2023-24 Roster Thread #6: A Hall of Famer, a doctor, a policeman and a moose walk into a bar with a Bundy...

[freakydallas13]

I said I think the Flyers will be a playoff team next season & a real threat when Michkov arrives in 2026, as long as they don’t sell off everything they have.

If they sell off everything they’ve got over age 24, like so many here want, then they won’t make the playoffs next season, won’t entice Michkov to try to come over early, & when Michkov arrives he’ll join a crappy team.

Do you think being a playoff team and being a legitimate cup contender are the same thing?

 

[JojoTheWhale]

All framing of re-signing Walker or any other player should include it costing the assets you could get for them at the deadline or it's wrong.

 

[FlyerNutter]

it’s funny how I hate this team more than any other in the NHL

Good luck finding a fanbase in 15-20 years

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Do you think being a playoff team and being a legitimate cup contender are the same thing?

Do you think you should gut your team unless you are a legit Cup contender?

I thought I made my thoughts pretty clear in this thread. You need to walk before you can run. Making the playoffs is part of the progression & I think it would be good for the organization.

Many here would prefer they tear down everything with Michkov joining a bottom feeder.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Do you think you should gut your team unless you are a legit Cup contender?

I thought I made my thoughts pretty clear in this thread. You need to walk before you can run. Making the playoffs is part of the progression & I think it would be good for the organization.

Many here would prefer they tear down everything with Michkov joining a bottom feeder.

The alternative is continuing the Hextall 2.0 thing they're doing. For all the time you've spent slamming Hextall as a failure I'm not sure why you want to repeat that path.

 

[trostol]

I said I think the Flyers will be a playoff team next season & a real threat when Michkov arrives in 2026, as long as they don’t sell off everything they have.

If they sell off everything they’ve got over age 24, like so many here want, then they won’t make the playoffs next season, won’t entice Michkov to try to come over early, & when Michkov arrives he’ll join a crappy team.

That's going to happen anyway since atm we aren't rebuilding like we should be

 

[freakydallas13]

Do you think you should gut your team unless you are a legit Cup contender?

I thought I made my thoughts pretty clear in this thread. You need to walk before you can run. Making the playoffs is part of the progression & I think it would be good for the organization.

Many here would prefer they tear down everything with Michkov joining a bottom feeder.

I didn't say you should gut your team unless you are a legit cup contender? I was just asking when you think this team will be a legitimate cup contender, which I have to assume you think 2026.

I think it's possible the team is a contender by that point, but is unlikely to happen without a significant injection of talent (above and beyond Michkov). As Vlad alluded to a lot of things have to go right for that to happen. Actually, I think pretty much every single variable of consequence has to break the Flyers way for that to be the case (all major prospects are better than imagined, roster players like Coots and Hart play at near selke/Vezina levels, every young player on the roster progresses several years in a row). If all of those things happen, and they can add an elite defender or 2 somehow? Sure, they could be a good team. A team that looks like a cup threat.

In my estimation, the chance that all of these simultaneously come to fruition is low. We'll have a better sense going into next season though, and how Briere handles the roster between now and then will be crucial.

Not to mention the downside if the team just becomes okay, neither good nor bad but Hextall era first round playoff fodder. My fear is, this is most likely outcome. From where I'm standing it looks like we are lurching towards repeating the last decade or so of Flyers hockey. Towards becoming an eternal Minnesota v.2.0.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I am begging people to start dropping this grandiose phrasing. You might as well be talking about whether Jesus died for our sins. You don’t have to tear it down to the studs. You don’t have to incrementally walk before you can run. You can take almost any path as long as you do it well.

 

[freakydallas13]

The alternative is continuing the Hextall 2.0 thing they're doing. For all the time you've spent slamming Hextall as a failure I'm not sure why you want to repeat that path.

Hextall made the playoffs half the seasons he was in charge. And at the same time, no one cares that those team made the playoffs; it's a nothing accomplishment.

 

[FlyerNutter]

I am begging people to start dropping this grandiose phrasing. You might as well be talking about whether Jesus died for our sins. You don’t have to tear it down to the studs. You don’t have to incrementally walk before you can run. You can take almost any path as long as you do it well.

Last point the key to the phrase.

This team isn’t going to do the half ass rebuild path well.

No way that’s happening with all the same pigs around.

So really… unless they can overcome organizational/staff flaws with truly superstar talent. They aren’t doing shit, except hanging banners for first round championships.

This approach is all a big ass waste of time. Maddening.

Nobody that supports this bullshit dares to address the issue of the same men that lead us into this quagmire still being very much around. Cowards.

 

[FlyerNutter]

I didn't say you should gut your team unless you are a legit cup contender? I was just asking when you think this team will be a legitimate cup contender, which I have to assume you think 2026.

I think it's possible the team is a contender by that point, but is unlikely to happen without a significant injection of talent (above and beyond Michkov). As Vlad alluded to a lot of things have to go right for that to happen. Actually, I think pretty much every single variable of consequence has to break the Flyers way for that to be the case (all major prospects are better than imagined, roster players like Coots and Hart play at near selke/Vezina levels, every young player on the roster progresses several years in a row). If all of those things happen, and they can add an elite defender or 2 somehow? Sure, they could be a good team. A team that looks like a cup threat.

In my estimation, the chance that all of these simultaneously come to fruition is low. We'll have a better sense going into next season though, and how Briere handles the roster between now and then will be crucial.

Not to mention the downside if the team just becomes okay, neither good nor bad but Hextall era first round playoff fodder. My fear is, this is most likely outcome. From where I'm standing it looks like we are lurching towards repeating the last decade or so of Flyers hockey. Towards becoming an eternal Minnesota v.2.0.

This is very much headed to that, and that’s the point.

So they can hang their hats on making the playoffs but doing jack shit once in.

Islanders
Minny
Calgary
Blues

The blueprint is very evident. They will have Matvei, Cutter, and whoever they pick 10OA this year. Rebuild complete.

 

[Chicken N Raffls]

I am begging people to start dropping this grandiose phrasing. You might as well be talking about whether Jesus died for our sins. You don’t have to tear it down to the studs. You don’t have to incrementally walk before you can run. You can take almost any path as long as you do it well.

The thing that worries me, and I'm sure others, is that this org has done next to nothing to show they understand any of those paths. It seems like even when they get a thing or two right, they screw up something else. I'd be happy with a clear plan that they stick to.

They say they're rebuilding and fans should be patient. Cool. Then they say, maybe it won't be as long as they thought. Just pick something and run with it. If it doesn't work out, hey that's sports. You can't control everything. I'm just sick of the runaround. I don't need a dynasty. Winning multiple cups these days is very difficult to say the least. Just give me a team with a clear vision and moves that show they believe in it instead of being distracted by "Oh, shiny!"

 

[Tripod]

Re-signing Walker instead of trading him is not a rebuilding move. Just like not trading Laughton is not a rebuilding move.

100% both should be trade if they really are rebuilding. Having a 32 year old Walker with 1 year on his deal when MM comes over, really makes a difference? Come on.

 

[thedjpd]

I am begging people to start dropping this grandiose phrasing. You might as well be talking about whether Jesus died for our sins. You don’t have to tear it down to the studs. You don’t have to incrementally walk before you can run. You can take almost any path as long as you do it well.

This is really the truth of it.

The reality is the path to contention has many options, but all depends on good management.

Do we have that? I don't know. And the truth is, nobody here does.

The whole "stanley cup contenders have always had top 5" is true, but our latest example includes these players that weren't the originally drafted by them. So, it's slightly disingenuous to say that only drafting your own picks is the way.

The truth, is and always will be: competent management is the right path. We haven't had that, nor do we even know what it looks like. So we can only hope - I'd rather choose that path than just grumble constantly.

 

[FlyerNutter]

This is really the truth of it.

The reality is the path to contention has many options, but all depends on good management.

Do we have that? I don't know. And the truth is, nobody here does.

The whole "stanley cup contenders have always had top 5" is true, but our latest example includes these players that weren't the originally drafted by them. So, it's slightly disingenuous to say that only drafting your own picks is the way.

The truth, is and always will be: competent management is the right path. We haven't had that, nor do we even know what it looks like. So we can only hope - I'd rather choose that path than just grumble constantly.

The management, and more important scouting/development all are the same people.

It is actually quite easy to say that we do know if it’s good enough - which is an easy no.

They sold Briere as “change”, then hired the biggest homer in Jones while keeping everyone else around. Worship a HC that’s as old school as you could get in the league.

A new pair of tires on a 95 Caravan.

 

[wankstifier]

The thing that worries me, and I'm sure others, is that this org has done next to nothing to show they understand any of those paths. It seems like even when they get a thing or two right, they screw up something else. I'd be happy with a clear plan that they stick to.

They say they're rebuilding and fans should be patient. Cool. Then they say, maybe it won't be as long as they thought. Just pick something and run with it. If it doesn't work out, hey that's sports. You can't control everything. I'm just sick of the runaround. I don't need a dynasty. Winning multiple cups these days is very difficult to say the least. Just give me a team with a clear vision and moves that show they believe in it instead of being distracted by "Oh, shiny!"

They just were trying to dump Sanheim and now he's their franchise defender. They'll stumble to success if they're lucky.

 

[freakydallas13]

The management, and more important scouting/development all are the same people.

It is actually quite easy to say that we do know if it’s good enough - which is an easy no.

They sold Briere as “change”, then hired the biggest homer in Jones while keeping everyone else around. Worship a HC that’s as old school as you could get in the league.

A new pair of tires on a 95 Caravan.

I wish I could get behind the optimism the contrarians feel, but I really can't see it breaking that way. Almost all of the team's management is the same. All the advisers are still here. The special assistant to the previous GM is now the GM. The broadcaster was promoted to president.

I don't see enough change to make me trust the people that run this team yet. Not even close.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

This is very much headed to that, and that’s the point.

So they can hang their hats on making the playoffs but doing jack shit once in.

Islanders
Minny
Calgary
Blues

The blueprint is very evident. They will have Matvei, Cutter, and whoever they pick 10OA this year. Rebuild complete.

wait so a 12OA pick isnt gunna bring home the cup

 

[scumpup]

Positives of the Flyers roster:

Goaltending/pipeline looks the best it has ever been. We're set on goalies for a long time hopefully.
Our forward depth looks really good, Lucking into drafting 1 elite Center and buying Connor McDavid when hes a UFA could be a viable strategy for a 2026 cup run. Just don't over pay our players. (they will)

Somehow draft an elite #1D and another strong top 4 defenseman before 2026.

THEN we just have to have a forward thinking and modern coaching staff who can give the team real structure and develops players to their strengths instead of whatever the f*** we currently do...

So yea with the pieces we currently have, a competent staff could turn this team into a contender by 2026. Just like it's been for the last 10 years. Unfortunately management is f***ing stupid and will always be.

 

[BiggE]

The Flyers have never really adjusted to the salary cap era. In the past, they could trade and/or spend their way to contention. But that just won’t work anymore. Until they grasp the concept of draft and (key word coming here) develop, they will continue to yo-yo between bad and ok.

Not only have they missed the boat on proper player development, but they still seem incapable of grasping at how the game is successfully played in this era. They continually get excited over the wrong players, ie Provorov, Atkinson, Risto and the usual 4th line plugs, while undervaluing effective players like Ghost, Jake, Sanheim and Frost.

Sorry, but just replacing Cuck with Briere is not going to change the trajectory of this franchise.

 

[FlyerNutter]

The Flyers have never really adjusted to the salary cap era. In the past, they could trade and/or spend their way to contention. But that just won’t work anymore. Until they grasp the concept of draft and (key word coming here) develop, they will continue to yo-yo between bad and ok.

Not only have they missed the boat on proper player development, but they still seem incapable of grasping at how the game is successfully played in this era. They continually get excited over the wrong players, ie Provorov, Atkinson, Risto and the usual 4th line plugs, while undervaluing effective players like Ghost, Jake, Sanheim and Frost.

Sorry, but just replacing Cuck with Briere is not going to change the trajectory of this franchise.

It’s why I can’t bring myself to get excited until we see an ownership change.

Which I’ll be the first to admit, may never happen - which sucks ass.

Comcast has been very transparent that they are against - and terrified of the idea that the “old guard”, and long time employees need to be evicted. There is a portion of the fanbase that would lose their minds over that as well.

We just know what Buffalo felt like for years, and what Edmonton feels like RN - although at least they have a few star players. We have what exactly. Cates, Brink, and York? Please.

 

[Magua]

The answer is clear. Play the PK units on the PP. The extra man can get extra rest.

 

[Chicken N Raffls]

The answer is clear. Play the PK units on the PP. The extra man can get extra rest.

Every time we get a PP this year, or the last few for that matter, I just yell "Decline!"

 

[Striiker]

Such spectacular dishonesty! For months you did not explicitly say either were better than Ghost. Quite the opposite, in fact.

It'd be a shame if someone kept receipts in anticipation of someone lying about exactly this...

 

[Starat327]

It'd be a shame if someone kept receipts in anticipation of someone lying about exactly this...

We've got this idiot on ignore for a reason.