Speculation: 2022-23 Sharks Roster Discussion Part II

[Anomie2029]

My favorite part is Hodge being an absolute defender of Benning, but also calling out Ferraro for being a borderline NHLer.

 

[Hodge]

My favorite part is Hodge being an absolute defender of Benning, but also calling out Ferraro for being a borderline NHLer.

Matt Benning is objectively a much better player than Ferraro. Both this season and over their entire careers.

 

[LadyStanley]

Guess Griersy need to keep his phone charged.

 

[Gecklund]

Guess Griersy need to keep his phone charged.

I’d be interested to see what the almost is. Are we talking guys with NTCs aren’t being discussed? (Hertl, Couture, EK, Vlasic) which would make sense honestly or are we talking the prospects. I’ll have to give it a listen and see what they clarify or if.

 

[LadyStanley]

Grier listening on just about every player on roster excluding Hertl. But has some pesky NTCs and NMCs he'd have to get player agreement on.

 

[WTFetus]

The only thing "untouchable" should be this year's 1st round pick. Maybe a couple more consecutive losses will open the floodgates.

 

[Anomie2029]

Matt Benning is objectively a much better player than Ferraro. Both this season and over their entire careers.

 

[timorous me]

There's a fine line between having rational points as Hodge does on occasion and consistently going out of his way to find narratives to disagree with anyone who has a different viewpoint. I'd have a lot more respect for him if he chose to be a more civil, level-headed poster as opposed to someone who lurks solely for the purpose of being cynical and argumentative. I've never once seem him post anything remotely close to something like "I can see your point" or "there's a possibility that's true" without it being snarking and condescending. You can defend him all you want like he's a victim, but the dude knows exactly what he's doing with each post. He's a big boy.

Thanks for typing pretty much exactly what I was thinking in response. I'd also add that we have posters on here, like @Kcoyote3, who watch the prospects and pay a lot of attention and offer feedback on them and, while acknowledging the positives and bringing a level of hopefulness, aren't afraid to make criticisms when they see things that aren't so good.

They also aren't afraid to admit they were wrong, or acknowledge the possibility that another poster with another perspective might actually have some merit. If instead you're basically just a Woody Woodpecker-like irritant who chooses to only bring negativity and, instead of engaging with others, seeks to only mock them and point out where they're wrong, then your entire presence on a board meant for conversation is pretty much pointless--except in you being able to revel in feeling superior and feeling glee and knowing you might be making others feel shitty for their opinions.

 

[TheBeard]

Thanks for typing pretty much exactly what I was thinking in response. I'd also add that we have posters on here, like @Kcoyote3, who watch the prospects and pay a lot of attention and offer feedback on them and, while acknowledging the positives and bringing a level of hopefulness, aren't afraid to make criticisms when they see things that aren't so good.

They also aren't afraid to admit they were wrong, or acknowledge the possibility that another poster with another perspective might actually have some merit. If instead you're basically just a Woody Woodpecker-like irritant who chooses to only bring negativity and, instead of engaging with others, seeks to only mock them and point out where they're wrong, then your entire presence on a board meant for conversation is pretty much pointless--except in you being able to revel in feeling superior and feeling glee and knowing you might be making others feel shitty for their opinions.

It’s a playbook out of politics. Completely ignore the moments they’re wrong by constantly deflecting and going on the offensive thus dictating what viewpoints should be prioritized. At least he’s suddenly stopped rambling on about Bob’s elite coaching skills now that the team has begun to look at least somewhat competitive.

 

[PattyLafontaine]

I definitely did make those percentages up. The point is how can you say that all these guys are for sure busts when they are still with the org and developing?

You’re right it’s random. That’s the most logical thing you’ve said so far. No one expected Kaprizov to turn into what he did or Pavelski or whoever. You can’t just write guys off because you don’t like the guy who drafted them.

Statistics tell us that there is an asymptotic curve heading towards zero as you go further away from the #1 overall pick.

The point is that relying on outliers is always a losing proposition in gaming theory.

No one is saying you cannot be interested/excited about prospects. However, one has to be careful about letting that enthusiam cloud one's vision.

 

[jMoneyBrah]

Statistics tell us that there is an asymptotic curve heading towards zero as you go further away from the #1 overall pick.

The point is that relying on outliers is always a losing proposition in gaming theory.

No one is saying you cannot be interested/excited about prospects. However, one has to be careful about letting that enthusiam cloud one's vision.

Oh man, if my vision was clouded about Sharks prospects that could lead to terrible consequences, like occasionally being wrong on the internet. Best to be vigilant.

 

[DG93]

Matt Benning is objectively a much better player than Ferraro. Both this season and over their entire careers.

I don't agree with that. Ferraro looks awful because he's being used in a way that's way above his talent level and being played way too many minutes. He's a solid #4 guy with the right partner. Benning is also being brutally misused in top-4 minutes where he doesn't belong. The main problem is this blueline blows and doesn't have actual top pairing defensemen.

 

[OrrNumber4]

Thanks for typing pretty much exactly what I was thinking in response. I'd also add that we have posters on here, like @Kcoyote3, who watch the prospects and pay a lot of attention and offer feedback on them and, while acknowledging the positives and bringing a level of hopefulness, aren't afraid to make criticisms when they see things that aren't so good.

They also aren't afraid to admit they were wrong, or acknowledge the possibility that another poster with another perspective might actually have some merit. If instead you're basically just a Woody Woodpecker-like irritant who chooses to only bring negativity and, instead of engaging with others, seeks to only mock them and point out where they're wrong, then your entire presence on a board meant for conversation is pretty much pointless--except in you being able to revel in feeling superior and feeling glee and knowing you might be making others feel shitty for their opinions.

Being fair to @Hodge, he has admitted fault and acknowledged other POVs. It's just rare.

Oh man, if my vision was clouded about Sharks prospects that could lead to terrible consequences, like occasionally being wrong on the internet. Best to be vigilant.

And the you get this kind of snarky, gormless, smug comment with no value.

 

[Hodge]

It's funny that I get painted as pessimistic when if anything, especially relating to prospects, my takes have turned out to be too optimistic. For example I remember being laughed at a year ago for comparing Wiesblatt's upside to Noah Gregor but now it looks like he would be lucky to skate in as many career NHL games as Gregor.

 

[Cas]

Statistics tell us that there is an asymptotic curve heading towards zero as you go further away from the #1 overall pick.

That's the value of the pick, of course, not the prospect.

The odds of the #205 pick turning into a 400 goal scorer are vanishingly small, but the odds of Joe Pavelski turning into a 400 goal scorer are a lot higher. The statistical odds of a draft pick turning into a useful NHL player are only valid up until the moment that you use that draft pick on a player - at that point, the odds of that player turning into a useful NHL player can only be judged by examining the player (and comparing that player to other players with similar production and tools).

 

[timorous me]

It's funny that I get painted as pessimistic when if anything, especially relating to prospects, my takes have turned out to be too optimistic. For example I remember being laughed at a year ago for comparing Wiesblatt's upside to Noah Gregor but now it looks like he would be lucky to skate in as many career NHL games as Gregor.

I don't really even care about the pessimism, and I certainly agree with some of your takes, especially about DW's approach to many things in recent years.

It's just that when everything is one-note, the same repetitive negativity, and the only objective seems to be to remind everyone that you're the smartest in the room and they're all idiot sycophants who have worshipped at the altar of Doug Wilson and now deserve to suffer and be reminded of their stupidity at every possible opportunity, it's just an incredible turn-off.

When you have engaged in conversations on rare occasions, it can make for a useful viewpoint. But you do you--I can't make you operate differently, even if I wish you would.

 

[Levie]

Grier being willing to move almost anyone is great. I wish we didn't have to have Joe Will for half the season last year. His moves in such a short time are maddening.

 

[CaptainShark]

Grier listening on just about every player on roster excluding Hertl. But has some pesky NTCs and NMCs he'd have to get player agreement on.

I love to hear it. Sharks need to kind of embrace the rebuilt and while they didn´t communicate it openly (which i get), i quess this was the plan all the way for this season. Still puzzled why some of the roster-fillers have gotten the contract length that they have (looking at you Mr. D-man that´s said to be better than Ferraro), but overall, i like the direction.

 

[Jargon]

Not to interrupt this arguing over whether Hodge is the worst, sort of the worst, or actually sometimes the worst but sometimes not the worst — but I’m really happy that Grier has made it known that he’s virtually open to trading anyone.

That’s huge. It’s obviously an official rebuild (we all knew that but nice to hear it confirmed) and I’d really love us to mass picks in this loaded draft/pick up some a blue-chip prospect or two (to Hodge’s point about our cupboard still being comparatively empty). That excites me - and very little about this team recently has.

 

[OrrNumber4]

Not to interrupt this arguing over whether Hodge is the worst, sort of the worst, or actually sometimes the worst but sometimes not the worst — but I’m really happy that Grier has made it known that he’s virtually open to trading anyone.

That’s huge. It’s obviously an official rebuild (we all knew that but nice to hear it confirmed) and I’d really love us to mass picks in this loaded draft/pick up some a blue-chip prospect or two (to Hodge’s point about our cupboard still being comparatively empty). That excites me - and very little about this team recently has.

True, but in some ways it's like me announcing my intent to sleep with Halle Berry. My desires weren't really the rate-limiting factor...

 

[Jargon]

True, but in some ways it's like me announcing my intent to sleep with Halle Berry. My desires weren't really the rate-limiting factor...

Have you considered retaining 50% of your personality?

 

[OrrNumber4]

Have you considered retaining 50% of your personality?

50% of my age, perhaps.

I mean, three years of not making the playoffs...you have to figure everyone is available. My assumption was that since no one was biting, the Sharks just had to compete...

 

[Jargon]

50% of my age, perhaps.

I mean, three years of not making the playoffs...you have to figure everyone is available. My assumption was that since no one was biting, the Sharks just had to compete...

Stop it, I don’t know you, but I imagine you’re a charming young man, Halle would trade a 7th for you!

 

[themelkman]

I think Reimer will be gone pretty soon. No reason to hold onto him if teams are very interested.

I dont think any of Griers acquisitions have appreciated in value, but maybe we can still get back what we put into them.

 

[mogambomoroo]

Hope that Grier is aware of when the cards are on his hands, meaning Reimer has a very big value now because of some playoff teams like Toronto/Colorado/Edmonton etc. not having a playoff goalie tandem (Georgiev is good, but I don't believe he can take them far in the playoffs) (Campbell is a wild card, I think he can be better)

About the other trade assets I think only Timo can get you a reasonable/great package back.
But the main thing is that if I'm Grier, I only trade him if he brings the maximum value back. Others pieces have medium to low value, but I don't think you need to sell everything. There needs to be some veteran pieces to play with upcoming prospects.

I just hope Grier doesn't sell cheap, we want value.
It's going to be interesting season in a lot of ways and I think by the 2023 draft we'll have a very clear image of what is the direction.