306,000. I get it. That number could have been reduced to $134,000 had we switched out Barron and Mesar for Guhle and Harris for one day.

What I don't get is what the SOIR does for us when neither Heineman nor Mailloux played any games last year so their NHL hits don't count anyway.

He played 31 out of 37 games under MSL on the left. And his games on the right was at the very start when MSL was just arriving.

I'm pretty sure that MSL is not an egotisticial stubbornhead like Julien and Ducharme. If he is open-minded, he will move Cole back eventually as the goals against pile up.

 

[CHfan1]

He played both wings last year under MSL. At first, it was Anderson on his off-wing.

But the problem is, both last year, and in exhibitions this year, that Caufield gets bottled up in his own zone when on his backhand trying to fight to get the puck out of his zone. Last year, he was a big minus player on his off-wing. He is small and not in board battles. Give him a break.


But they could have had more space had they switched out Guhle and Harris for Mesar and Barron, for one day.

He didn’t play a lot on his right wing under MSL. The lines he was most on last season was with Suzuki and Anderson or Suzuki and Hoffman (under MSL). In both cases Caufield played left wing. MSL obviously likes him there and I expect that won’t change.

Again he had a ton of production on the left wing when MSL took over. It’s the best place for him right now, especially offensively, with his shot.

As far as +/- (which is very subjective) goes he was -9 in 37 games under MSL and -15 in 30 games under Ducharme (where he played on the right wing). Although with Ducharme he was playing farther down in the lineup.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

We don't use the last $306,000. I get it. That number could have been reduced to $134,000 had we switched out Barron and Mesar for Guhle and Harris for one day.

What I don't get is what the SOIR does for us when neither Heineman nor Mailloux played any games last year so their NHL hits don't count anyway.


I'm pretty sure that MSL is not an egotisticial stubbornhead like Julien and Ducharme. If he is open-minded, he will move Cole back eventually as the goals against pile up.

They're considered part of the roster while on SOIR, so they're NHL salaries count against the cap. It's just a different type of LTIR for those on two-way contracts. Teams don't reassign injured players to lower levels til their healthy, and they don't want teams to reassign injured players earlier than they should due to cap complications. In order to get NHL medical benefits, they need to be in NHL, so, they're on the roster.

It's only for players who are on two-way contracts and who were injured in NHL camp (Heineman), or injured prior to NHL camp start (Mailloux).

It's essentially LTIR for players who are non-NHL players, but we can use the space they create for injury replacement.

 

[BaseballCoach]

They're considered part of the roster while on SOIR, so they're NHL salaries count against the cap. It's just a different type of LTIR for those on two-way contracts. Teams don't reassign injured players to lower levels til their healthy, and they don't want teams to reassign injured players earlier than they should due to cap complications. In order to get NHL medical benefits, they need to be in NHL, so, they're on the roster.

It's only for players who are on two-way contracts and who were injured in NHL camp (Heineman), or injured prior to NHL camp start (Mailloux).

It's essentially LTIR for players who are non-NHL players, but we can use the space they create for injury replacement.

But when I added up all the salaries, their two totalling $1,795,000 were not in the Cap Friendly total of $92,694,166. So I don't get it.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

But when I added up all the salaries, their two totalling $1,795,000 were not in the Cap Friendly total of $92,694,166. So I don't get it.

SOIR is confusing as shit & not explained at all in the CBA. Capfriendly doesn't go into it too much either. But because they did not play an NHL game last year, and are on two-way contracts, their cap hits are ignored. They're not counted against the cap at all. Technically, we get full cap relief for them.

SOIR has different calculations than LTIR, and it changes once the season starts, but no one knows what they are, except for NHL.