GDT: 2023 Draft Lottery - 8PM ET - ESPN, Sportsnet, TVAS: Chicago #1, Anaheim #2, Columbus #3

[Chelios]

They didn't know because they didn't want to know, that's the entire issue.

The Blackhawks decided to ignore it and then they gave Aldrich the opportunity to quit without an investigation.

It all comes back to how the Blackhawks handled the situation, and they failed miserably. If they separated Aldrich from the team when they found out or even right after the playoffs, prevented him from taking part in the Cup celebrations, and performed an investigation at the time, it would be an entirely different situation. Instead, they ignored it and let Aldrich walk away with his name on the Cup and no black marks on his record, which enabled his further abuse.

I have said all along that what you described is, by far and away, the most valid criticism of the organization in all of this. I agree that they failed in that regard. But again, that brings up the question of who’s responsible for handling that? It certainly seems that John McDonough said he would handle it, and that everyone else assumed that he did. I mean between the time when the incident was first brought to the attention of the organization and the Stanley cup parade is, what, a month? So within a month Aldridge was gone from the organization. It seems pretty reasonable that most people in the organization assumed that the issue was looked into and dealt with. The idea that the whole organization orchestrated this massive cover up that seems to be prevalent on this site is ridiculous (there are people comparing it to Penn State).

To me the bulk of the blame should fall at the feet of John McDonough. Although, I still haven’t heard anything from anyone with any kind of expertise in corporate law as far as what is usually done in these situations. If there are allegations of inappropriate conduct between employees of an organization that happens outside of work and (at the time) does not appear to be criminal, can the employer actually do anything? If they had fired Aldridge on the spot, or even removed him from his usual duties with the team, would they be liable if he decided to sue them for it? I honestly don’t know the answers to these questions.

 

[RDTBay4]

Previously I stated we didn't have a 1st round pick until 2026.

Hey, never say never. They'll probably rewrite the draft lotto rules in the next year or two to make sure that everyone* has an equal shot.

*and by everyone I mean super successful big market teams that have already had mountains of good fortune befall them, they go right to the front of the pack. Just like the system is supposed to work.

2 major corrections about the 1st round pick situation for Tampa Bay.

The 2024 1st round pick we traded for Hagel is top 10 protected, meaning we keep the pick if we end up in the top 10 of the draft in 2024.
The 2025 1st round pick we traded for Jeannot is top 10 protected as well.

 

[ES]

Previously I stated we didn't have a 1st round pick until 2026.

2 major corrections about the 1st round pick situation for Tampa Bay.

The 2024 1st round pick we traded for Hagel is top 10 protected, meaning we keep the pick if we end up in the top 10 of the draft in 2024.
The 2025 1st round pick we traded for Jeannot is top 10 protected as well.

The protections mean that if TB would be in the top 10 in 2024 they would have to give up 2025 regardless of the position right? In that case, the 2025 first-rounder would go to the Blackhawks and the 2026 first-rounder to the Predators right?

Not saying it's likely to happen but it's still a possibility.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

Hawks fans have been a great fanbase for years so good to see them happy about the pick but people are mad at the organisation for the obvious reasons they did not deserve Bedard but no its not rigged please stop with this nonsense

 

[Cowumbus]

Hawks fans have been a great fanbase for years so good to see them happy about the pick but people are mad at the organisation for the obvious reasons they did not deserve Bedard but no its not rigged please stop with this nonsense

Do they have a great fanbase? Or do people show up (recently) because their team has always been good?

83.7% capacity this year - 3rd to last, and the attendance numbers have gotten worse every year since 2018/19. Before Toews/Kane were drafted (2006, 2007) from 1999 - 2007 they averaged 14k fans at home games. Every year since its opening in 1995, the United Center saw Hawks games average attendance decrease until 2006/07 when they averaged just over 12k.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Do they have a great fanbase? Or do people show up (recently) because their team has always been good?

83.7% capacity this year - 3rd to last, and the attendance numbers have gotten worse every year since 2018/19. Before Toews/Kane were drafted (2006, 2007) from 1999 - 2007 they averaged 14k fans at home games. Every year since its opening in 1995, the United Center saw Hawks games average attendance decrease until 2006/07 when they averaged just over 12k.

The fanbase has always been there. We dealt with a piece of shit owner that for years refused to televise home games, drove players away, cheaped out on paying star players, and refused to put even a competitive product on the ice, etc. etc. Saying the fanbase isn't good because the team has only been good recently is bs. Chicago has always been a hardcore hockey city, with a hardcore Hawks following.

 

[Cowumbus]

The fanbase has always been there. We dealt with a piece of shit owner that for years refused to televise home games, drove players away, cheaped out on paying star players, and refused to put even a competitive product on the ice, etc. etc.

How is that any different from a city like Columbus, Buffalo? Who still have good attendance despite zero on ice success?

Saying the fanbase isn't good because the team has only been good recently is bs. Chicago has always been a hardcore hockey city, with a hardcore following.

I didn’t say they weren’t good, just simply that they don’t have a great fanbase. Many fair weather fans in the Windy City.

 

[ChiHawks10]

How is that any different from a city like Columbus, Buffalo? Who still have good attendance despite zero on ice success?

I didn’t say they weren’t good, just simply that they don’t have a great fanbase. Many fair weather fans in the Windy City.

Many fair weather fans around the league, for all the teams.

The "fair weather" or "bandwagon" fan nonsense has always confused me. As huge fans of the most obscure and unpopular of the major pro sports in North America, you'd think that attracting more fans, and more money, and more attention to the league would be thought of as a good thing by any of us. Yet people are constantly giving other teams shit for it... how ass backwards is that?

 

[RDTBay4]

The protections mean that if TB would be in the top 10 in 2024 they would have to give up 2025 regardless of the position right? In that case, the 2025 first-rounder would go to the Blackhawks and the 2026 first-rounder to the Predators right?

Not saying it's likely to happen but it's still a possibility.

Not sure about how it works, but both picks are top 10 protected.

 

[Cowumbus]

Many fair weather fans around the league, for all the teams.

Yeah..

The "fair weather" or "bandwagon" fan nonsense has always confused me. As huge fans of the most obscure and unpopular of the major pro sports in North America, you'd think that attracting more fans, and more money, and more attention to the league would be thought of as a good thing by any of us. Yet people are constantly giving other teams shit for it... how ass backwards is that?

More fans is good.

That has nothing to do with the question that I asked you though. I don’t see anything within your post supporting the notion that the Hawks have great fans.

This is not an attack on you, or anyone on this site, but just more of a statement about Hawks fandom as a whole.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Yeah..

More fans is good.

That has nothing to do with the question that I asked you though. I still don’t see you making any argument to support the idea that the Hawks have great fans.

I mean, what did you want me to provide? Anything I provide would be anecdotal evidence based upon personal experiences. Did you want me to talk about those of us who followed the team through the dark ages of Dollar Bill owning the team? How I grew up listening to my favorite hockey team on the radio with my Dad in the evening, because the cheapskate piece of shit owner refused to televise home games? I've played since I was 5 years old, at high levels, outside of taking men's league years off here and there, and I'm 38. And I couldn't even watch my favorite team, but we used to sit around and listen to them on the radio. Or watching favorite player, after favorite player(star players included) leave in free agency, because the owner refused to pay them, and seeing them play for other teams, including hated rivals like Detroit? Or going to games as a kid with our travel clubs, getting to play on the ice, and getting to feel like NHLers? Or maybe all of us in here trying to support our favorite team, and defend ourselves, and the team, when most the league's fans spew hate and crack rape jokes? How about the parade for the first Cup, that I attended, that had people smashed shoulder to shoulder for miles and miles, in 90 degree heat and the good ol' Chicago 90% summer humidity? Or maybe me and friends staying up until 2-3am to watch triple OT playoff games on work nights in the middle of the week, taking "momentum shots" of tequila, and waking up to go to work the next morning on 3 hours of sleep, hungover as shit? I mean... I'm not sure how you quantify the Hawks "having great fans" outside of personal experiences being told like I just did.

And most the people I grew up with and/or played with are the same type of fans of the team as I am. I mean... I have 26,000 posts on a f***ing hockey message board...

 

[Il Stugotz]

I mean, what did you want me to provide? Anything I provide would be anecdotal evidence based upon personal experiences.

I also listened to them on the radio and followed them through box scores in the 90s. Then I got really into the Wolves because I could walk to the Horizon.

The whole thing has been tainted from the start for me for the reasons you said. The best part about the Cup runs was that my extended family and coworkers got really into hockey so we could talk about the players and games at a relatively high level. So I obviously got caught up in the moment.

But I have not and will not spend my money on this team. I don't go to games and I don't by their merch. I do watch most of their games, even this year.

I don't know if my experience is common at all. I tend to think differently than a lot of people. Yesterday at work I said something like "They totally deserve the first pick" in a very sarcastic way, and no one really understood why I took that tone

 

[committedindian86]

Yeah..

More fans is good.

That has nothing to do with the question that I asked you though. I don’t see anything within your post supporting the notion that the Hawks have great fans.

This is not an attack on you, or anyone on this site, but just more of a statement about Hawks fandom as a whole.

Using percentage of capacity for attendance as a way to discredit a fanbase with a bigger arena is ludicrous. The Blackhawks averaged more fans than 12 other NHL teams with arguably the worst roster in the league for the second half of the season.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Interesting that the Ducks got the #1 spot in the pre-draft order.

 

[MrSnrub]

Interesting that the Ducks got the #1 spot in the pre-draft order.

View attachment 706206

They had the best odds; why is that interesting?

 

[Jerzey Devil]

I had no idea the lottery even took place which feels weird as a Devils fan. I had been conditioned to look forward to the draft lottery and draft over the playoffs for the past 10 years.

Congratulations to Hawks fans.

 

[CJV123]

Chicago has always been a hardcore hockey city, with a hardcore Hawks following.

I don't think the word "hardcore" means what you think it does, Jethro.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I don't think the word "hardcore" means what you think it does, Jethro.

"an unyielding or intransigent element in a social or organizational structure, as that part of a group consisting of longtime adherents or those resistant to change."

 

[KPower]

Must suck for the habs that they win the lottery in a bust year and miss out on the franchise player the next year.

 

[Cowumbus]

I mean, what did you want me to provide? Anything I provide would be anecdotal evidence based upon personal experiences. Did you want me to talk about those of us who followed the team through the dark ages of Dollar Bill owning the team? How I grew up listening to my favorite hockey team on the radio with my Dad in the evening, because the cheapskate piece of shit owner refused to televise home games? I've played since I was 5 years old, at high levels, outside of taking men's league years off here and there, and I'm 38. And I couldn't even watch my favorite team, but we used to sit around and listen to them on the radio. Or watching favorite player, after favorite player(star players included) leave in free agency, because the owner refused to pay them, and seeing them play for other teams, including hated rivals like Detroit? Or going to games as a kid with our travel clubs, getting to play on the ice, and getting to feel like NHLers? Or maybe all of us in here trying to support our favorite team, and defend ourselves, and the team, when most the league's fans spew hate and crack rape jokes? How about the parade for the first Cup, that I attended, that had people smashed shoulder to shoulder for miles and miles, in 90 degree heat and the good ol' Chicago 90% summer humidity? Or maybe me and friends staying up until 2-3am to watch triple OT playoff games on work nights in the middle of the week, taking "momentum shots" of tequila, and waking up to go to work the next morning on 3 hours of sleep, hungover as shit? I mean... I'm not sure how you quantify the Hawks "having great fans" outside of personal experiences being told like I just did.

And most the people I grew up with and/or played with are the same type of fans of the team as I am. I mean... I have 26,000 posts on a f***ing hockey message board...

I thought you’d understand that I’m not referring to people on HFBoards.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I thought you’d understand that I’m not referring to people on HFBoards.

The vast majority of my friends and family that are diehard Hawks fans, don't participate on HF in any way. Not even lurking and reading.

 

[Cowumbus]

The vast majority of my friends and family that are diehard Hawks fans, don't participate on HF in any way. Not even lurking and reading.

Yeah and? It’s like that for every fan base.

Using percentage of capacity for attendance as a way to discredit a fanbase with a bigger arena is ludicrous. The Blackhawks averaged more fans than 12 other NHL teams with arguably the worst roster in the league for the second half of the season.

What should I use then? Should I use total numbers like you do? How is that fair to cities like Winnipeg, Columbus, Buffalo where the population is 3-4x smaller?

Again my entire point is that Chicago is not a “hardcore” hockey town. They show out when the team is good for sure.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Yeah and? It’s like that for every fan base.


What should I use then? Should I use total numbers like you do? How is that fair to cities like Winnipeg, Columbus, Buffalo where the population is 3-4x smaller?

Again my entire point is that Chicago is not a “hardcore” hockey town. They show out when the team is good for sure.

Whatever you say.

 

[MCR74]

Congrats Hawks fans.

This thread turned into a predictable shitstorm.

 

[Putt Pirate]

I mean, what did you want me to provide? Anything I provide would be anecdotal evidence based upon personal experiences. Did you want me to talk about those of us who followed the team through the dark ages of Dollar Bill owning the team? How I grew up listening to my favorite hockey team on the radio with my Dad in the evening, because the cheapskate piece of shit owner refused to televise home games? I've played since I was 5 years old, at high levels, outside of taking men's league years off here and there, and I'm 38. And I couldn't even watch my favorite team, but we used to sit around and listen to them on the radio. Or watching favorite player, after favorite player(star players included) leave in free agency, because the owner refused to pay them, and seeing them play for other teams, including hated rivals like Detroit? Or going to games as a kid with our travel clubs, getting to play on the ice, and getting to feel like NHLers? Or maybe all of us in here trying to support our favorite team, and defend ourselves, and the team, when most the league's fans spew hate and crack rape jokes? How about the parade for the first Cup, that I attended, that had people smashed shoulder to shoulder for miles and miles, in 90 degree heat and the good ol' Chicago 90% summer humidity? Or maybe me and friends staying up until 2-3am to watch triple OT playoff games on work nights in the middle of the week, taking "momentum shots" of tequila, and waking up to go to work the next morning on 3 hours of sleep, hungover as shit? I mean... I'm not sure how you quantify the Hawks "having great fans" outside of personal experiences being told like I just did.

And most the people I grew up with and/or played with are the same type of fans of the team as I am. I mean... I have 26,000 posts on a f***ing hockey message board...

I doubt that poster has much of a reply. That bolded specifically chapped me back then. It was THE dumbest thing Bill could have done but he kept it that way until he died. Even with all his money grabbing and not icing a reasonable team or trading very good players at their peak just because he didn’t want to pay them…..we stuck around. The fans have been passionate but also pretty smart. They don’t show up for a shit product which most markets don’t. They showed up this year because KD was honest and explained the path. Hawks have a great fan base and I have zero idea what that poster even thinking.