Speculation: 2023-24 Free Agency/Trade Thread II

[Zegs2sendhelp]

PV changes his mind often. First he said we didn't need a rebuild and the next step was to be contenders only to go scorched earth. He said he preferred overripened prospects over rushing, but he rushed a lot of youths last year. Verbeek stated he wanted a C who will be here a long while, changing the tradition of having a C for the past two years to quickly stated he will have a C now, but none of the youths have earned the right to wear the C - so does that mean the next captain will be a vet, bridge captain? Remember the whole height stuff, welp, PV used a 5th round pick on 5'11 Ben Meyers. And if PV doesn't re-sign him, then we wasted a 5th round pick. Also, if PV was patient, then this next season should be another dev season, but PV wants to acquire a top-4RD and top-6RW.

PV flip flops on his ideals more often than Pac Sun sells sandals.

You can get a top 6 rw and a top 4 rhd and still go into next season under the idea that it’s developmental.

Improving the roster doesn’t make it not a developmental season.

I like Pierre a lot as an insider and think he is written off too much by some on HF. he's actually one of the better national reporters when it comes to Ducks info i'd say as well. His comment about us being deep up front and as such is a reason we could afford to trade Zegs is just blatantly wrong though.

A lot of national reporters don't have accurate takes on our current forward group as well as those in our pipeline - outside of a few great young players, we have very little and in fact zero blue-chip forward prospects i'd say (outside of Gauthier, if you wanna include him)

Meh if you changed up front to top 6 center…. Prob fits fine

Carlsson mctavish zegras and gauthier all look like top 6 centers….

Carlsson is pv pick
Gauthier pv went out of his way to snag, and seems like a perfect pv fit stylistically
Mctavish is prob closer to what pv wants than zegras.

We could also potentially draft lindstrom at 3 who again looks like a fit for what pv wants to do


Zegras hasn’t exactly been great off the wing.

 

[Boo Boo]

You can get a top 6 rw and a top 4 rhd and still go into next season under the idea that it’s developmental.

Improving the roster doesn’t make it not a developmental season.



Meh if you changed up front to top 6 center…. Prob fits fine

Carlsson mctavish zegras and gauthier all look like top 6 centers….

Carlsson is pv pick
Gauthier pv went out of his way to snag, and seems like a perfect pv fit stylistically
Mctavish is prob closer to what pv wants than zegras.

We could also potentially draft lindstrom at 3 who again looks like a fit for what pv wants to do


Zegras hasn’t exactly been great off the wing.

I really don’t think gauthier will get all that many looks at center here. cronin and verbeek like him too much with Leo and that’s probably a good spot for him

 

[Deuce22]

PV changes his mind often. First he said we didn't need a rebuild and the next step was to be contenders only to go scorched earth. He said he preferred overripened prospects over rushing, but he rushed a lot of youths last year. Verbeek stated he wanted a C who will be here a long while, changing the tradition of having a C for the past two years to quickly stated he will have a C now, but none of the youths have earned the right to wear the C - so does that mean the next captain will be a vet, bridge captain? Remember the whole height stuff, welp, PV used a 5th round pick on 5'11 Ben Meyers. And if PV doesn't re-sign him, then we wasted a 5th round pick. Also, if PV was patient, then this next season should be another dev season, but PV wants to acquire a top-4RD and top-6RW.

PV flip flops on his ideals more often than Pac Sun sells sandals.

Or perhaps everything he says shouldn't be taken as gospel.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I don't think the fans will care if PV builds a contender.

Zegras puts butts in seats. 2 more years of boring, non-playoff hockey does not put butts in seats, and that’s what you get trading Z for draft picks - nobody outside Celibrini will be doing anything substantial for 3-4 years.

And the flip side is that Verbeek is very far from a lock to build a contender. The Yzerplan has been going for quite a few years, and then there’s always Buffalo. Continuously recycling young players for younger players is not a proven path to success.

 

[anezthes]

I think the thing I like least about my Ducks is Pat Verbeek.

 

[Mr Rogers]

You can get a top 6 rw and a top 4 rhd and still go into next season under the idea that it’s developmental.

Improving the roster doesn’t make it not a developmental season.



Meh if you changed up front to top 6 center…. Prob fits fine

Carlsson mctavish zegras and gauthier all look like top 6 centers….

Carlsson is pv pick
Gauthier pv went out of his way to snag, and seems like a perfect pv fit stylistically
Mctavish is prob closer to what pv wants than zegras.

We could also potentially draft lindstrom at 3 who again looks like a fit for what pv wants to do


Zegras hasn’t exactly been great off the wing.

We don’t have the offensive depth to trade him unless we are getting a better player back.

 

[tomd]

We don’t have the offensive depth to trade him unless we are getting a better player back.

That is a reasonable stance but OTOH I think Gauthier, Carlsson, McTavish, Terry, Killorn, Vatrano is a pretty solid top 5 and the top 6 RW that PV wants to get this summer makes it a pretty solid top six.

Edit: my original math was wrong...the players I listed form a solid top six. Adding another top 6 RW makes 7. Barring injuries it's a solid group and does make Zegras a bit expendable if PV decides to move him for help in other areas.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

We don’t have the offensive depth to trade him unless we are getting a better player back.

What @Tom said

Also more cap space so they can acquire better fits

 

[anezthes]

What @Tom said

Also more cap space so they can acquire better fits

1. We have a ton of cap space.
2. Nobody on this team is as good as Z at generating scoring chances. How is he a poor fit?

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

1. We have a ton of cap space.
2. Nobody on this team is as good as Z at generating scoring chances. How is he a poor fit?

Strictly speaking from pvs perspective, as I’m against moving him

 

[tomd]

Strictly speaking from pvs perspective, as I’m against moving him

Yeah, we need to be quite clear that this is not a fan driven desire. If Zegras is traded it will be more PV molding the organization to his desire.

I think some of us have already accepted what might be coming and are just counting on the return to be as good as the return for Drysdale was. If it is, I'll be happy.

 

[Ducks DVM]

That is a reasonable stance but OTOH I think Gauthier, Carlsson, McTavish, Terry, Killorn, Vatrano is a pretty solid top 5 and the top 6 RW that PV wants to get this summer makes it a pretty solid top six.

Edit: my original math was wrong...the players I listed form a solid top six. Adding another top 6 RW makes 7. Barring injuries it's a solid group and does make Zegras a bit expendable if PV decides to move him for help in other areas.

I don’t think that’s a “good” top 6 by any stretch. It’s a group that will be a combination of decline and potential.

Vatrano is under contract for 1 year. Past that is a mystery whether he will fail to continue scoring or will potentially price himself off the team.
Killorn is old, spent the year being repeatedly injured, and should be expected to decline out of a top 6 role in the next 2 years.
I like Terry (a lot) more than most, but 75% of the boards wants to trade him. He’s the only guy to expect production with the other 2 groups though.
Gauthier has played 1 NHL game. He should be expected to fall off in the spring, and take (statistically) 1-2 years to be a dependable top 6 player.
McTavish has fallen off in the second half of both years, and was repeatedly injured last year. He’s still potential, not proven.
Carlsson will be great, assuming that he’s able to bulk up this summer. Also, repeatedly injured. He’s still (huge) potential, not proven, and hast played a full season.

It’s a fair assumption that the kids won’t be legit top 6 until the 2 old guys aren’t actually top 6 any more.

 

[70sSanO]

If Carolina trades Necas for Zegras it will surely be a loser for us.

A team moves a guy who "might" get $7M for a guy that will cost $5.75M now and then $8M+ in a couple years makes no sense, unless the guy you are getting is viewed much higher.

Carolina knows, after multiple cup runs, that Necas is not a playoff type player and is not going to help them get there. And we are only talking about a "max" difference of $1.25M per for 2 years. That doesn't clear much cap space.

I don't think it will be the PLD disaster, but we will be fools to do it.

John

 

[McDonald19]

Zegras puts butts in seats. 2 more years of boring, non-playoff hockey does not put butts in seats, and that’s what you get trading Z for draft picks - nobody outside Celibrini will be doing anything substantial for 3-4 years.

This. Maybe I give H. Samueli too much credit, but Verbeek can’t just trade away the team’s most marketable player for picks and prospects without a serious conversation with ownership.

 

[tomd]

I don’t think that’s a “good” top 6 by any stretch. It’s a group that will be a combination of decline and potential.

Vatrano is under contract for 1 year. Past that is a mystery whether he will fail to continue scoring or will potentially price himself off the team.
Killorn is old, spent the year being repeatedly injured, and should be expected to decline out of a top 6 role in the next 2 years.
I like Terry (a lot) more than most, but 75% of the boards wants to trade him. He’s the only guy to expect production with the other 2 groups though.
Gauthier has played 1 NHL game. He should be expected to fall off in the spring, and take (statistically) 1-2 years to be a dependable top 6 player.
McTavish has fallen off in the second half of both years, and was repeatedly injured last year. He’s still potential, not proven.
Carlsson will be great, assuming that he’s able to bulk up this summer. Also, repeatedly injured. He’s still (huge) potential, not proven, and hast played a full season.

It’s a fair assumption that the kids won’t be legit top 6 until the 2 old guys aren’t actually top 6 any more.

I referred to it as "solid" in the sense that there aren't any guys who clearly aren't top 6 players in that mix. Not a playoff roster but not an utter embarrassment either.

Again, I'm to the point where I've accepted the possibility (probability?) that Zegras will be moved and just looking forward to the return.

 

[DavidBL]

Yeah, we need to be quite clear that this is not a fan driven desire. If Zegras is traded it will be more PV molding the organization to his desire.

I think some of us have already accepted what might be coming and are just counting on the return to be as good as the return for Drysdale was. If it is, I'll be happy.

Sure, but the idea that Z isn't a PV player is entirely media/fan driven. About the only complaint we have ever heard from the organization about Z is that he needs to work on his 200 ft game which by all accounts he has been and to some level of success as well. At the end of the day PV is going to do what PV wants. I won't be happy unless what ever he brings in fills a need and is a player of similar or better upside. I'm not going to sit and complain if Z is in a trade for Brady Tkachuk(at least depending on what the rest of the deal looked like). I'd be sad but I can understand that rationale. The nonsense going around HF however, or even a top pick this year makes no sense to me as who ever we draft might be as good as Z and we wont likely know for 3-4 years. Not even Necas makes sense imo.

As for the depth argument, to me if PV wants to add depth and lessen the loads on the kids you do that by adding someone proven to be better than those kids are now. That's the Reinhart's, Marner's, Sramkos's of the world and they just push guys down. You named 6 reasoble top 6 players on the roster already without Z. So if we add 1 top 6 forward that pushes 1 of those 6 down. You keep Z and now you have 8 out of 9 quality players and Strome who is a middle 6 player. Great depth on the third, and workable for the 2nd line. That's depth. If you move Z and then add another player it's likely lateral or marginal upgrade offensively. It just seems to screems counter intuitive for PVs expressed desires. I'm not saying it won't happen but to me for it to make sense there are a lot of questions that would need to be answered. Most simply, how does it make us better now AND in the future? I struggle to find trade ideas that satisfy that question that are realistic.

 

[Boo Boo]

I don’t think that’s a “good” top 6 by any stretch. It’s a group that will be a combination of decline and potential.

Vatrano is under contract for 1 year. Past that is a mystery whether he will fail to continue scoring or will potentially price himself off the team.
Killorn is old, spent the year being repeatedly injured, and should be expected to decline out of a top 6 role in the next 2 years.
I like Terry (a lot) more than most, but 75% of the boards wants to trade him. He’s the only guy to expect production with the other 2 groups though.
Gauthier has played 1 NHL game. He should be expected to fall off in the spring, and take (statistically) 1-2 years to be a dependable top 6 player.
McTavish has fallen off in the second half of both years, and was repeatedly injured last year. He’s still potential, not proven.
Carlsson will be great, assuming that he’s able to bulk up this summer. Also, repeatedly injured. He’s still (huge) potential, not proven, and hast played a full season.

It’s a fair assumption that the kids won’t be legit top 6 until the 2 old guys aren’t actually top 6 any more.

Thank you - I struggle to place Vatrano and Killorn as sure fire reliable top sixers next year let alone for our contending window (further years to come) and gauthier is a rookie so he’s likely to need an adjustment period and could likely hit a wall. And honestly even Terry needs to show that he’s more than just a compiler on a bad team

 

[All Mighty]

The more I've thought about Necas, the more I think he is probably not the best fit for us. He's a very good offensive player, but he is more of what we already have rather than what we need. IMO our right shot forward target should either be a shooter (Marchessault, Stamkos, Arvidsson, maybe Toffoli) or a two-way guy who can take defensive responsibilities from our young guys (Lindholm). Reinhart would be the ideal fit, but his contract will be too much for my liking, so I'm not considering him a realistic option.

 

[anezthes]

Lindholm

+1. So many line combos that look good on paper.

Z – Carlsson – Lindholm/Terry
Cutter/Killer/Vatrano – McTavish – Lindholm/Strome/Terry
Cutter/Killer/Vatrano – Cutter/Lindholm/Strome – x

 

[All Mighty]

+1. So many line combos that look good on paper.

Z – Carlsson – Lindholm/Terry
Cutter/Killer/Vatrano – McTavish – Lindholm/Strome/Terry
Cutter/Killer/Vatrano – Cutter/Lindholm/Strome – x

He would seriously be a perfect fit. And he would help both special teams units, too. Unfortunately I’m sure there are a number of teams out there who see him as a 2C or maybe even 1C and will pay him accordingly. I would consider offering him 6x$6.5M, but I think that would get beat.

 

[FlyingV09]

This. Maybe I give H. Samueli too much credit, but Verbeek can’t just trade away the team’s most marketable player for picks and prospects without a serious conversation with ownership.

I’ve been saying this for a while, however my tone on Zegras is starting to change a bit after watching the playoffs.

If Verbeek doesn’t see Zegras as a player fitting his mould, I can understand it. Trevor shys away from the dirty areas and that doesn’t work if you’re trying to build a winner.

I still don’t think it would be wise to deal him, but I can understand if Pat is seeing what’s out there.

 

[HanSolo]

People probably should start preparing for the idea Zegras might get dealt. Not saying it’s gonna happen but there’s way too much smoke to still think he’s completely untouchable.

Also, I think Gibby gets dealt. Isn’t hard to fathom that Verbeek would’ve held back on that front until he knew they had a viable replacement and now they probably do. New Jersey makes a lot of sense imo.

There's a difference between not being untouchable and being actively shopped. The issue is a lot of rumor mongers and HF trade board posters seem to think that the latter is the case and a team can scoop up Zegras at a discount. Unless the move clearly makes the Ducks better in the long term (as there's no high pressure to "win now" while the team is still rebuilding) there's no reason to move him. And if Verbeek lets himself get bent over just for the sake of moving on from Z, he should be fired.

 

[cheesymc]

I’ve been saying this for a while, however my tone on Zegras is starting to change a bit after watching the playoffs.

If Verbeek doesn’t see Zegras as a player fitting his mould, I can understand it. Trevor shys away from the dirty areas and that doesn’t work if you’re trying to build a winner.

I still don’t think it would be wise to deal him, but I can understand if Pat is seeing what’s out there.

Not sure if Zegras is meant to play in a non-competing small market team right now. Besides, how focused is he right now when games don't matter and he is busy dating a Dixie D'amelio? He seems to be biding his time for the moment... I don't expect him to come into next season guns blazing and producing big numbers.

 

[MCB]

If Zegras gets traded the team store is going to lose 50% of their jersey sales. (Kidding of course, but most jerseys I see are zegras)

 

[Boo Boo]

Not sure if Zegras is meant to play in a non-competing small market team right now. Besides, how focused is he right now when games don't matter and he is busy dating a Dixie D'amelio? He seems to be biding his time for the moment... I don't expect him to come into next season guns blazing and producing big numbers.

Oh please - every player that age has a girlfriend who does TikTok / social media influencing lol - if anything it should push him to be better because if he’s not a star Dixie will leave his ass for a real celebrity