Speculation: 2023-24 Armchair GM thread

[DigitalBoldy]

For once I'd like to see the Wild trade a guy like Zuccs for a premium instead of letting someone like him walk for nothing.

They basically did this last offseason with Fiala.

 

[AKL]

They basically did this last offseason with Fiala.

It's just disappointing that the one they chose to trade was the 26 year old, not the 36 year old.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

It's just disappointing that the one they chose to trade was the 26 year old, not the 36 year old.

Will remain a stain on Guerin’s resume, which has actually been pretty good since coming to Minnesota IMO.

 

[Wabit]

Will remain a stain on Guerin’s resume, which has actually been pretty good since coming to Minnesota IMO.

I think he's worse than Fletcher.

 

[AKL]

I think he's done a good job of putting lipstick on a pig, but there's still the issue of the pig

 

[Webster]

It's just disappointing that the one they chose to trade was the 26 year old, not the 36 year old.

I'd call it interesting. They let Fiala go, then Dumba. They struggle with the cap, $6 million would really help. But Zucc is still here.

So based on this it seems like they really want him to stay. I think it has a lot to do with Kaprizov, and the fact that he's still one of the better forwards here. I also think they see him as a mentor for Rossi and the other kids coming up.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Last week Zuccarello told Norwegian media that he expects to play another 2-3 years in the NHL.

Hmm...what does he mean by this? Maybe he doesn't even want to re-sign with the Wild. My guess is that his agent has told him to wait, there will probably be more $$ on the table elsewhere.

Was wondering where you went. Hi Webster

I think he's worse than Fletcher.

He's a tad better than Fletcher. Fletcher was a tad better than Riser.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I think he's worse than Fletcher.

How is he worse than Fletcher? He's still having to deal with the repercussions of Fletcher's decisions.

 

[BigT2002]

I think he's worse than Fletcher.

Please elaborate.

 

[JiricekSaveUs]

The effective path that I would take is sell of this year, retool next year when we can take on players in the last year of their deal. Sell players now, like the blues did this year, to aquire assets that we can use in the retool. Move off any players that don’t have long term value. I’d see if I can convince Spurgeon to move, even if I have to retain a million. Hartman would surely fetch a first, might be a deadline thing though. Foligno should go too( though that could also be a deadline deal.

 

[AKL]

How is he worse than Fletcher? He's still having to deal with the repercussions of Fletcher's decisions.

From my perspective, he prioritizes the wrong things, and unless there's a change, it's going to prevent him from building a real contender. So better, worse, I don't know, maybe about the same. I don't see us consistently making deep runs with his teams based on what I've seen so far.

The effective path that I would take is sell of this year, retool next year when we can take on players in the last year of their deal. Sell players now, like the blues did this year, to aquire assets that we can use in the retool. Move off any players that don’t have long term value. I’d see if I can convince Spurgeon to move, even if I have to retain a million. Hartman would surely fetch a first, might be a deadline thing though. Foligno should go too( though that could also be a deadline deal.

I wanna do this

 

[DC4MVP]

The effective path that I would take is sell of this year, retool next year when we can take on players in the last year of their deal. Sell players now, like the blues did this year, to aquire assets that we can use in the retool. Move off any players that don’t have long term value. I’d see if I can convince Spurgeon to move, even if I have to retain a million. Hartman would surely fetch a first, might be a deadline thing though. Foligno should go too( though that could also be a deadline deal.

The problem with that is that I'm sure ownership wants to ensure a full building and throwing an AHL team out there is a great way to ruin the sell-out streak and turn people off from season tickets for the next 2 seasons, minimum.

Is that what the team SHOULD be doing? Yes. This "good enough to make the playoffs" play is annoying year after year after year but I have a feeling that the orders from the top-down are "no rebuilding, stay competitive.."

 

[JiricekSaveUs]

From my perspective, he prioritizes the wrong things, and unless there's a change, it's going to prevent him from building a real contender. So better, worse, I don't know, maybe about the same. I don't see us consistently making deep runs with his teams based on what I've seen so far.



I wanna do this

Zuccy at the deadline too. Problem is that if we’re in contention for a playoff spot he’ll never do it. I wouldn’t mind picking ~10th next year and getting a couple extra firsts like STL did this year. If you get lucky at 10 you could get another Boldy level guy.

 

[TaLoN]

Please elaborate.

Fletcher left with things significantly better than when he arrived.
Bill has kept the team pretty much treading water his entire time, while benefitting from the core build by Fletcher.

Does that make him worse? I don't know... the rules changed after Fletcher's biggest move and that changed the outlook of that move years later. I don't know how to rate Bill right now, but I can't put him ahead of Fletcher yet either.

 

[JiricekSaveUs]

Guerin, despite his faults, is 10x the GM Fletcher was, imo. Unfavorable position, he’s made some questionable calls, but aside from the insistence on competing (losing in round 1) every year, I like his approach of not overpaying for free agents and stockpiling prospects that he can use as ammo when the time comes. I just hope he doesn’t start overpaying when he has money. You have to keep making bargain deals and adding other good players in. Can’t give everyone fair value, then you’re just an average team. You have to create value somewhere

 

[DC4MVP]

Bill has kept the team pretty much treading water his entire time, while benefitting from the core build by Fletcher.

I mean what do you expect him to do? It's pretty obvious that the Suter/Parise contracts were going to prevent this team from doing anything but treading water until the big hits are off the books. I think everyone agrees that it had to be done.

He can't sign anyone...he really can't trade for any big name especially a 1C. He's basically relegated to bringing guys back to field a roster that can make it to the first round and keep bums in seat while building an A+ prospect pipeline.

Now, that's not saying some of his moves were questionable i.e. Gologoski but I'm 100% certain Leipold and GMBG have an understanding that the goal is to get through the Parise/Suter debacle before Leipold starts to put Billy on the hot seat. In my opinion, it's tough to grade out GMBG until he has money to do something besides keep the core together as best as possible.

 

[AKL]

I mean what do you expect him to do? It's pretty obvious that the Suter/Parise contracts were going to prevent this team from doing anything but treading water until the big hits are off the books. I think everyone agrees that it had to be done.

He can't sign anyone...he really can't trade for any big name especially a 1C. He's basically relegated to bringing guys back to field a roster that can make it to the first round and keep bums in seat while building an A+ prospect pipeline.

Now, that's not saying some of his moves were questionable i.e. Gologoski but I'm 100% certain Leipold and GMBG have an understanding that the goal is to get through the Parise/Suter debacle before Leipold starts to put Billy on the hot seat.

I don't see that he's done this.

 

[DC4MVP]

I don't see that he's done this.

I mean everyone grades the Wild pipeline as one of, if not the best prospect pools in the league (even sans Boldy). Of course, Fletcher did have parts to do that but GMBG hasn't torn it down but has rather built it up over the past 4years where it's pretty deep however lacking in top-end star power which is the result of mostly picking in the 20's.

 

[AKL]

I mean everyone grades the Wild pipeline as one of, if not the best prospect pools in the league. Of course, Fletcher did have parts to do that but GMBG hasn't torn it down but has rather built it up where it's pretty deep however lacking in top-end star power which is the result of mostly picking in the 20's.

You can't have an A+ pipeline when your biggest hole is "star power". I'm not even sure you could reasonably call it an A or A-.

Everyone rated Fletcher's pipeline as one of the best about a decade ago too and look at how that turned out. Star power>depth every single time.

 

[JiricekSaveUs]

The problem with that is that I'm sure ownership wants to ensure a full building and throwing an AHL team out there is a great way to ruin the sell-out streak and turn people off from season tickets for the next 2 seasons, minimum.

Is that what the team SHOULD be doing? Yes. This "good enough to make the playoffs" play is annoying year after year after year but I have a feeling that the orders from the top-down are "no rebuilding, stay competitive.."

There’s a difference between throwing an AHL team out there and making smart long term decisions on some of your assets. Kaprizov, Boldy, Brodin will keep the team competitive enough.

 

[DC4MVP]

There’s a difference between throwing an AHL team out there and making smart long term decisions on some of your assets. Kaprizov, Boldy, Brodin will keep the team competitive enough.

I don't have the faith in Boldy yet to be a player that can keep a team afloat based off whatever that excuse of a playoff series was. Kaprizov can't do it himself as we saw in the playoffs. Brodin & Faber would be a great 1st pairing but that'd be it. I just don't see the team being a playoff team if you just roll with those three and fill the gaps in with youth or 3rd/4th liners until the big contracts are off the books.

But alas, there's no point in debating over it as GMBG isn't tearing the team down. It would have been done by now.

 

[thestonedkoala]

I mean everyone grades the Wild pipeline as one of, if not the best prospect pools in the league (even sans Boldy). Of course, Fletcher did have parts to do that but GMBG hasn't torn it down but has rather built it up over the past 4years where it's pretty deep however lacking in top-end star power which is the result of mostly picking in the 20's.

Fletcher also had one of the best prospect pools in the league along with the best prospect in the world.

 

[DC4MVP]

You can't have an A+ pipeline when your biggest hole is "star power". I'm not even sure you could reasonably call it an A or A-.

Everyone rated Fletcher's pipeline as one of the best about a decade ago too and look at how that turned out. Star power>depth every single time.

Well that's the problem lol

You can't get star-power unless you suck. GMBG hasn't built/deconstructed enough to be a sucky team to be able to pick those top-10 players.

But the deeper the pool, the better chance you have at 4-5 guys being solid contributors. I mean Faber has potential to be a star and while he wasn't a pick, he did bring him in.

You're rarely going to find the star power when you're a perennial playoff team. Can't have it both ways.

 

[DC4MVP]

Fletcher also had one of the best prospect pools in the league along with the best prospect in the world.

That's great and he had 10x the flexibility in his tenure that GMBG has because of Chuck's signing of Parise/Suter. Had to be done and was HGUE at the time but it's the reason GMBG can't do anything at the moment.

But hey, if you want to fire GMBG and bring back Fletcher, I'm sure he has some time on his hands at the moment.

I honestly cannot believe this forum has devolved into thinking Fletcher is better than Guerin and some of you would rather have Fletcher.

 

[AKL]

Well that's the problem lol

You can't get star-power unless you suck. GMBG hasn't built/deconstructed enough to be a sucky team to be able to pick those top-10 players.

But the deeper the pool, the better chance you have at 4-5 guys being solid contributors. I mean Faber has potential to be a star and while he wasn't a pick, he did bring him in.

You're rarely going to find the star power when you're a perennial playoff team. Can't have it both ways.

My point was just that he hasn't built an A+ pipeline. I know why he hasn't been able to and I understand his justifications, but it's still not an A+ pipeline with just a bunch of depth and no star power.