Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion

[Cas]

So Imagine something like this next season:

Ekklund-Couture-Tarasenko
Gushchin-Hertl-Zetterlund
Granlund-Celebrini-Smith
Sturm-Bystedt-Zadina/Bordeleau/Coe/Robbins/G.Smith

Gostisbehere-Benning
Ferraro-Thrun
Mukhamadullin-Burroughs/Knyzhov/Okhotiuk

Blackwood
Chrona

That team still has, what, 15 million in cap space? Not to mention a lot of assets they could move for help" Musty, Halttunen, other prospects, assets they get back for trades they make this season, Pittsburgh's first, New Jersey's first/second...

That's a 50 point team without a miracle. Could be worse because the defense remains garbage, just not "couldn't beat a team of dead people" bad like this year.

 

[Barrie22]

For the ones that aren't paying attention, Zadina is the worst player in the league defensively. That is the reason he is being bounced around, even when he scores he still allows to many goals against.

 

[OrrNumber4]

That's a 50 point team without a miracle. Could be worse because the defense remains garbage, just not "couldn't beat a team of dead people" bad like this year.

....you're probably right, but one can see the potential for that being a playoff team. With so many youngsters, there's a greater chance of the roster exceeding expectations. As I said, the assumption would be fixing Celebrini and Smith as at least top-9 capable, but would it really be implausible that they have top-6 production? With Blackwood standing strong and some progression from the defense...

In some ways it would be like the 2019-2021 Sharks; just hoping a bargain-basement pickup or prospect elevates his game. But these would be much stronger bets.

 

[Jargon]

I think with cap space we can sign some actual top 6 players to help the rookies coming in… if top 6 players want to sign on this god forsaken team.

I think our future forward group has a lot of potential especially if we can actually win 1st overall this year. But our defense situation is really really really grim.

We have to pray that Muhk and Thrun can step in next year and be a legit 2nd pairing. But our options for that first pairing is… Yeah, grim.

 

[Cas]

....you're probably right, but one can see the potential for that being a playoff team. With so many youngsters, there's a greater chance of the roster exceeding expectations. As I said, the assumption would be fixing Celebrini and Smith as at least top-9 capable, but would it really be implausible that they have top-6 production? With Blackwood standing strong and some progression from the defense...

In some ways it would be like the 2019-2021 Sharks; just hoping a bargain-basement pickup or prospect elevates his game. But these would be much stronger bets.

I think that team scores 200 goals and gives up 275. It's just too far away for playoff hopes.

I think Smith - Celebrini would approach marginal top nine production in year one and achieve top six year three.

The defense isn't going to progress - Gostisbehere, Benning, Ferraro, and Burroughs are finished products - bottom pair or extra guys, save Ghost as a #4. Knyzhov and Okhotiuk are likely who they are going to be already - bottom pair or #7 guys. Muk and Thrun are maybe #3-4 guys, maybe a little more for Muk and a little less for Thrun, but likely need another year before reaching that. It's still worst defense in the league quality.

The only way that team exceeds expectations, in my opinion, is if Blackwood is the second coming of Hasek and the prospects develop higher faster than I think is reasonable.

I get optimism and hope, I really do, but this team is just too far away and has too little to build off of right now. This is just going to take several years and we are all going to have to accept that.

 

[Skeksis25]

I feel that expecting Eklund, Gushchin, Smith, Bystedt and next year's first rounder to all pan out and be contributors to a "hopeful playoff contending team" is just wishes and dreams. I realize most fanbases dream of every prospect meeting expectations and penciling them into future lineups, but its not reality. We'll be lucky if 2 of those guys end up being solid players or better.

 

[OrrNumber4]

I feel that expecting Eklund, Gushchin, Smith, Bystedt and next year's first rounder to all pan out and be contributors to a "hopeful playoff contending team" is just wishes and dreams. I realize most fanbases dream of every prospect meeting expectations and penciling them into future lineups, but its not reality. We'll be lucky if 2 of those guys end up being solid players or better.

Maybe. Eklund is showing that he belongs this year. Smith has the caveat. Given Bystedt's SHL performance, I think he could be a fourth-liner off-the-bat (or if not, sign someone in free agency). Gushcshin is a bit of a stretch, but his AHL numbers are rock-solid; he's topping Kevin Labanc's numbers.

 

[timorous me]

Maybe. Eklund is showing that he belongs this year. Smith has the caveat. Given Bystedt's SHL performance, I think he could be a fourth-liner off-the-bat (or if not, sign someone in free agency). Gushcshin is a bit of a stretch, but his AHL numbers are rock-solid; he's topping Kevin Labanc's numbers.

Yeah, I think "lucky if two of those guys end up solid or better" is a little too negative with what we know and have seen, though I suppose "solid" can mean different things to different people.

Eklund has certainly shown he has the ability to reach my definition of solid or better (hell, you could probably say he's already "solid" but isn't putting up the points to prove that just yet), and Smith has the pedigree and, if nothing else, is massively skilled, which bodes well for being some kind of useful contributor (especially on the power play).

Beyond those two it's more of a crapshoot, but I think there are reasons for optimism with Bystedt, And who can't be a little unreasonably hopeful when it comes to Gushchin? They can't wait forever to bring him up if he keeps scoring with the Cuda, so it's going to be really interesting to see how Quinn manages him when the time comes this year.

 

[Anomie2029]

Yeah, I think "lucky if two of those guys end up solid or better" is a little too negative with what we know and have seen, though I suppose "solid" can mean different things to different people.

Eklund has certainly shown he has the ability to reach my definition of solid or better (hell, you could probably say he's already "solid" but isn't putting up the points to prove that just yet), and Smith has the pedigree and, if nothing else, is massively skilled, which bodes well for being some kind of useful contributor (especially on the power play).

Beyond those two it's more of a crapshoot, but I think there are reasons for optimism with Bystedt, And who can't be a little unreasonably hopeful when it comes to Gushchin? They can't wait forever to bring him up if he keeps scoring with the Cuda, so it's going to be really interesting to see how Quinn manages him when the time comes this year.

Guschin will make a poor turnover once and Quinn will move him down the lines before scratching him.

I have zero doubts Quinn would scratch and send Eklund down if he knew he wouldn’t be pulled from pillar to post .

 

[mogambomoroo]

Couple of trade ideas for now, a feedback would be appreciated:

Trade 1:
SJS: Jack Campbell, '24 1st round pick (unprotected) OR
'24 and '25 1st round pick (top 10 protected)

EDM: Blackwood, Duclair (50% retained) and Jan Rutta

Unprotected '24 1st round pick or,
'24 and '25 protected 1st round picks for taking Campbell.
It's a risky move for Edmonton, but they get depth in offence, defence and a goaltender.
Duclair = Finals last year, forward that will score with a good offensive team.
Rutta = Stanley Cup winning 3rd pair RD, perfect for Edmonton
Blackwood = Played out of his mind for this awful Sharks team.

Main point is Oilers need to get rid of that Campbell contract.

Trade 2:
SJS: Adam Boqvist, Erik Gudbranson, Sean Kuraly and 1st round pick (not sure if top 10 protected)

CBJ: Tomas Hertl, Ty Emberson

Hertl is their future 2nd line C with Fantilli growing. Columbus loses depth pieces and a bad contract in a process.
Adam Boqvist and 1st are the main pieces coming back to Sharks, since we need an RD that has some potential.
Also Sharks trust that they can draft Celebrini with their own 1st round pick and draft bunch of defencemen with their other 1st round picks.

 

[Cas]

I'd do the Campbell trade so fast I'd break my phone. Three spare parts for a worse spare part and a high or at worst middling 1st?

 

[mogambomoroo]

I'd do the Campbell trade so fast I'd break my phone. Three spare parts for a worse spare part and a high or at worst middling 1st?

I feel like Edmonton could be desperate enough and take this trade, since they have the offensive juggernaut of McDavid/Draisaitl and they have no reason to be as bad as they are right now.
I feel like with Campbell it's all inside his head and with no pressure to succeed and being our starter for these couple of bad years could actually bring him back to reasonable numbers.

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

i kinda feel like bringing Chrona up is to acclimate him to NHL play before we deal Blackwood. Blackwood on a contender would be a big time pick up. Blackwood to Edmonton would make them a tougher matchup than they already are imo.

 

[Mattb124]

The rest is all fair enough, but I wanted to quibble on this point. Perhaps I'm being unfair to Rantanen (as I was to Letang), who gets overshadowed by Mackinnon and Makar. But looking at his accomplishments, does anything really stand out? One season over 40 goals (last year). no major trophies (I think he made an all-star team in the shortened season), one time finishing top-3 in goals...very good, but superstar-worthy? Plus, IMO, his counting stats are bolstered by his teammates far more than they are vitiated by him being third-fiddle.

Think of it like Karlsson in the Sharks from last year. Without anyone else to carry the team, he really had to step up and had a historic year in terms of scoring. I think you would see the same sort of phenomenon with Rantanen if he lacked a quality supporting cast.

 

[gaucholoco3]

i kinda feel like bringing Chrona up is to acclimate him to NHL play before we deal Blackwood. Blackwood on a contender would be a big time pick up. Blackwood to Edmonton would make them a tougher matchup than they already are imo.

Chrona was brought up because Kak was probably in concussion protocol and they couldn’t confirm he would be cleared in time.

 

[Hobocop]

i kinda feel like bringing Chrona up is to acclimate him to NHL play before we deal Blackwood. Blackwood on a contender would be a big time pick up. Blackwood to Edmonton would make them a tougher matchup than they already are imo.

Chrona was just brought up to back up Blackwood while Kahkonen was banged up. I'm guessing there were no plans to play him at all originally, but then the Penguins game got out of hand.

Chrona's also already been sent back down to the AHL.

 

[OrrNumber4]

Couple of trade ideas for now, a feedback would be appreciated:

Trade 1:
SJS: Jack Campbell, '24 1st round pick (unprotected) OR
'24 and '25 1st round pick (top 10 protected)

EDM: Blackwood, Duclair (50% retained) and Jan Rutta

Unprotected '24 1st round pick or,
'24 and '25 protected 1st round picks for taking Campbell.
It's a risky move for Edmonton, but they get depth in offence, defence and a goaltender.
Duclair = Finals last year, forward that will score with a good offensive team.
Rutta = Stanley Cup winning 3rd pair RD, perfect for Edmonton
Blackwood = Played out of his mind for this awful Sharks team.

Main point is Oilers need to get rid of that Campbell contract.

Trade Kakhonen instead of Blackwood. Very small sample sizes, but the former looks like toast while the latter might have something.

No retention on Duclair.

Trade 2:
SJS: Adam Boqvist, Erik Gudbranson, Sean Kuraly and 1st round pick (not sure if top 10 protected)

CBJ: Tomas Hertl, Ty Emberson

Hertl is their future 2nd line C with Fantilli growing. Columbus loses depth pieces and a bad contract in a process.
Adam Boqvist and 1st are the main pieces coming back to Sharks, since we need an RD that has some potential.
Also Sharks trust that they can draft Celebrini with their own 1st round pick and draft bunch of defencemen with their other 1st round picks.

I'd like to get one more decent asset from them, like Marchenko.

 

[exchequer]

Trade 2:
SJS: Adam Boqvist, Erik Gudbranson, Sean Kuraly and 1st round pick (not sure if top 10 protected)

CBJ: Tomas Hertl, Ty Emberson

Hertl is their future 2nd line C with Fantilli growing. Columbus loses depth pieces and a bad contract in a process.
Adam Boqvist and 1st are the main pieces coming back to Sharks, since we need an RD that has some potential.
Also Sharks trust that they can draft Celebrini with their own 1st round pick and draft bunch of defencemen with their other 1st round picks.

Not going to happen. Hertl has a NMC which I'm pretty sure he would not waive. It's not like he's going to get a new contract if he gets traded.

 

[TheBeard]

Edmonton could probably find a better solution to their problems than Blackwood for a first even with Campbell off the books.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Edmonton could probably find a better solution to their problems than Blackwood for a first even with Campbell off the books.

Edmonton's only going to go as far as McDavid and Draisaitl take them but the biggest problem with getting them help is that they drastically overpaid Nurse and also Campbell. Their blue line is holding them back to a pretty large extent and there's no fixing it while Nurse is still around, imo.

 

[Pavelski2112]

Edmonton has the same problem as every year, no defense and no goaltending. They're finding out the hard way that McDavid and Draisaitl won't be enough for them.

 

[Evgeny Oliker]

So would SJ trade Hertl at the deadline?

 

[hohosaregood]

i feel like now would be a good time to try and grab Bouchard for scraps. Like Bouchard for Rutta+Bordeleau

 

[Pavelski2112]

So would SJ trade Hertl at the deadline?

If anyone wants him and would be ok with taking on his contract, they really really should.

 

[OrrNumber4]

i feel like now would be a good time to try and grab Bouchard for scraps. Like Bouchard for Rutta+Bordeleau

I don't think he's available.