HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

[Paddy17]

Dach would probably work well with them. I'm really excited to see how sustainable RHP's impact will be, the underlying numbers made it look like a lot more than just a hot streak but I find hw gets left out of a lot of discussions about the Habs' future.

I didn't think much of RHP at first, but his play has made me change my mind about him. I think he can be like what Burrows was for the Sedins. He has definite chemistry with Suzuki, so I'd be curious to try him out with the Suzuki-Caufield duo.

Anyway, back to Michkov rah rah rah talk.

 

[Whitesnake]

If they decide to pass on that forward talent to go after Reinbacher, I WILL be expecting a top 2 D. Nothing less. There is no freakin way a 2nd pair D will be enough while we see others becoming top end.

 

[Garbageyuk]

I hope you're not talking about me because I was one of the people who defended posters who didnt have Wright 1st even if I had him there myself.

That said, when you post an opinion on a hockey discussion forum, it's a given that people will argue it. It's why we browse this god-forsaken place, to talk about hockey and share our thoughts about the Habs and their decisions. It's not necessarily an attack on you personally.

I’m not talking about you. I’m not familiar with what your takes were last year, nor will I look at this point.

Respectful debate is fine, disagreeing is fine, but there are some loud mouth posters around here who are extremely aggressive, cocky, and belligerent in the way they approach anyone who says anything that doesn’t agree with the narrative they’ve personally decided on, despite saying the same types of things about and acting the same way regarding Wright last year and being dead wrong.

 

[Toene]

I’m not talking about you. I’m not familiar with what your takes were last year, nor will I look at this point.

Respectful debate is fine, disagreeing is fine, but there are some loud mouth posters around here who are extremely aggressive, cocky, and belligerent in the way they approach anyone who says anything that doesn’t agree with the narrative they’ve personally decided on, despite saying the same types of things about and acting the same way regarding Wright last year and being dead wrong.

Fair enough. I still think your perception of Michkov's character is wrong, every comment I read about him from people who watched him up close indicates he's a gamer.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

The outrage of us not picking Wright on here was worse than it is with Michkov right now. Anyone who criticized Wright or suggested the Habs consider anyone else was lambasted, called stupid, told that they were falling for media “hit pieces”, other teams were conspiring with the media to ensure he falls, on and on. All the same bullshit going on right now with Michkov.

This board was saying Wright has 100 point potential, he’s the franchise C we’ve been waiting years for, he’ll be the best forward the Habs have drafted since Lafleur - all kinds of crazy shit. The “generational” label was thrown around as well, just like it is now with Michkov.

I was personally called an idiot and told I was falling for narratives because I didn’t like his combine interviews and compete level. I stated I didn’t want the Habs to draft him and that I didn’t think he has star potential. People freaked out.

This fanbase is so starved for a superstar forward, that they repeatedly latch onto any player they think will be what they’re looking for and project all these superstar saviour traits onto them. It doesn’t matter what changes leading up to the draft or what scouts or the hockey community is saying after they have formed that narrative around the player, once their little hearts are set, there’s nothing that can sway them or criticize the Chosen One until hindsight is 20/20, and then it’s all swept under the rug and they begin it all again with a new player the next time the team is picking high.

I’m not saying anything definitive either way regarding Michkov other than that he’s got star potential. But for me, there are too many red flags that have nothing to do with him being Russian, and too many other high upside prospects available that aren’t going to come with a bunch of bullshit that I wouldn’t pick him. I think his potential is being significantly exaggerated on here due to the desperation for a saviour.

With respect, the red flags you listed in the previous post don't actually exist by any factual metric. They're essentially lies.

Want Michkov's Weaknesses?
-Sometimes watches the puck or gets lost in his zone while defending (keeping in mind he's 18 in a men's league)
-Not certain his high-end puck handling in a phone booth will work at the speed of the NHL level, but his other skills should translate
-Sometimes forces plays

Michkov is being touted as a superstar because he is doing superstar things. He's putting up generational numbers in the second best league in the world with all-world skills. When people look like they have generational talent, they don't fail in the NHL that often.

Wright was plateauing last year. There were legit concerns surrounding him. He was still my pick, and I found Slaf way more concerning (I had him 6th), but I would have been ok with Cooley or Jiricek or something. That's a little different than this whole narrative of Shane Wright being some kind of savior. I think this forum was mostly measured on their expectations for Wright, given the weak draft year.

The idea that the entire Habs fanbase other than Garbageyuk are a monolith that act like a group of idiots and tout rando skill players as the next savior is ridiculous.

This is not some random skill guy. This is a player that was touted as being neck-in-neck with Bedard his entire career. Ryan Leonard, Reinbarcher, and f***ing Dvorsky don't even come close to measuring up.

 

[Kaladin]

More like GMs competing to get the most out of the situation and using scouts / media to disinform because it brings opportunities to them.

Sad that some posters around here seemed to have lapped up the disinformation hook line and sinker though. For such a smart fanbase it's disappointing.

 

[SOLR]

Sad that some posters around here seemed to have lapped up the disinformation hook line and sinker though. For such a smart fanbase it's disappointing.

Easier to follow what the medias say.

 

[Kennerback]

I’m not talking about you. I’m not familiar with what your takes were last year, nor will I look at this point.

Respectful debate is fine, disagreeing is fine, but there are some loud mouth posters around here who are extremely aggressive, cocky, and belligerent in the way they approach anyone who says anything that doesn’t agree with the narrative they’ve personally decided on, despite saying the same types of things about and acting the same way regarding Wright last year and being dead wrong.

This is not the Wright situation. Before the draft, Wright had already mutated into the next Patrice Bergeron because his offence had sputtered. Scouts were now selling his two-way play. Only fans that didn’t follow the game still believed in the generational offence. He also looked to a lot of people like he was floating during the OHL playoffs. One of the many excuses was that there was no point in getting injured before the draft.

Michkov is going to be a star. And following hockey history, in situations like this, the clever GMs get the whale. He’ll typically come faster than expected. And he’ll be a star. Now is the time to say it. We wilfully decided to pick a more physical Lekhonem over Brett Hull. No revisionist history possible.

Most will probably back the Habs pick (whoever it is) quickly and hope for the best. Most won’t cry over split milk. Just like most Wright supporters did with Slafkofsky.

 

[Garbageyuk]

This is not the Wright situation. Before the draft, Wright had already mutated into the next Patrice Bergeron because his offence had sputtered. Scouts were now selling his two-way play. Only fans that didn’t follow the game still believed in the generational offence. He also looked to a lot of people like he was floating during the OHL playoffs. One of the many excuses was that there was no point in getting injured before the draft.

Michkov is going to be a star. And following hockey history, in situations like this, the clever GMs get the whale. He’ll typically come faster than expected. And he’ll be a star. Now is the time to say it. We wilfully decided to pick a more physical Lekhonem over Brett Hull. No revisionist history possible.

Most will probably back the Habs pick (whoever it is) quickly and hope for the best. Most won’t cry over split milk. Just like most Wright supporters did with Slafkofsky.

See, it’s the way you speak about him as if it’s an absolute certainty that he will become a star that I have a problem with. There is no sure thing when it comes to prospects. You know this. Especially when it comes to a small, weak, skill winger who doesn’t have top end speed, doesn’t play defense, and reportedly put up the majority of his KHL points against Kunlun Red Star. There are valid concerns emerging regarding Michkov. You are just blind to them because you don’t want to acknowledge that you may be wrong. No reputable scout has him anywhere near Bedard at this point, and it has nothing to do with him being Russian.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

See, it’s the way you speak about him as if it’s an absolute certainty that he will become a star that I have a problem with. There is no sure thing when it comes to prospects. You know this. Especially when it comes to a small, weak, skill winger who doesn’t have top end speed, doesn’t play defense, and reportedly put up the majority of his KHL points against Kunlun Red Star. There are valid concerns emerging regarding Michkov. You are just blind to them because you don’t want to acknowledge that you may be wrong. No reputable scout has him anywhere near Bedard at this point, and it has nothing to do with him being Russian.

Bulllllshit.

 

[Garbageyuk]

Bulllllshit.

Not bullshit at all. Multiple scouts have acknowledged these things regarding him. And no, I’m not going to post them or pull it up for you. It’s available for anyone who’s willing to look.

 

[Andrei79]

He skates like Gallagher with that awkward forward lean and no top end speed. He may very well improve that and he may improve his shot but he has way too many question marks and there just aren't any examples of small guys with both skating and shooting issues in today's NHL that are worthy of going top ten in a stacked draft. I personally hope he succeeds because he has a huge heart and plays the game the right way but I wouldn't gamble with a top 10 pick in this years draft on him.



I think I will print this on to some two-ply and wipe my butt with it. Leonard at 22 lol....what a joke!

This is an apt description of Bensons skating. His edges get overrated as well, but it seems like by just a few. But yeah, in general the edges are good. I'll add that he gets outmuscled at the junior level, sometimes very easily. He'll need to add a lot to his game. I don't think he's going to be the player Canadiens management will be looking for. Might be a mistake as he clearly sees the game at a high level and makes quick decisions, but I just don't see it for all these reasons.

 

[Andrei79]

If they decide to pass on that forward talent to go after Reinbacher, I WILL be expecting a top 2 D. Nothing less. There is no freakin way a 2nd pair D will be enough while we see others becoming top end.

I think people here would have been mad about a Sanderson pick at the time, wrongly.

I would be surprised if teams dont have Reinbacher very high. He's impressive. He's smart on both ends, he's already worked on many pro details in his game (his escapes, for example, but those details are numerous), he can rush the puck, he has good vision offensively and he's got a hard shot that gets through. Add that he can already pin pro players effectively while having a lot of room to bulk up... I think he's not going to wait long come draft day.

 

[SlafySZN]

delete

 

[Garl]

Sounds like Sebastian Colbert / Brad Lambert

Nope, very different type.

He's definitely neither. Way better vision & playmaker than Lambert could ever hope to be, and is an outstanding skater.

Colbert couldn't skate, or pass. He was a small netfront guy.

Sale shouldn't be dropping that far. He has legitimate high end skills.

Collberg is a good skater.

Collberg was a great prospect until he was 18. Then, his development stumbled, why I have no idea.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

See, it’s the way you speak about him as if it’s an absolute certainty that he will become a star that I have a problem with. There is no sure thing when it comes to prospects. You know this. Especially when it comes to a small, weak, skill winger who doesn’t have top end speed, doesn’t play defense, and reportedly put up the majority of his KHL points against Kunlun Red Star. There are valid concerns emerging regarding Michkov. You are just blind to them because you don’t want to acknowledge that you may be wrong. No reputable scout has him anywhere near Bedard at this point, and it has nothing to do with him being Russian.

8 of his 20 points did come against Kunlun Red Star. His 1st game against them he had 1g, 4a. 2nd game, 1g, 3a. 3rd game no points.

But, that's not a majority.

He also played against SKA, which is the best team in the league, in 2 games and picked up 3 pts. 1g, 2a.

It's not unusual for talented players to feast against bad team at times, but he produced against top teams too.

Majority of actual scouts still think he's one of the most talented players in this draft. Not sure where you're getting that information from. Twitter scouts aren't actual scouts.

I'm sure you probably hated Patrick Kane too as a draftee.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

Nope, very different type.


Collberg is a good skater.

Collberg was a great prospect until he was 18. Then, his development stumbled, why I have no idea.

Colberg was an okay skater. I wouldn't call him a great prospect. He was considered 1st round material and fell on draft day. He was pretty small & weak. And, yeah, he didn't progress well in his development at all.

 

[Garl]

Colberg was an okay skater. I wouldn't call him a great prospect. He was considered 1st round material and fell on draft day. He was pretty small & weak. And, yeah, he didn't progress well in his development at all.

He was the best swedish 94 before 2012, and several forwards from that class made a career in NHL, Lindholm, Forsberg, Sundqvist, Wennberg you can say Johnsson aswell. Also, don't rememberg him being "weak" he was like 5'11 180 at the draft day. He was more developed physically that Sale when he was 18.

Player kinda comparable to Collberg is Otto Stenberg in terms of his development.

 

[Toene]

See, it’s the way you speak about him as if it’s an absolute certainty that he will become a star that I have a problem with. There is no sure thing when it comes to prospects. You know this. Especially when it comes to a small, weak, skill winger who doesn’t have top end speed, doesn’t play defense, and reportedly put up the majority of his KHL points against Kunlun Red Star. There are valid concerns emerging regarding Michkov. You are just blind to them because you don’t want to acknowledge that you may be wrong. No reputable scout has him anywhere near Bedard at this point, and it has nothing to do with him being Russian.

Bedard is seen as a generational talent because he destroyed the WHL and had a gazillion goals per game. The Russian system is very different but Michkov just had the most productive seasons for a guy his age ever in those leagues. It's never a sure thing, but at some point you have to drop the skepticism when a prospect sets new heights like Michkov has. The hype is deserved.

 

[Garl]

Bedard is seen as a generational talent because he destroyed the WHL and had a gazillion goals per game. The Russian system is very different but Michkov just had the most productive seasons for a guy his age ever in those leagues. It's never a sure thing, but at some point you have to drop the skepticism when a prospect sets new heights like Michkov has. The hype is deserved.

I said on the main board already, Michkov is a good pick at #5, but his KHL season is vastly overrated, since he basically didn't make the main team(SKA) and played on a farm team. His NT season with 1+3 in 11 games was dissapointing aswell, considering the hype he had prior to the season.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Easier to follow what the medias say.

Easier for their anxiety. "Oh the reports say we're not picking Michkov! OMG, I better get with the program so my feelings don't get hurt."

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

8 of his 20 points did come against Kunlun Red Star. His 1st game against them he had 1g, 4a. 2nd game, 1g, 3a. 3rd game no points.

But, that's not a majority.

He also played against SKA, which is the best team in the league, in 2 games and picked up 3 pts. 1g, 2a.

It's not unusual for talented players to feast against bad team at times, but he produced against top teams too.

Majority of actual scouts still think he's one of the most talented players in this draft. Not sure where you're getting that information from. Twitter scouts aren't actual scouts.

I'm sure you probably hated Patrick Kane too as a draftee.

His 'scouts' is probably snake boisvert

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

A lot of talk about Habs not considering Michkov

But one thing I really don’t like from what we hear is how they don’t consider Zach Benson.

That kid is the real deal and I do think passing on him could hurt us big time

I'd take all the insider reports about who the Habs will draft with several grains of salt. Hughes said at his presser that they haven't made their list yet.
So... How do these reporters have any inside scoop on who the Habs are targeting when the Habs organization doesn't even know yet? I don't think it's all that likely that they can. The Habs will decide soon on their list, and only at that point will Hughes and Co. know what the order is for pick 5.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Easier for their anxiety. "Oh the reports say we're not picking Michkov! OMG, I better get with the program so my feelings don't get hurt."

Why would anyone's feelings get hurt if they took Michkov after the sense being they won't?

 

[ReHabs]

I'd take all the insider reports about who the Habs will draft with several grains of salt. Hughes said at his presser that they haven't made their list yet.
So... How do these reporters have any inside scoop on who the Habs are targeting when the Habs organization doesn't even know yet? I don't think it's all that likely that they can. The Habs will decide soon on their list, and only at that point will Hughes and Co. know what the order is for pick 5.

Hughes also said they haven’t talked to Michkov yet.

If you believe Hughes when he says their list isn’t finalized, you should also believe when he says they haven’t talked to Michkov yet, right?

Why would they not even talk to Michkov? What’s keeping them? Didn’t he say earlier that Michkov is a mystery?

To me there are two possible answers
1. They aren’t considering him whatsoever
or
2. They’re lying

Why would anyone's feelings get hurt if they took Michkov after the sense being they won't?

Read that post again lol