Speculation: 2022-23 Sharks Roster Discussion Part II

[Hodge]

Tim Burke’s tenure as scouting director was extremely strong. We tend to focus on the misses like Mueller and Goldobin but he also found legit stars in Pavelski and Vlasic well outside of the lottery. He nailed the Couture, Hertl, Hannan, Cheechoo, Norris and Coyle first round picks and found Ehrhoff, Carle and Braun - three defensemen who played top pairing roles on Stanley Cup finalists - in the later rounds. When you consider how late the Sharks were picking most years, Burke’s track record has to be one of the strongest of anyone from 1997 to 2017.

DWJr. was a laughably unqualified nepotism hire and the results so far speak for themselves.

 

[LadyStanley]

The NHL's 10 best sleeper free agents

While other free agents will be making headlines and signing lucrative deals, these under-the-radar guys could be steals for whoever lands them.

sports.yahoo.com

While other free agents will be making headlines and signing lucrative deals, these under-the-radar guys could be steals for whoever lands them.

Don't know any would make it to SJ.



I don't think Sturm would be included in any deal as he came knowing the situation and is being counted on to mentor the youngsters.

 

[Harbessix]

My random free agent speculation…Connor Clifton will be a Shark.

 

[STL Shark]

Was thinking about Boston today and their need for a C or two and that their window will slightly close when Marchand and hall need new deals in two years.

Would you trade Hertl @50% (yes, I know) for a swayman + BOS 1sts in 2025 & 2026?

Or, what would a deal look like to get both of those picks? Possible at all?

No. I’m not eating $4M for 7 years for a goalie and 2 late first rounders that won’t be NHL players until 2028-2030 (if they ever make it). I’m not retaining 50% for 7 years on literally any player, but if it were to happen there has to be slam dunks coming back in return.

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

Ryan Reaves will be a Shark. Book it.

 

[Grinner]

Ryan Reaves will be a Shark. Book it.

Grrrr!

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

Grrrr!

Yeah I feel really uncomfortable re reading my own post..

 

[lucky0slevin]

Was thinking about Boston today and their need for a C or two and that their window will slightly close when Marchand and hall need new deals in two years.

Would you trade Hertl @50% (yes, I know) for a swayman + BOS 1sts in 2025 & 2026?

Or, what would a deal look like to get both of those picks? Possible at all?

Honestly why ? I know of one team that really needs a center now. Columbus goes all in and we trade Hertl for the 3rd overall straight up. We end up with pick 3-4-26 in the first round. Rebuild accelerated .

 

[landshark]

Ryan Reaves will be a Shark. Book it.

Only if we can haz WIll Carrier, too!

 

[Juxtaposer]

Honestly why ? I know of one team that really needs a center now. Columbus goes all in and we trade Hertl for the 3rd overall straight up. We end up with pick 3-4-26 in the first round. Rebuild accelerated .

Be honest, would you do that if you were Columbus?

 

[glasgow26]

I had a dream (or maybe a nightmare) last night that Carlsson fell to 4, we were all super excited to take him, but then Grier traded the 4th pick and Couture (no retention) to Chicago for the 19th pick.

So we basically moved back 15 spots just to shed Couture’s contract, and missed out on Carlsson in the process. I woke up really pissed off.

 

[Shark in Hockeytown]

Tim Burke’s tenure as scouting director was extremely strong. We tend to focus on the misses like Mueller and Goldobin but he also found legit stars in Pavelski and Vlasic well outside of the lottery. He nailed the Couture, Hertl, Hannan, Cheechoo, Norris and Coyle first round picks and found Ehrhoff, Carle and Braun - three defensemen who played top pairing roles on Stanley Cup finalists - in the later rounds. When you consider how late the Sharks were picking most years, Burke’s track record has to be one of the strongest of anyone from 1997 to 2017.

DWJr. was a laughably unqualified nepotism hire and the results so far speak for themselves.

Yeah, Burke really nailed the Jillson, Morris, Kasper, Bernier, Setoguchi (over Kopitar), Petricki, and Wishart picks. You have to look at his whole record, not just the successes or the failures. Burke valued size and compete over skill. The team did pick exceptionally well in the 7th round, which I attribute to their willingness to scout and draft USHL players before other teams did.

 

[TheBeard]

Be honest, would you do that if you were Columbus?

We’d probably have to retain, like, 10%.

 

[Hodge]

Yeah, Burke really nailed the Jillson, Morris, Kasper, Bernier, Setoguchi (over Kopitar), Petricki, and Wishart picks. You have to look at his whole record, not just the successes or the failures. Burke valued size and compete over skill. The team did pick exceptionally well in the 7th round, which I attribute to their willingness to scout and draft USHL players before other teams did.

Apart from Seto, these were all late 1st rounders which have a historical hit rate of ~25-30%. Burke missed on Jillson, Morris, Kaspar, Petrecki, Wishart, Mueller and Goldobin but hit on Hannan, Cheechoo, Goc, Bernier (600+ NHL games), Coyle, Hertl and Norris in the same range. That's much higher than 30%.

Every team/scouting staff ever has more misses than hits. Burke's overall record was among the best in the league. This article only covers 2003-2013 but the Sharks come out as the 2nd best drafting team in that era without even taking into account the extremely low value of their picks on average.

 

[hotcabbagesoup]

I had a dream (or maybe a nightmare) last night that Carlsson fell to 4, we were all super excited to take him, but then Grier traded the 4th pick and Couture (no retention) to Chicago for the 19th pick.

So we basically moved back 15 spots just to shed Couture’s contract, and missed out on Carlsson in the process. I woke up really pissed off.

Camera pans across a dark brick-laden chamber lit only by candles and moonlight. A hooded figure presumed to be our GM is laying prostrate before a squat little man dressed in clergy garb and holding a staff that looks kinda like a hockey stick.

The hooded man: "This will atone for the hand-pass sins of my predecessors, Supreme Commissioner"

Divine man: "Very good Mikey, very good"

Divine man whispers in Hooded man's ear: "Long live....Chicago...may the Hawks win"

**Cuts to black with ominous violin music rushing in**

 

[Alaskanice]

Yeah, Burke really nailed the Jillson, Morris, Kasper, Bernier, Setoguchi (over Kopitar), Petricki, and Wishart picks. You have to look at his whole record, not just the successes or the failures. Burke valued size and compete over skill. The team did pick exceptionally well in the 7th round, which I attribute to their willingness to scout and draft USHL players before other teams did.

If only we had the one guy who drafts only HOF players with every pick. That’d be awesome.

 

[Le Rosbeef]

Would anyone do pick 100 for Vladar? Dude isn’t even 26 yet.

Absolutely I would. 44% of 4th round picks ever play in the NHL.

Vladar is cheap, signed for 2 years and we can legitimately give him chance to see if he has it, in a platoon with Kahkonen. It's a no brainer for me. I think he has untapped potential still and wanted us to draft him when he went in the 3rd round to Boston all those years back...

My random free agent speculation…Connor Clifton will be a Shark.

That's a good shout. Underrated player, RHD.

 

[Sendhelplease]

I had a dream (or maybe a nightmare) last night that Carlsson fell to 4, we were all super excited to take him, but then Grier traded the 4th pick and Couture (no retention) to Chicago for the 19th pick.

So we basically moved back 15 spots just to shed Couture’s contract, and missed out on Carlsson in the process. I woke up really pissed off.

This is the sign of a true fan. If you don't have nightmares about the Sharks making bad trades you aren't a true fan.

 

[gaucholoco3]

Apart from Seto, these were all late 1st rounders which have a historical hit rate of ~25-30%. Burke missed on Jillson, Morris, Kaspar, Petrecki, Wishart, Mueller and Goldobin but hit on Hannan, Cheechoo, Goc, Bernier (600+ NHL games), Coyle, Hertl and Norris in the same range. That's much higher than 30%.

Every team/scouting staff ever has more misses than hits. Burke's overall record was among the best in the league. This article only covers 2003-2013 but the Sharks come out as the 2nd best drafting team in that era without even taking into account the extremely low value of their picks on average.

Also Seto can’t be seen as too much of a disappointment seeing as he was the main piece of a trade for a Norris winning Defenseman.

 

[hotcabbagesoup]

If only we had the one guy who drafts only HOF players with every pick. That’d be awesome.

Steve Yzerman, as Red Wings fans never shy from telling us

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

Steve Yzerman, as Red Wings fans never shy from telling us

Stan Bowman would’ve been that guy if he wasn’t such a shitty human.

 

[tiburon12]

No. I’m not eating $4M for 7 years for a goalie and 2 late first rounders that won’t be NHL players until 2028-2030 (if they ever make it). I’m not retaining 50% for 7 years on literally any player, but if it were to happen there has to be slam dunks coming back in return.

Honestly why ? I know of one team that really needs a center now. Columbus goes all in and we trade Hertl for the 3rd overall straight up. We end up with pick 3-4-26 in the first round. Rebuild accelerated .

My thought was that we don't need Hertl now, but a team with a closing window in Boston does. But once Marchand's deal is up the Bruins might miss the playoffs or bow out early. So they idea is we get their firsts that coincide with that slide. Plus by the time we need the cap space 4m retained salary should be palatable for two years or so.

And those firsts don't need to be used in the draft, they can be capital for future trades.

Swayman was just an example of a current piece to get since Boston has few prospects.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Absolutely I would. 44% of 4th round picks ever play in the NHL.

Vladar is cheap, signed for 2 years and we can legitimately give him chance to see if he has it, in a platoon with Kahkonen. It's a no brainer for me. I think he has untapped potential still and wanted us to draft him when he went in the 3rd round to Boston all those years back...



That's a good shout. Underrated player, RHD.

Vladar is going to cost a 2nd at a minimum so the 4th convo seems like wishful thinking. I’m not giving up a 2nd for him personally. We’re not ready to address our goaltending and I don’t want another Hill situation.

 

[Hodge]

Hertl has a full NMC and a young family. He’s not going anywhere. Thank you Doug Wilson for leaving one last steaming turd on your way out.

 

[TheBeard]

Hertl has a full NMC and a young family. He’s not going anywhere. Thank you Doug Wilson for leaving one last steaming turd on your way out.

Meh. I think of all the long-term vets we have, he’s the one I don’t mind keeping around. Vlasic I firmly believe will be bought out next year and I do think we trade EK and Logan this season. Hertl seems like someone who would be good for the kids in development even if his contract is expensive.