2022 Line Combinations

[LeafEgo]

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Robertson - Tavares - Nylander
Engval - Kampf - Jarnkrok
ZAR - Kerfoot - NAK

Rielly - Liljegren
Muzzin - Brody
Giordano - Holl

Kerfoot would obviously be an overpaid 4th line C, but it would be a pesky line.

Robertson need an extended look in the top 6. He definitely doesn’t fit on either of the bottom 2 lines. Unfortunately seeing as how he is waiver exempt (basically the only player contending for a spot) he will more than likely yo-yo. Hopefully he blows everyone away from the get go.

Not sure about demoting our 6th highest scoring forward last year (by a wide margin) to the 4th line.

If you swapped ZAR and Engvall you would have a pretty balanced 3.5A/3.5B - just a thought. Swapping Kampf and Kerf would give you the more traditional bottom 6.

But that bottom 6 depends on Robertson working out. If he hits this year that solves a major problem, but he may also not be nhl ready yet and that needs a plan b in the back pocket.

 

[namttebih]

Not sure about demoting our 6th highest scoring forward last year (by a wide margin) to the 4th line.

If you swapped ZAR and Engvall you would have a pretty balanced 3.5A/3.5B - just a thought. Swapping Kampf and Kerf would give you the more traditional bottom 6.

But that bottom 6 depends on Robertson working out. If he hits this year that solves a major problem, but he may also not be nhl ready yet and that needs a plan b in the back pocket.

I don't disagree. I just didn't like him with JT/WN or PE/DK last year.

Having him on a bottom 6 line with the hyphens could be a match up nightmare.

E/K/J as the shutdown line.

To be honest, I truly think that Robertson will be sent down regardless and Jarnkrok will take Kerfoots tentative spot on the 2nd line

 

[saffronleaf]

What line combinations would you like to see next season? Below is what I think we should go with to start the year. These are with a prediction that Holmberg, Robertson and Anderson all look good in training camp to earn spots.

Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Kerfoot-Tavares-Nylander
Holmberg-Jarnkrok-Robertson
Engvel-Kampf-Anderson
Simmonds

Rielly-Liljegren
Muzzin-Brodie
Giordano-Holl

Murray
Samsonov

PP1
Matthew-Tavares-Nylander
Rielly-Marner

eww, another 89 games of kerfoot tavares and nylander

third line looks sad. fourth line looks great.

 

[LeafEgo]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

 

[saffronleaf]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

yea, not too excited about this season. it'll end the way the others did.

 

[IPS]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

As far as forwards go I'm not awfully worried about this aspect, though I would like a player who can be punishing on the forecheck somewhere in the group. Tampa's guys were small too but they always showed snarl, and it seems like the boys matched their energy in that series.

Defense - it's definitely gonna be a problem again. I swear this team is always doomed to be soft as hell on D. It's always funny watching a select group around here shit on teams for acquiring guys like Manson and Bogosian yet they go on to win the cup with guys like that.

 

[Knies iT]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

Softest Leaf Forward Group Since 2000?

As of today. I can’t remember a forward group that projects to be less physical or softer than the upcoming bunch. Even the dark ages there was always a Belak, Bell, Deveaux, Mayers, Rosehill, Brown, Orr, McLaren, Sill, Clarkson, etc. That breed of player is all but extinct and they were...

forums.hfboards.com

Some said wait for the dust of the off-season to settle. Well, we added ZAR on a PTO since then. We are about to see the epitome of a butter soft, pure skill approach. Many on here completely disregard physicality so we'll see how their stance fares.

Your last point is painstakingly true.

 

[zeke]

Yeah we had Bogosians and Booshes and Simmondses and they made us worse and probably cost us playoff wins.

And to look at Colorado and Tampa dominating and winning with skill skil skill and conclude that toughness was the key is just bizarre. We literally added the toughest forward on the avalanche cup winning roster.

 

[aingefan]

Who's our 4th line center?

Isn’t this a nice problem to have.

 

[ACC1224]

Softest Leaf Forward Group Since 2000?

As of today. I can’t remember a forward group that projects to be less physical or softer than the upcoming bunch. Even the dark ages there was always a Belak, Bell, Deveaux, Mayers, Rosehill, Brown, Orr, McLaren, Sill, Clarkson, etc. That breed of player is all but extinct and they were...

forums.hfboards.com

Some said wait for the dust of the off-season to settle. Well, we added ZAR on a PTO since then. We are about to see the epitome of a butter soft, pure skill approach. Many on here completely disregard physicality so we'll see how their stance fares.

Your last point is painstakingly true.

Perhaps this year they’ll figure it out.

 

[namttebih]

Who is it that you propose

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

Who or what are you proposing? Playing Clifford or Simmonds regularly? Bringing in pests who can finish checks but can actually play? Are those guys out there and available (within cap)? Goons on the 4th line or team toughness ala Bruins of 10 years ago?

What's the proposed solution?

 

[ToneDog]

Yeah we had Bogosians and Booshes and Simmondses and they made us worse and probably cost us playoff wins.

And to look at Colorado and Tampa dominating and winning with skill skil skill and conclude that toughness was the key is just bizarre. We literally added the toughest forward on the avalanche cup winning roster.

Kubel was not the Avs toughest player. He was really good in the pressbox though.

 

[Notsince67]

Perhaps this year they’ll figure it out.

 

[notbias]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

We were more physical than Tampa, and the series ended up being called tighter than any series I've seen until we took out the tough guys.

Kubel was not the Avs toughest player. He was really good in the pressbox though.

He played two fewer games than Kadri... not shocked you'd make it sound worse than it was

 

[LeafEgo]

Yeah we had Bogosians and Booshes and Simmondses and they made us worse and probably cost us playoff wins.

And to look at Colorado and Tampa dominating and winning with skill skil skill and conclude that toughness was the key is just bizarre. We literally added the toughest forward on the avalanche cup winning roster.

It's true we never really got it right.

Avs are skill but have the toughest star power in the league with Landy-Mack-Rant bearing down on the opposition for over 20 mins a night. They also had Manson - toughest dude in the playoffs last year. As far as cup champs go they were a bit softer than usual. Tampa had everything including physicality in spades..

 

[Dekes For Days]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

Should be zero concern.

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside

Except that never happened.

 

[Mess]

He played two fewer games than Kadri... not shocked you'd make it sound worse than it was

Playoffs ... 14 games 0 goals 0 assists 0 points,

Appeared in only 2 of 6 Stanley Cup final games as healthy scratch, and played early on due to Kadri missing 4 games and Andre Burakovsky missing 8 games.

He has a reputation of taking a lot of bad penalties, and that is why Flyers cut him loose on waivers earlier that year before Colorado claimed him.

 

[LeafEgo]

Who is it that you propose

Who or what are you proposing? Playing Clifford or Simmonds regularly? Bringing in pests who can finish checks but can actually play? Are those guys out there and available (within cap)? Goons on the 4th line or team toughness ala Bruins of 10 years ago?

What's the proposed solution?

I don't have a short term proposal but my assessment is that the roster doesn't have a strong enough physical element - IPS provided good detail on the more pressing needs. The answer is to start building a program and culture that incorporates physicality and toughness into the lineup. That could include a new coach along with collecting the right role players - D particularly. We may have stumbled on some. Manson at the deadline worked well for Avs.

You didn't share your level of concern on the physicality of the group.

 

[zeke]

Kubel was not the Avs toughest player. He was really good in the pressbox though.

Literally their toughest forward.

It's true we never really got it right.

Avs are skill but have the toughest star power in the league with Landy-Mack-Rant bearing down on the opposition for over 20 mins a night. They also had Manson - toughest dude in the playoffs last year. As far as cup champs go they were a bit softer than usual. Tampa had everything including physicality in spades..

So they had one tough dman.

 

[LeafEgo]

We were more physical than Tampa, and the series ended up being called tighter than any series I've seen until we took out the tough guys.

That really was bizarre, the series was called like regular season - hadn't seen that before. It really benefits a softer team but can't bank on that happening again.

There is really no comparison between our current lineup and the Bolts of yesteryears. Their defensive lineup was terrifying - all three sets.

 

[Advanced stats]

What is the concern level on the physicality of this group?

In Dubies first experiment circa 2018, where physicality was tossed aside, we had Muzzy, couple small energy forwards, a bit of spark in Kadri. Boston basically just beat us up. After that we started to steer back to sanity.

Now it looks like we're back again with just Muzzy (older), couple small energy forwards, and a modest spark in Bunting.

It feels like we've lost so many times in a row we're starting to forget some of the lessons we learned in the beginning.

You're definitely playing a victim complex forgetting about Simmonds, Holl and Liljegren. And selling Zar, NAK and Gaudette as "two small energy forwards" is weak.

Just the names I mentioned could easily have 700 hits between them.

We're not tough, but definitely not weak either.
If we had to line up for a slug game we could.

 

[notbias]

Playoffs ... 14 games 0 goals 0 assists 0 points,

Appeared in only 2 of 6 Stanley Cup final games as healthy scratch, and played early on due to Kadri missing 4 games and Andre Burakovsky missing 8 games.

He has a reputation of taking a lot of bad penalties, and that is why Flyers cut him loose on waivers earlier that year before Colorado claimed him.

I am just curious if you were onboard with getting rid of Hyman, his playoff stats were TERRIBLE.

And are you onboard with bringing in Murray who has amazing playoff stats?

 

[LeafEgo]

Except that never happened.

So they had one tough dman.

Always get a kick out of these posts.

You're definitely playing a victim complex forgetting about Simmonds, Holl and Liljegren. And selling Zar, NAK and Gaudette as "two small energy forwards" is weak.

Just the names I mentioned could easily have 700 hits between them.

We're not tough, but definitely not weak either.
If we had to line up for a slug game we could.

I don't think Simmer plays.

Holl and Lily aren't soft but they are not noteworthy either when it comes to a physical presence at the back. They aren't Hedman-Cernak-Serg-Bogo (Bolts), Weber-Petry-Edmundson-Chariot (Habs), Parayko-Bortuzzo-Edmundson-Petro (Blues), types of defenceman to borrow from teams with recent playoffs success.

I don't know the new three forwards much outside of what has been shared here - they are all certainly small though. How would you describe them?

Do you think the team is more prepared for a slug game than they were in 2018-19? We may just have different expectations.

 

[namttebih]

I don't have a short term proposal but my assessment is that the roster doesn't have a strong enough physical element - IPS provided good detail on the more pressing needs. The answer is to start building a program and culture that incorporates physicality and toughness into the lineup. That could include a new coach along with collecting the right role players - D particularly. We may have stumbled on some. Manson at the deadline worked well for Avs.

You didn't share your level of concern on the physicality of the group.

I definitely do share some concern - and I hope that my email didn’t come across as snarky. I was genuinely asking if you have any solutions. I’ve looked at so many different possibilities and none seem viable.

However, I think that Clifford and Simmonds time with the team should be over.

 

[Fogelhund]

How we get tougher is mostly internally. Matthew’s showed that in the playoffs. We need more of that. If our top guys can play harder, that is far more important than a 4th tough guy who plays 8 minutes a game. Maybe Knies can provide some of that. Tavares isn’t a wimp. Nylander isn’t small, and I’d wish his game could grow that way, and defensively.

I’m not sure how we can address our lack of toughness on the backend.