Rumor: 2023-2024 Trade Rumors and Free Agency: Off-season is in full swing

[Cousin Eddie]

Toews is tricky because he did not look like the same defender to me last year. If he looks like that again, then I am less worried about losing him. I just can’t imagine him playing that way again. He’s absolutely crucial when he’s playing like he did the Cup year.

I legit thought Toews was Colorado’s best player in the Seattle series.

 

[Vaslof]

We'll probably have to choose just one of Toews or Rantanen for cap reasons. Letting go of Toews would be easier as we already have a 2nd pair D in Girard to step in.

 

[GeoRox89]

I legit thought Toews was Colorado’s best player in the Seattle series.

Toews didn’t look himself much of the regular season. Have to agree he was the best Av in the Seattle series. The Toews that showed up to play in the playoffs is a player the Avs need

Trade Girard. He’s a luxury at best

 

[Balthazar]

It's pointless to re-up old ass Toews to top pairing money if Byram is going to take his spot in a year. Let's not repeat what Minny did with Suter.

We can't make a decision on Toews until we know more about Byram, it's as simple as that.

 

[sethro109]

Just spend that Girard money on better forwards since he is the vastly inferior defensemen.

If they move Girard, they'll know for certain they are re-signing Toews.

If we keep Toews there is no Girard money. It just all goes to Toews. There's no way Toews signs for less than 9M a season. We're going to be too top heavy if we keep him. It'll also make signing Mikko much harder in the fallowing year.

 

[dahrougem2]

If we keep Toews there is no Girard money. It just all goes to Toews. There's no way Toews signs for less than 9M a season. We're going to be too top heavy if we keep him. It'll also make signing Mikko much harder in the fallowing year.

If Toews re-signs here it won't be for 9 million

 

[sethro109]

If Toews re-signs here it won't be for 9 million

Karlsson, Doughty, Werenski, Macavoy, Fox, Jones, Nurse, Josi, Hamilton and Makar are the defensemen in the NHL that currently make 9 million or more. Toews' agent is going to point straight at Nurse and Jones and use them as leverage in his negotiations. Every agent knows about the big coming cap increase in the next few years. There's absolutely no way Toews will sign an extension for under 9. This will be his only pay day in the NHL. He's going to make it count. Hometown discount is a myth. Mikko didn't take one, MacK didn't take one, Landy didn't take one, Kadri didn't take one, no one is going to take one.

 

[Balthazar]

Mack will make 16.5M in total salary this season.

Is it the most money ever paid for a single season in NHL history? I just looked and neither McDavid, Matthews or Karlsson ever made that much. Not even Weber with his front loaded 110M contract.

 

[JH21]

It's pointless to re-up old ass Toews to top pairing money if Byram is going to take his spot in a year. Let's not repeat what Minny did with Suter.

We can't make a decision on Toews until we know more about Byram, it's as simple as that.

Talk to me when Byram plays more than 42 games in a season.

 

[Avaholic29]

Talk to me when Byram plays more than 42 games in a season.

His post clearly says “until we know more about Byram” lol.

 

[LTCPain75]

IMHO, the Avalanche cannot let Toews walk, for nothing. I don't think the Avalanche can afford to fit the raise Toews will get under the salary cap. So, quandary.

I say trade Toews at the 2024 TDL, window open or not. Maybe for a couple of roster players, like someone opined above, and a 1st round pick (just spitballing!). Then after the TDL run with:

1st pair - Byram/Makar
2nd pair - Girard/Manson
3rd pair - LHD in trade for Toews/Malinski or Foote

Injuries will surely occur and I have zero answers for your "what if" speculations

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

IMHO, the Avalanche cannot let Toews walk, for nothing. I don't think the Avalanche can afford to fit the raise Toews will get under the salary cap. So, quandary.

I say trade Toews at the 2024 TDL, window open or not. Maybe for a couple of roster players, like someone opined above, and a 1st round pick (just spitballing!). Then after the TDL run with:

1st pair - Byram/Makar
2nd pair - Girard/Manson
3rd pair - LHD in trade for Toews/Malinski or Foote

Injuries will surely occur and I have zero answers for your "what if" speculations

Why does this matter?

He gives them the best chance to win a cup this year, compared to whatever we would get in a trade for him.

If he leaves, he leaves. Far better then making the team worse during our best year left to win the cup again.

 

[JH21]

IMHO, the Avalanche cannot let Toews walk, for nothing. I don't think the Avalanche can afford to fit the raise Toews will get under the salary cap. So, quandary.

I say trade Toews at the 2024 TDL, window open or not. Maybe for a couple of roster players, like someone opined above, and a 1st round pick (just spitballing!). Then after the TDL run with:

1st pair - Byram/Makar
2nd pair - Girard/Manson
3rd pair - LHD in trade for Toews/Malinski or Foote

Injuries will surely occur and I have zero answers for your "what if" speculations

No. We trade Girard for picks and prospects and give Toews his 4m.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people want to keep Girard over Toews under any circumstance.

 

[Balthazar]

No. We trade Girard for picks and prospects and give Toews his 4m.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people want to keep Girard over Toews under any circumstance.

Yet it's very easy to understand. If Byram can play top pair it comes down to:

1st pair: Byram
2nd pair: Girard @ 5M (for 3 years, age 26 to 29)

or

1st pair: Byram
2nd pair: Toews @ 8M (for 7 years, age 30 to 37)

 

[EdAVSfan]

No. We trade Girard for picks and prospects and give Toews his 4m.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people want to keep Girard over Toews under any circumstance.

Really?

You cant understand under any circumstance why people would rather keep Girard and his 5M vs Toews and his potential 8-9M? Then we have to factor in Byram’s big extension in 2 years.

It’s a constant balancing act on the roster. How much depth vs how much top-end talent. Girard allows you to have better depth, but a worse top-end.
Toews allows better top end but worse depth.

 

[JH21]

Really?

You cant understand under any circumstance why people would rather keep Girard and his 5M vs Toews and his potential 8-9M? Then we have to factor in Byram’s big extension in 2 years.

It’s a constant balancing act on the roster. How much depth vs how much top-end talent. Girard allows you to have better depth, but a worse top-end.
Toews allows better top end but worse depth.

Who cares. You keep elite players over average players all day long.

Find me one trade in the past 10 years where a team traded a star player for pieces and didn't get fleeced.

 

[JH21]

Yet it's very easy to understand. If Byram can play top pair it comes down to:

1st pair: Byram
2nd pair: Girard @ 5M (for 3 years, age 26 to 29)

or

1st pair: Byram
2nd pair: Toews @ 8M (for 7 years, age 30 to 37)

You're assuming Byram will be better than Toews. Which he isn't.

1st pair: Toews - Makar
2nd pair: Byram - Manson

Done.

Makar - Toews - Byram. You build around with those 3 guys. Girard is not a guy who we build anything around.

Plus we have Behrens coming up and Zhigalov in a few years to keep the pipeline of small, undersized puck movers going.

 

[thedoctor]

Who cares. You keep elite players over average players all day long.

Find me one trade in the past 10 years where a team traded a star player for pieces and didn't get fleeced.

Uh, Duchene?

 

[LOFIN]

Uh, Duchene?

Turned out to be good, which some of these trades might end up being. But let's be real, when that deal was struck we had no idea Ottawa was going to be a lottery team.

Girard for Duchene ended up working out decently, but back then he was just another puck moving prospect who couldn't crack the Nashville lineup.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

The way I see the Toews thing unfolding is one of two ways. He re-signs this summer, or he tests UFA.

I know what decision I would be making at the deadline if my job as a GM was to ensure the continued success of the Avalanche. I am also aware CMac will instead allow the chance of him walking for free instead and call it an internal rental. If we win the cup this year, he will have gambled and won. Any other outcome is a loss of the magnitude that should cost him his job. You do not let a #1 Dman walk for nothing. You just don't do it. If you are dumb enough to do it, you better have won the freaking cup.

 

[Eltuna]

Mack will make 16.5M in total salary this season.

Is it the most money ever paid for a single season in NHL history? I just looked and neither McDavid, Matthews or Karlsson ever made that much. Not even Weber with his front loaded 110M contract.

I don’t even think he’s the highest Av, Sakic got a 15 million dollar signing bonus with the NYR offersheet and then made 2 millions in annual salary that year for 17 million total.

 

[EdAVSfan]

Who cares. You keep elite players over average players all day long.

Find me one trade in the past 10 years where a team traded a star player for pieces and didn't get fleeced.

I don’t understand.
Why do I have to find a trade? We’re not trading Toews. I’m pretty sure, even if we don’t re-sign him, we’re not trading him. We’re using him to try to win this year.

Secondly, I understand the concept of elite vs average. The problem is, you have a limited amount of « elite » players you can keep if they’re all being paid at their market values.

Byram, Mackinnon, Rantanen, Makar, Landeskog, Nuke… we have or will have a bunch of big, money contracts.

The math doesn’t work. No matter how many times you want to say that we need to keep elite players over average ones.

The Avs are currently spending 26M on their top 5 defensemen. What you’re suggesting, between Toews, Makar, Byram, we’ll be spending that same amount on 3 defensemen, in 2 years time.

 

[Avs_19]

Mack will make 16.5M in total salary this season.

Is it the most money ever paid for a single season in NHL history? I just looked and neither McDavid, Matthews or Karlsson ever made that much. Not even Weber with his front loaded 110M contract.

I think in the modern NHL it's the most. The Leafs' guys (Matthews, Marner, Tavares) have all come close but not quite as high as MacKinnon.

Fedorov still holds the record though with the poison pill offer sheet he signed back in the day when the Wings had to pay him $28M that one season. Sakic's offer sheet also had him making $17M in the one season.

 

[NorthernAvsFan]

I think the path forward with Toews is pretty clear. He plays this year and you try to extend him next off-season. You can’t give him 9, so if he doesn’t take a discount you let him go.

I think there’s a lot of value in keeping Toews this year, seeing as the Avs and Oilers are going to be on a collision course in the West imo. Part of the reason Colorado beat them last time was because of the overwhelming advantage on the backend.

I also think Byram could use one more year of development before moving into that role full-time.

 

[JH21]

Uh, Duchene?

Yes, only because their 1st round pick turned out to be Byram. The players we got are average at best.

Bowen Byram
Sam Girard
Vlad Kamanev
Andrew Hammond
Shane Bowers
Matthew Steinberg

For Duchene.

Meanwhile Duchene has scored 138 goals over 6 years averaging 23 a year.

Byram may end up being the best player out of that trade but in the 6 years since the trade happened Duchene was clearly the best.