HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

[Nedved]

Montembeault always had an intriguing blend of size and athleticism. Sometimes it takes goalies longer to put it all together, but that seemed to happen this year. Not saying he’s a sure fire elite #1, but he’s at least earned the right to be part of a tandem with Allen for next year.

I would love to see him with 55 to 60 games next year. He started to become a consistent goalie and rarely had an "off" game. It would be nice to know what we have in him, or if it was a fluky year.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I disagree. The only time his balance has improved was after his rookie season. He paid for a skating coach himself, and came back looking faster and with better balance. Then he spent the next couple years somehow not getting better with us, playing in silly COVID playoffs and ultimately being scratched.

Instead, he could have been dominating a lower level while working on his skating throughout the year, working with the Finnish national team, having success with them. Then he could have dominated the AHL while working with a skating coach (which we didn't have until recently). Then he could have made the NHL as a smarter, stronger, faster KK.

Why doesn't it sound reasonable to you that this would produce a better result than doing absolutely nothing while he struggles to keep his nose above water?

If he had taken the slow approach I don’t think he’d be much different than he is today. He’s gotten stronger, his top end speed is good, he’s basically “developed”.

The issues are he lacks agility/balance/edges to change directions. He has a long stick and lacks the hands to go through guys consistently. He has a great shot, but doesn’t have the release to get it off in traffic. This is who he is and who he always was going to be. His path to being better from this point forward simply comes down to playing harder and smarter lol.

 

[Nedved]

I feel at one point MB said players are responsible for their development. As if putting guys in position to succeed and grow isn't part of his job. A guy that started his career as an interim gm learning the game before being given the reins.

I'm glad the MB era is over. It was painful.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I would love to see him with 55 to 60 games next year. He started to become a consistent goalie and rarely had an "off" game. It would be nice to know what we have in him, or if it was a fluky year.

The fact he went to the WCs and is continuing to play well in a high level tournament bodes well. To me this has all the marking of a “pre-breakout”.

I feel at one point MB said players are responsible for their development. As if putting guys in position to succeed and grow isn't part of his job. A guy that started his career as an interim gm learning the game before being given the reins.

I'm glad the MB era is over. It was painful.

This statement is misunderstood. What he was saying was that everything a player needs is at their disposal, but it is up to that player to maximize it.

 

[Kennerback]

I would love to see him with 55 to 60 games next year. He started to become a consistent goalie and rarely had an "off" game. It would be nice to know what we have in him, or if it was a fluky year.

If there’s another Bedard-level prospect to be drafted, I have no worries that he could take the worst team in the NHL way out of the running. No fluke. He’s just that good.

 

[NotProkofievian]

If he had taken the slow approach I don’t think he’d be much different than he is today. He’s gotten stronger, his top end speed is good, he’s basically “developed”.

The issues are he lacks agility/balance/edges to change directions. He has a long stick and lacks the hands to go through guys consistently. He has a great shot, but doesn’t have the release to get it off in traffic. This is who he is and who he always was going to be. His path to being better from this point forward simply comes down to playing harder and smarter lol.

I think we'd see a very different player. He'd have played fewer games on an easier travel schedule with a longer off season. More time to develop, more time to think, more space to try new things, and perhaps he might have even been lucky enough to go to an organization with a development coach. What is the theory really? He'd show up faster, smarter, with more success and skill under his belt and he's do...the same or worse as a 20 year old? Doesn't add up to me, but your mileage may vary.

 

[Nedved]

The fact he went to the WCs and is continuing to play well in a high level tournament bodes well. To me this has all the marking of a “pre-breakout”.

yeah, it's starting to feel that things are going in the right direction, I just hope he's not our next Thibault where we just in limbo with him.

The players I'm most excited to watch are matheson, guhle, barron. Are these guys we are going to start winning with? or just look good on a bad team.

 

[Schooner Guy]

Wright-obsessed haters think only Slafkovsky can be moulded and developed, and Shane Wright cannot improve in any way whatsoever. I don't really care about Shane Wright but I hope that Slafkovsky really can be moulded and developed because he was not NHL ready and wasn't NHL ready when he suffered a season-ending injury that took him out for 40+ games.

Could the Habs have developed Brady Tkachuk? I doubt it. They would've failed him like they did nearly every prospect they got their hands on.

After littering the Habs board for almost a year with thousands of posts castigating an 18-year old around the clock, are you really calling others here obsessed?

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

yeah, it's starting to feel that things are going in the right direction, I just hope he's not our next Thibault where we just in limbo with him.

The players I'm most excited to watch are matheson, guhle, barron. Are these guys we are going to start winning with? or just look good on a bad team.

Montembeaults next contract is an interesting one to follow. He’s due to be a UFA next year. IMHO we should do what we can to lock him up on a relatively cheap deal, something like the Allen contract where he can be either a cheap starter or an expensive backup.

 

[Jaynki]

I think it's a pretty silly statement to say that there's a negligible difference in development between teams.

Look at what Hughes and Gorton had to implement on our team, alone. Bergevin was running one guy for development and eventually added Bouillon. Neither of those guys were a skills coach like Adam Nicholas.

They didn't build out development plans.
They didn't have KPIs.
They didn't provide people with access to skill coaches.
They didn't have analytics departments.
They had more prospects and players then people to manage them.

Bergevin got exactly what he put into development. Nothing.

Its both a combination of incredible poor management and poor drafting. No wonder Kotkaniemi was not listening to his coaches. Who the f*** would listen to Ducharme?

Bergevin managed his team like it was an 80s hockey club.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Its both a combination of incredible poor management and poor drafting. No wonder Kotkaniemi was not listening to his coaches. Who the f*** would listen to Ducharme?

Bergevin managed his team like it was an 80s hockey club.

Wasn’t Ducharme supposed to be a new wave coach???

 

[NotProkofievian]

Wasn’t Ducharme supposed to be a new wave coach???

He and Joel Bouchard were supposed to be the great new hopes of Quebecois coaching. Both extreme busts.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

I think it's a pretty silly statement to say that there's a negligible difference in development between teams.

Look at what Hughes and Gorton had to implement on our team, alone. Bergevin was running one guy for development and eventually added Bouillon. Neither of those guys were a skills coach like Adam Nicholas.

They didn't build out development plans.
They didn't have KPIs.
They didn't provide people with access to skill coaches.
They didn't have analytics departments.
They had more prospects and players then people to manage them.

Bergevin got exactly what he put into development. Nothing.

This isn’t PlayStation , it’s a hard job.

 

[ReHabs]

After littering the Habs board for almost a year with thousands of posts castigating an 18-year old around the clock, are you really calling others here obsessed?

It a bit strange to expect Habs fans not to discuss and evaluate the only 1OA pick we’ve had in our generation. Maybe you should take a step back and inquire why you’re so avoidant of the Slafkovksy topic… Ostrich reflex maybe?

 

[NotProkofievian]

There's just so much going for Reinbacher that I feel like I have to put him at 5. Tools, stats, attitude, karaktère. Even his penalty minutes say ''draft me.'' He takes fewer penalties per game in a pro league than Will Smith does on his Harlem Globetrotters tour.

 

[ReHabs]

Tkachuk was ready made. There wasn’t any development needed, he was plug and play.

And I’ve said before, but development is used as an excuse. There’s little difference in “development” between NHL franchises, not enough of one to greatly vary the outcome of the player. Do you really think KK would have balance and agility if he went to another team? He simply never had the necessary ingredients to be more than what he is.

I would agree if it wasn’t for the fact the Habs are bottom-of-the-bottom across many categories when it comes to drafting and developing prospects.

There evidently IS a difference between hockey clubs and the Habs are on the short end of that stick.

There's just so much going for Reinbacher that I feel like I have to put him at 5. Tools, stats, attitude, karaktère. Even his penalty minutes say ''draft me.'' He takes fewer penalties per game in a pro league than Will Smith does on his Harlem Globetrotters tour.

Would you be the big brain genius to take a dman in a draft that has between nine and ten forwards listed in the consensus top10?

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

He and Joel Bouchard were supposed to be the great new hopes of Quebecois coaching. Both extreme busts.

But the post I responded to said KK had to deal with 80s style coaching dinosaurs, Ducharme was not that.

 

[Jaynki]

Wasn’t Ducharme supposed to be a new wave coach???

According to Bergevin yes.

I think he is more of a young dinosaur tho and an absolutely incapable person when it comes to communication and leadership.

 

[WeThreeKings]

There's just so much going for Reinbacher that I feel like I have to put him at 5. Tools, stats, attitude, karaktère. Even his penalty minutes say ''draft me.'' He takes fewer penalties per game in a pro league than Will Smith does on his Harlem Globetrotters tour.

I had no choice but to put him at 6. The floor is too high with a ceiling that could be massive.

No one really knew him before this year and he's just had an insane season in a good pro league as a defenseman.

Now he's showing out at the Worlds.

 

[NotProkofievian]

But the post I responded to said KK had to deal with 80s style coaching dinosaurs, Ducharme was not that.

To be fair, nobody knows what he was because we can't understand what he's saying.

Would you be the big brain genius to take a dman in a draft that has between nine and ten forwards listed in the consensus top10?

Normally I'm overrating some small euro who can't skate, so this is progress for me.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I had no choice but to put him at 6. The floor is too high with a ceiling that could be massive.

No one really knew him before this year and he's just had an insane season in a good pro league as a defenseman.

Now he's showing out at the Worlds.

Is he showing out at the Worlds? For me, I want to see him show out offensively and it’s just kind of hard to see it since his team is struggling to score.

There’s no doubt he’s got a well rounded profile though I still think 5 is too rich for him. Had we wind a few more game and we’re picking in the 8-12 range he’d be a target for me.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Is he showing out at the Worlds? For me, I want to see him show out offensively and it’s just kind of hard to see it since his team is struggling to score.

There’s no doubt he’s got a well rounded profile though I still think 5 is too rich for him. Had we wind a few more game and we’re picking in the 8-12 range he’d be a target for me.

I think he is, personally.

He's not shaking and baking or anything, but that's not his game the same way Shea Weber never shaked or baked anyone.

Just the defensive and puck poise is unreal with his physical gifts. His panic threshold is incredible, he's able to twist and turn away from the forecheck and keep the offense pointing in the right direction always. In zone, he's always looking to create odd man advantages, jump into space, and get his shot off.

People like the Seider comparison and it may be unlikely that the offensive tools shake out that way and develop the way Seider's did.. but I think the defensive upside and ability on Reinbacher is actually more than Seider's.

Like I've said before, Reinbacher doesn't bring the sex appeal.. but I think people are underrating just how massively important an all situations right hand defenseman with size and skating, that always moves the play and offense forward for a team, is for a team.

I'm taking one of the top 5 if I had a choice, but if we are hell bent on not taking Michkov. Reinbacher is right there.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I think he is, personally.

He's not shaking and baking or anything, but that's not his game the same way Shea Weber never shaked or baked anyone.

Just the defensive and puck poise is unreal with his physical gifts. His panic threshold is incredible, he's able to twist and turn away from the forecheck and keep the offense pointing in the right direction always. In zone, he's always looking to create odd man advantages, jump into space, and get his shot off.

People like the Seider comparison and it may be unlikely that the offensive tools shake out that way and develop the way Seider's did.. but I think the defensive upside and ability on Reinbacher is actually more than Seider's.

Like I've said before, Reinbacher doesn't bring the sex appeal.. but I think people are underrating just how massively important an all situations right hand defenseman with size and skating, that always moves the play and offense forward for a team, is for a team.

I'm taking one of the top 5 if I had a choice, but if we are hell bent on not taking Michkov. Reinbacher is right there.

The Seider comp needs to die IMO they are different prospects despite both coming from Nazi hotbeds lol

That comp is my biggest issue with Reinbacher lol

 

[BergevinBurner]

I wonder if we'll see Fantilli, Carlsson or Reinbacher opt out of the fitness testing at the draft combine like Slaf did last year.

I don't see the results having any effect on Fantilli/Carlsson anyways.

 

[Mrb1p]

If he had taken the slow approach I don’t think he’d be much different than he is today. He’s gotten stronger, his top end speed is good, he’s basically “developed”.

The issues are he lacks agility/balance/edges to change directions. He has a long stick and lacks the hands to go through guys consistently. He has a great shot, but doesn’t have the release to get it off in traffic. This is who he is and who he always was going to be. His path to being better from this point forward simply comes down to playing harder and smarter lol.

He wouldve played with the puck a lot more, executed more plays, learned more limits, developped new ways to problem solve, found new abilities, fine tuned motor skills (especially his shot.)

Its okay, at the end of the day you were right, the Habs shoulrve picked Tkachuk because they didnt have a plan to develop KK, I wish they did too, it doesnt mean you have to ignore reality.