2023 Free Agency/UFA Targets

[stillwater]

He is closest comparable but if you've seen Zetterberg you immediately realize he was way more than that when he was in his late 20s.


I understand that but 20 pages of two persons forcing this midget? Cmon. There is overall understanding how a Stanley Cup winning team is built. And it is not centered on smallish wingers.

Jonathon Marchessault is 5'9. He's just about the epitome of a "smallish winger".

His team just won the Stanley Cup. He also just won the Conn Smythe trophy as playoff MVP.

Your timing is impeccable.

 

[Gniwder]

The difference between bert and debrincat is a couple points:

1: trade deadline deals are different than Draft day, which are also different than july 1 deals
2: By the time bert was traded, there were not many guys left that boston could choose from with the same type of play style bert has. Also, Yzerman going to Yzerman

Also, I see what you are saying about the OR, I hear you on that.

Lastly, Ottawa has no leverage in this situation. They have a player who is RFA, publicly said he does not want to play for Ottawa at all, and his QO is hindering trade partners. You bring up Tkachuk and say he is miles better than debrincat (won't debate that with you) but he had a QO of 9 million, just like debrincat, but he had 100 point seasons. Debrincat doesn't, he focuses on goal scoring (of which we need mercifully as a side note). Another reason why this is different is because a lot of contending teams have almost no cap space for their own players they want to sign, not to mention taking on a guy that will most likely get 8-9 mil. We can.

Also, news came out and said multiple teams are committing to zadina-level players and picks. So there's that.

All of those same points were made last season before the Tkachuk trade. It's like deja vu all over again. A player does not lose complete value because he requests a trade.

Debrincat doesn't fetch as much as Tkachuk for reasons that are obvious to everyone, but if Ottawa doesn't get at least a 1st, they aren't trading him. I mean, why bother?

Getting Zadina is a negative return, lol. His salary the 3rd year is $2.7M, and he's not gonna get a QO regardless of which team he's on.

 

[DamonDRW]

Jonathon Marchessault is 5'9. He's just about the epitome of a "smallish winger".

His team just won the Stanley Cup. He also just won the Conn Smythe trophy as playoff MVP.

Your timing is impeccable.

Jack Eichel.

 

[Henkka]

there is no reality on earth that it would take raymond + 1st rounder + prospect to get an unsigned, RFA debrincat after saying he won't sign with his current team. so no, that is not back to reality kind sir.

Was comparing him to Bratt and Debrincat should get less.

Jesper Bratt has scored 0.92 points per game for last 2 seasons. Got 7.85M 8 years.

DeBrincat is from same draft class, has scored 0.88 points per gamr for last 2 seasons.

Think that 7.65M could be the right value he would be getting from that team-elected arbiration.

Small wingers, same draft class, similar production. Bratt did set the market value.

About trade value, it's something more than we got for Bertuzzi. Maybe 1st + 2nd.

 

[DanielMarois]

Barbashev would be my target, hope the Wings get him.

 

[K1900L]

Can people stop here with DeBrincat? Every second post is about how to trade for him and then sign for 9M. He is good. Do you remember Sheppard, Kozlov, Nyquist? Where these guys would be without Yzerman, Fedorov, and Datsyuk/Zetterberg feeding them? We don't have a single center even remotely comparable to those guys.

Any rebuild always starts with defs and centers. The rest is not that important. We've got defs, now we need centers. As many as we can draft.

DeBrincat had 66 points and 27 goals in a season where for the majority of games he was either centered by rookies (Pinto, Greig) or a depth player (Brassard).
Yes, it was a down season considering his scoring. But this would still have put him at #2 right behind Larkin in Detroit.

Larkin will be an update to any centerman he has played with this year (because Norris was injured and he didn't play with Stützle).

 

[norrisnick]

DeBrincat had 66 points and 27 goals in a season where for the majority of games he was either centered by rookies (Pinto, Greig) or a depth player (Brassard).
Yes, it was a down season considering his scoring. But this would still have put him at #2 right behind Larkin in Detroit.

Larkin will be an update to any centerman he has played with this year (because Norris was injured and he didn't play with Stützle).

30 of those points were on a PP with Stutzle, Tkachuk, Giroux...

 

[JediOrderPizza]

30 of those points were on a PP with Stutzle, Tkachuk, Giroux...

You can keep doing this with every good player tho, good players a lot of the time play with good players.

Datsyuk played with Zetterberg and Lidstrom. What a scrub!

 

[NickH8]

Barbashev would be my target, hope the Wings get him.

I'd love him. I do think he'll get overpaid for being hot in the playoffs though. Classic situation

 

[norrisnick]

You can keep doing this with every good player tho, good players a lot of the time play with good players.

Datsyuk played with Zetterberg and Lidstrom. What a scrub!

You can also rate players relative to the good players he plays with. Is DeBrincat driving that PP or is it Stutzle/Tkachuk? Was it DeBrincat in Chicago or was it Kane and Toews? A lot of posters are hyping themselves up about DeBrincat as if it were Stutzle on the way out.

Relative to those two? Sure, yeah.

 

[jkutswings]

You can also rate players relative to the good players he plays with. Is DeBrincat driving that PP or is it Stutzle/Tkachuk? Was it DeBrincat in Chicago or was it Kane and Toews? A lot of posters are hyping themselves up about DeBrincat as if it were Stutzle on the way out.

Relative to those two? Sure, yeah.

You're making this far more binary than it needs to be. It's not as if the only two options for a player are:

* Unquestionable stud
* Total passenger

Do I think Debrincat is exactly the same tier of player as Stutzle and Tkachuk? No. But that doesn't mean he was just riding their coattails and couldn't add significant talent to this roster.

And I can be fine with not trading for him, and still acknowledge he'd be a major upgrade.

 

[norrisnick]

You're making this far more binary than it needs to be. It's not as if the only two options for a player are:

* Unquestionable stud
* Total passenger

Do I think Debrincat is exactly the same tier of player as Stutzle and Tkachuk? No. But that doesn't mean he was just riding their coattails and couldn't add significant talent to this roster.

And I can be fine with not trading for him, and still acknowledge he'd be a major upgrade.

Arguments need to be shifted towards the extreme a bit when the opposing side is all "we'd be acquiring a 40+ goal scorer!".

It's all a balance.

Is DeBrincat a good player? Yes.
Is he a good goalscorer? Yes.
Could he help this team score more goals? Yes.
Does he help this team at $9M with full term? That is the $72M question I'm not comfortable answering yes to.

I want other key pieces in place before I make that commitment to a complementary winger. Figure out our 2C, figure out our contract plans with Mo, Ray, Ras, Bergie, Kubalik. Figure out our backup goalie. Figure out our 2nd pairing RD. Those are things I want ironed out before I take 10% of the cap and give it to a 5'8" winger that does not drive the play so much as complement it.

If that means we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat. I'd rather not land him and then run into problems with the areas I listed.

 

[RedHawkDown]

You can keep doing this with every good player tho, good players a lot of the time play with good players.

Datsyuk played with Zetterberg and Lidstrom. What a scrub!

Point is he wouldn’t have anything close on Detroits PP.

Arguments need to be shifted towards the extreme a bit when the opposing side is all "we'd be acquiring a 40+ goal scorer!".

It's all a balance.

Is DeBrincat a good player? Yes.
Is he a good goalscorer? Yes.
Could he help this team score more goals? Yes.
Does he help this team at $9M with full term? That is the $72M question I'm not comfortable answering yes to.

I want other key pieces in place before I make that commitment to a complementary winger. Figure out our 2C, figure out our contract plans with Mo, Ray, Ras, Bergie, Kubalik. Figure out our backup goalie. Figure out our 2nd pairing RD. Those are things I want ironed out before I take 10% of the cap and give it to a 5'8" winger that does not drive the play so much as complement it.

If that means we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat. I'd rather not land him and then run into problems with the areas I listed.

This covers my feelings exactly on DBC. For sub 8M long term and wihtout 9/17 this year, sure. More than that, no thanks.

 

[jkutswings]

Arguments need to be shifted towards the extreme a bit when the opposing side is all "we'd be acquiring a 40+ goal scorer!".

It's all a balance.

Is DeBrincat a good player? Yes.
Is he a good goalscorer? Yes.
Could he help this team score more goals? Yes.
Does he help this team at $9M with full term? That is the $72M question I'm not comfortable answering yes to.

I want other key pieces in place before I make that commitment to a complementary winger. Figure out our 2C, figure out our contract plans with Mo, Ray, Ras, Bergie, Kubalik. Figure out our backup goalie. Figure out our 2nd pairing RD. Those are things I want ironed out before I take 10% of the cap and give it to a 5'8" winger that does not drive the play so much as complement it.

If that means we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat we miss out on this opportunity for DeBrincat. I'd rather not land him and then run into problems with the areas I listed.

I understand what you're saying, but you're asking the wrong question.

If Yzerman thinks Debrincat is a huge addition to the offense, he should add him and say to hell with the numbers, I'll figure that out later.

If Yzerman thinks Debrincat is just a complimentary piece, then he's not worth adding to begin with, because you don't give $60 million over 8 years to complimentary pieces.

The rest of the roster will be sorted out as needed. You don't pass up adding high end talent because it might make the math tricky. If it's a need and the rare opportunity presents itself, you just get it done. Debating whether Debrincat or Keller or Connor or <insert candidate here>, should be on Detroit's "thumbs up list" is fine. But for anybody that does make the list, you pull the trigger and ask questions later.

 

[JediOrderPizza]

Point is he wouldn’t have anything close on Detroits PP.


This covers my feelings exactly on DBC. For sub 8M long term and wihtout 9/17 this year, sure. More than that, no thanks.

Perron had 22 points on our PP, Debrincat had 30 PP for Ottawa, and you don't think he could maintain that here? I don't buy it.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Point is he wouldn’t have anything close on Detroits PP.


This covers my feelings exactly on DBC. For sub 8M long term and wihtout 9/17 this year, sure. More than that, no thanks.

Just so we are clear here:

Ottawa Senators PP% - PPG: 72 , PPO: 306 , PP%: 23.53
Red Wings PP% - PPG: 57 , PPO: 270 , PP%: 21.11

League Average PP: PPG: 54 , PPO: 252 , PP%: 21.31


You are saying that Debrincat on a powerplay (that was 2% points worse than Ottawa) would not get similar pp points than when he was on Ottawa? Ok, he won't get 30 points on the powerplay...he will get, what 28?

 

[norrisnick]

Perron had 22 points on our PP, Debrincat had 30 PP for Ottawa, and you don't think he could maintain that here? I don't buy it.

Ottawa has a better PP than us. This season and before ADB got there. Who do we have netfront that's anywhere close to Tkachuk? Or Stutzle distributing from the half wall?

Fun fact about DeBrincat and Perron! Since DeBrincat entered the league, he and Perron have the same number of PP points with 128.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Perron had 22 points on our PP, Debrincat had 30 PP for Ottawa, and you don't think he could maintain that here? I don't buy it.

He has to do more than just maintain it for him to be worth the 8M+ contract he’ll br asking for. If he stays a 65pt winger it will be a bad trade and signing.

Just so we are clear here:

Ottawa Senators PP% - PPG: 72 , PPO: 306 , PP%: 23.53
Red Wings PP% - PPG: 57 , PPO: 270 , PP%: 21.11

League Average PP: PPG: 54 , PPO: 252 , PP%: 21.31


You are saying that Debrincat on a powerplay (that was 2% points worse than Ottawa) would not get similar pp points than when he was on Ottawa? Ok, he won't get 30 points on the powerplay...he will get, what 28?

Don’t think Cat complements our PP as well as someone like Perron. He’s a finisher and we don’t have any good setup guys unlike Ottawa.

We’ll see. I just am not a big fan of the player. Ultimately if Yzerman trades for him I’ll cross every body part hoping for him to explode here. We’re on the same side lol

 

[Detroit Knights]

He has to do more than just maintain it for him to be worth the 8M+ contract he’ll br asking for. If he stays a 65pt winger it will be a bad trade and signing.



Don’t think Cat complements our PP as well as someone like Perron. He’s a finisher and we don’t have any good setup guys unlike Ottawa.

We’ll see. I just am not a big fan of the player. Ultimately if Yzerman trades for him I’ll cross every body part hoping for him to explode here. We’re on the same side lol

Perron is a finisher....well that just doesn't make sense at all.

Have you watched the powerplays where he doesn't score and not just the highlights? I mean, dude misses the net 80% of the time trying to pick corners that he doesn't have the skill to do so. He tries ovi one timers and he never has enough on it for it to be considered a weapon. He also holds on to the puck with patience, which is great, but as soon as someone get's up close and personal to him he tries to hard and the pass doesn't work out most of the time and we have to re-zone entry, or he loses it to the PK outright.

I'd much rather have debrincat on the side board ready to snipe (because he can actually pick corners far better than perron could dream of) or be ready for the pass on the back door. I also just don't like Perron in general and it is a fact that he is easily replaceable when it comes to production. I understand his vet presence and all that, I agree, but he is replaceable on the ice.

I get it, your not a fan yet. Hopefully, if he is traded here, then he can prove everyone wrong/right. Time will tell.

 

[JediOrderPizza]

Ottawa has a better PP than us. This season and before ADB got there. Who do we have netfront that's anywhere close to Tkachuk? Or Stutzle distributing from the half wall?

Fun fact about DeBrincat and Perron! Since DeBrincat entered the league, he and Perron have the same number of PP points with 128.

I have a feeling Larkin, Raymond and Seider will find ways. Maybe even Edvinsson, Kasper and Berggren.

He has to do more than just maintain it for him to be worth the 8M+ contract he’ll br asking for. If he stays a 65pt winger it will be a bad trade and signing.



Don’t think Cat complements our PP as well as someone like Perron. He’s a finisher and we don’t have any good setup guys unlike Ottawa.

We’ll see. I just am not a big fan of the player. Ultimately if Yzerman trades for him I’ll cross every body part hoping for him to explode here. We’re on the same side lol

It's all good, I can understand if you just don't like the player. I wasn't trying to sound ultra hostile so sorry if it came out that way.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Perron is a finisher....well that just doesn't make sense at all.

Have you watched the powerplays where he doesn't score and not just the highlights? I mean, dude misses the net 80% of the time trying to pick corners that he doesn't have the skill to do so. He tries ovi one timers and he never has enough on it for it to be considered a weapon. He also holds on to the puck with patience, which is great, but as soon as someone get's up close and personal to him he tries to hard and the pass doesn't work out most of the time and we have to re-zone entry, or he loses it to the PK outright.

I'd much rather have debrincat on the side board ready to snipe (because he can actually pick corners far better than perron could dream of) or be ready for the pass on the back door. I also just don't like Perron in general and it is a fact that he is easily replaceable when it comes to production. I understand his vet presence and all that, I agree, but he is replaceable on the ice.

I get it, your not a fan yet. Hopefully, if he is traded here, then he can prove everyone wrong/right. Time will tell.

I meant Cat is a finisher, not Perron. I think Perron works better on our PP as a net front and physical guy. He’s not the finisher.

 

[Detroit Knights]

I meant Cat is a finisher, not Perron. I think Perron works better on our PP as a net front and physical guy. He’s not the finisher.

Ah I see, misread that.

 

[ricky0034]

whole lot of talk in here about the other players on that Ottawa powerplay but zero mention that DeBrincat's 30 points lead the team

just wanted to point that out

 

[Detroit Knights]

whole lot of talk in here about the other players on that Ottawa powerplay but zero mention that DeBrincat's 30 points lead the team

just wanted to point that out

while their powerplay was only 2% better than ours and would likely be the same if not more by adding him on to DET quite easily, really.

I mean say what you want with some of these goals, he knows how to bury the puck on the rush, one-timer, standing wrist shot, tips, back-door shoveling, etc.

 

[Oddbob]

You can keep doing this with every good player tho, good players a lot of the time play with good players.

Datsyuk played with Zetterberg and Lidstrom. What a scrub!

Paul Coffey played with this bum WWayine Greiiitzky!