Rumor: 2023-2024 Trade Rumors and Free Agency: Off-season is in full swing

[JH21]

How? He's better than Toews.

Comen man. Dunn is good but he isn't on Toews level.

Dunn signed for 7.35 mil per and I'd expect Toews to sign for 8.5 mil per. 6 years, 51 mil would work for everyone I think.

 

[CobraAcesS]

That would be a mistake imo. You have to get value for Toews or re-sign him. He is too valuable to let go for free. I assume there would a lot demand around the league..

The shiny is more valuable than anything he's going to bring in trade.

 

[AvsCOL]

There's our 3RW hopefully by season's end.

"Forward Nikolay Kovalenko will continue to play for Torpedo on loan. The hockey player will soon sign a contract with the NHL club Colorado Avalanche, but will spend the upcoming season in the KHL."

 

[GoNordiquesGo]

Weird how I’ve gotten a similar question twice today. Nothing has changed really. I’m not down on him, there are just reasonable questions. I still think RyJo has high level play in him. He’s older and is coming off another injury. So some regression is warranted. His effort is still a major question. We just don’t know how he jumps back or if he does. Not sure how people can’t recognize the risk. Yet, if he answers those questions with good answers… he’s a phenomenal player as he showed two seasons ago. If he’s regressed majorly and doesn’t give a shit, he’ll flame out.

I'm pretty sure everyone recognizes the risk. The debate I'm seeing is that :
1) Some think it was a bad move because there is risk, therefore they should have done something else, i.e. unload Girard and use that cap space on a 2C. I'm not sure they realize that it would be very, very hard to keep Toews next year if you use Girard's cap space elsewhere. Or most probably they don't care about next year.
2) Others think it was a good move, despite the risk, because they like the odds, it cost nothiing and we still have G as a asset to use if things go wrong.

Its the exact same think with Drouin. There is risk therefore its a bad move. They should have acquired a bona fide top 6 forward to replace Landeskog. Usually those in that category are the same wo ar in category 1) above. How they think we could have the cap space to get both a real 2C and a real Landeskog replacement is beyond me however...

As for RyJo, I just think that going from "Top 10 when he cares" to "as you describe him now" in roughly a year's time doesn't fit the "nothing has changed really". But that's OK, people can change their mind, nothing wrong with that. Its not like he was amazing in the last few years. Actually I fully agree with your current assessment. Its the previous one that I always thought was over the board.

 

[chet1926]

Hate to break it to you but Dunn isn't really a comp for Toews. Dunn had a career year last year but is probably closer to his 35 pts self. He is closer to Girard than Toews.

There is a reason Toews is always projected on team Canada rosters and Dunn is never.

Toews is going to get paid, GMs around the league value him highly. The only factor for Toews is age, how will that play in.

 

[CobraAcesS]

There's our 3RW hopefully by season's end.

"Forward Nikolay Kovalenko will continue to play for Torpedo on loan. The hockey player will soon sign a contract with the NHL club Colorado Avalanche, but will spend the upcoming season in the KHL."

If Hench is right about him skating with his head down he may have a similar development path to Byram.

Hope not

 

[The Abusement Park]

That would be a fantastic deal for Toews, IMO.

Well yeah obviously. But maybe I'm underrating Dunn but I think Toews is better than Dunn. I mean Dunn obviously had a great year, but they're comparably offensively but I think Toews is noticeably better defensively. I guess worst case is Toews would realistically get 8 instead of Dunn so maybe I'm overreacting a little.

 

[GoNordiquesGo]

Its not fair to say the Avs have risk with RyJo, Drouin etc but they ARE a top team and say Dallas has risk because they have older guys and therefore are NOT a top team.

I think both teams are the top two teams in the division and will compete all year long. Health will likely be the determining factor, along with how the risk elements mentionned above will turn out. Last year Dallas staed healthy all year whereas the Avs... not so much.

Will be fun to watch.

Hench is just a realist and pointing out the possibility.

I mean, sure we could have three centers top 60 points. Who needs a 4C if they're eating that much ice though. That would be Duchy, ROR, Staz days with an actually competent D core.

I doubt Colton has the linemates or PP time consistently to break out like that unless significant injuries happen. You never know with this team though.

Yes.
I like to poke Hench once in a while because he is a realist/pessimist with the Avs, but most of the time an optimist with most other teams. He's tougher with the Avs than with other teams. I guess love does that

 

[CobraAcesS]

Its not fair to say the Avs have risk with RyJo, Drouin etc but they ARE a top team and say Dallas has risk because they have older guys and therefore are NOT a top team.

I think both teams are the top two teams in the division and will compete all year long. Health will likely be the determining factor, along with how the risk elements mentionned above will turn out. Last year Dallas staed healthy all year whereas the Avs... not so much.

Will be fun to watch.


Yes.
I like to poke Hench once in a while because he is a realist/pessimist with the Avs, but most of the time an optimist with most other teams. He's tougher with the Avs than with other teams. I guess love does that

Tough love is the best love

 

[LOFIN]

Its not fair to say the Avs have risk with RyJo, Drouin etc but they ARE a top team and say Dallas has risk because they have older guys and therefore are NOT a top team.

If anything, it has been the other way around here the last two days. Because of the risk with RyJo and Drouin, apparently the Avs might miss the playoffs but Stars are a lock to win it all.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I’m surprised to see people not like that Dunn contract. I think it’s phenomenal for Seattle. I think he’s worth every bit of that AAV and possibly more right now and it’s not at risk of aging out since it ends when he’s 30.

Great piece of business by Seattle and great for the Avs for a Toews comp. They’re pretty similar players right now but Dunn is way younger and signed for short term. If Toews only wants 7 or 8 years hopefully this might help make that happen on a much lower AAV.

If I’m Cmac I lay two offers down for Toews right now.
4 years x 8M
8 years x 6M

 

[thedoctor]

I’m surprised to see people not like that Dunn contract. I think it’s phenomenal for Seattle. I think he’s worth every bit of that AAV and possibly more right now and it’s not at risk of aging out since it ends when he’s 30.

Great piece of business by Seattle and great for the Avs for a Toews comp. They’re pretty similar players right now but Dunn is way younger and signed for short term. If Toews only wants 7 or 8 years hopefully this might help make that happen on a much lower AAV.

If I’m Cmac I lay two offers down for Toews right now.
4 years x 8M
8 years x 6M

Agreed 100%

 

[Balthazar]

Toews signed 4 years at 4.1M at age 26
Dunn signed 4 years at 7.35M at age 26

Both players will finish those contracts at age 30.. I don't think that the Dunn 4 year contract will have an impact on Toews' 7-8 years one.

 

[AvalancheSpeedsters]

It's been said, I think most recently by Trotz that Ryjo has changed his game a bit to someone who goes to the dirty areas more, and uses his body more.

Lots of tip ins and goals around the net. Obviously that shooting percentage isn't going to hold, but the guy can get goals in many different ways the way he's been playing.

Not worried about it tbH.. with the wingers he'll have he'll get plenty of chances going to the net or not. I do think he's better at using and adapting to his line mates than Kadri was.

Kadri is kind of a straight line center, Ryjo is more cerebral. I'm excited to see what he does as the #2 and with someone like Mack setting the tone.

You do not wear the socks of someone you do not respect. Also, Bednar knows him as well as any coach outside of Trotz.

There are so many reasons to believe we're going to enjoy watching that dude this year.

Exactly I can’t imagine him and Drouin NOT being motivated and playing hard . From a purely human and mental side , being traded here HAS to be a massive boost . Plus for them, if they do well it can mean another good contract down the line . Win win.

Any time a team that has high championship hopes says « we want you » you can’t help but perform as well as you can . Not worried about them for that reason .

 

[Balthazar]

Seravalli posted this today:



I clicked on the original Tweet to read the comments. Let's just say that they didn't age well.

Most fans don't fully understand the difference between a 25 yo and a 30 yo for a hockey player and are looking at what they have done instead of what they will do.

I find this very relevant to the Dunn vs Toews situation.

 

[LOFIN]

Seravalli posted this today:



I clicked on the original Tweet to read the comments. Let's just say that they didn't age well.

Most fans don't fully understand the difference between a 25 yo and a 30 yo for a hockey player and are looking at what they have done instead of what they will do.

I find this very relevant to the Dunn vs Toews situation.

I think the general consensus of that trade was that it made the Flames better in the short term, Panthers better in the long term.

I would imagine Huberdeau bouncing back this year, Weegar as well. Treliving did well under the circumstances. The mistake was not getting rid of Sutter earlier, which was obviously an ownership dictated decision.

 

[chet1926]

Seravalli posted this today:



I clicked on the original Tweet to read the comments. Let's just say that they didn't age well.

Most fans don't fully understand the difference between a 25 yo and a 30 yo for a hockey player and are looking at what they have done instead of what they will do.

I find this very relevant to the Dunn vs Toews situation.

I agree, Toews is tricky due to his age. He is easily one of the best in the league, absolutely top 20. But he will be 30. How quickly does his age start to show?

That's why I think something like 4x8.5 would be awesome gives him the chance to get another good deal at 34. Or maybe something like 8x6 if he is more interested in stability, and it helps us keep AAV down.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I agree, Toews is tricky due to his age. He is easily one of the best in the league, absolutely top 20. But he will be 30. How quickly does his age start to show?

That's why I think something like 4x8.5 would be awesome gives him the chance to get another good deal at 34. Or maybe something like 8x6 if he is more interested in stability, and it helps us keep AAV down.

They should give him max term to get his AAV as low as possible.

Don't need to worry about 3-4 years from now. We will be rebuilding by then.


If Toews is willing to sign either A) 4x$9M or B) 7x$7.5M the Avs should take option B, 10/10 times. That's about extra $1.5M of space to work with while we're actually contenders.

 

[dahrougem2]

Avs can't make a decision on Toews until they make a decision on Girard.

You can't have 3 LHD of that caliber. Just not feasible cap wise. Girard is also the worst of the bunch.

If you keep Girard (big mistake) you need to trade Toews.

 

[UncleRisto]

If Hench is right about him skating with his head down he may have a similar development path to Byram.

Really good?

 

[Balthazar]

Avs can't make a decision on Toews until they make a decision on Girard.

You can't have 3 LHD of that caliber. Just not feasible cap wise. Girard is also the worst of the bunch.

If you keep Girard (big mistake) you need to trade Toews.

OR

Keep Girard and Byram on the left side and spend that Toews money on better forwards (or Landy if he comes back).

If Byram can play first pairing minutes it solves most problems, really. We'll know more this season.

 

[Gumballhead]

Toews is tricky because he did not look like the same defender to me last year. If he looks like that again, then I am less worried about losing him. I just can’t imagine him playing that way again. He’s absolutely crucial when he’s playing like he did the Cup year.

 

[EdAVSfan]

Avs can't make a decision on Toews until they make a decision on Girard.

You can't have 3 LHD of that caliber. Just not feasible cap wise. Girard is also the worst of the bunch.

If you keep Girard (big mistake) you need to trade Toews.

I think its the other way around.

Girard is already signed. If they need to move him, they can.

Toews is the un-signed one.

They need to decide what theyre doing with Toews first. If they decide to sign Toews, Girard goes. IF they decide to walk away from Toews, they keep Girard.

Girard is the domino here.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

There's another option here people are forgetting.

Keep all 3 of them, and trade Manson. Both Byram and G have played the right side a decent bit the last year, probably going to play a fair bit more again this year.

Manson is the one that is actually useless on the Defense and moving him would almost provide just as much cap relief as moving Girard would.

I actually think this is more likely then moving Toews at this point. It isn't a coincidence IMO that Mansons NTC becomes considerably less restrictive just days before the 2024 draft and the same time Toews is a UFA.

 

[dahrougem2]

OR

Keep Girard and Byram on the left side and spend that Toews money on better forwards (or Landy if he comes back).

If Byram can play first pairing minutes it solves most problems, really. We'll know more this season.

Just spend that Girard money on better forwards since he is the vastly inferior defensemen.

I think its the other way around.

Girard is already signed. If they need to move him, they can.

Toews is the un-signed one.

They need to decide what theyre doing with Toews first. If they decide to sign Toews, Girard goes. IF they decide to walk away from Toews, they keep Girard.

Girard is the domino here.

If they move Girard, they'll know for certain they are re-signing Toews.