Speculation: 2022-23 Roster Thread Part II

[FiveHoleTickler]

Don't agree with the majority here regarding Gibson but I'm too Getzlaf to be his white knight. Not a fight I can win and you know what they say about people arguing on the interwebs.

As for the rest of the team, they've all been disappointing one way or another, and I had low expectations coming into this season.

The team's mentality is seeping into the fans' now...

 

[anezthes]

The team's mentality is seeping into the fans' now...

Gotta choose your battles wisely.

(Gibson's elite. **** all y'all.)

 

[Hockey Duckie]

What was the surprise? That they were so disappointing?

To many fans, pundits, and our very own GM, it was a surprise. Verbeek thought we should be around .500. The Hockey News had one pundit believing the Ducks' roster would be a playoff team when citing Strome, Klingberg, and Vatrano acquisitions. On this board alone, Klingberg was very much hyped up all off-season as they neglected to look at Klingberg's continuously depreciating plus/minus rating on a playoff team.

Comparing last year's roster to start the season with this roster, many Duck fans identify that Eakins is the biggest culprit for this year's demise. Yet, the production between the two seasons can't reconcile that thought. Sometimes, you cannot make lemonade with lemons.

I still think Eakins is just an interim coach for a coach Verbeek wants, but still... roster construction is the most significant factor.

 

[Leonardo87]

I dunno, I think the issue with this team starts with the defense. They can’t defend. Their gap control is lousy. They can’t make outlet passes. The only guys with any physicality are Benoit, Shattenkirk, and Beaulieu, who are all 6-7’s.

Yeah I agree. They are spending most of the time in their own zone defending and are pinned. Cannot generate offense When you are stuck in your own zone
defending.

Then add the lack of forecheck, cannot get a good cycle going in the opponents zone. Too many one and dones. If that makes sense.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I haven't seen this discussed much, but that's been surprising to see this season. He's stood out to me on a few occasions standing up at the blueline and closing the puck carrier off against the boards.

Never thought I'd see that after his first 2 years here.

Yeah, I think he’s one veteran who has tried to step up and lead by example. He knows what needs to be done, his body just isn’t what it used to be, but I don’t think he’s done as a player on the right type of team.

 

[Ducks DVM]

To many fans, pundits, and our very own GM, it was a surprise. Verbeek thought we should be around .500. The Hockey News had one pundit believing the Ducks' roster would be a playoff team when citing Strome, Klingberg, and Vatrano acquisitions. On this board alone, Klingberg was very much hyped up all off-season as they neglected to look at Klingberg's continuously depreciating plus/minus rating on a playoff team.

Comparing last year's roster to start the season with this roster, many Duck fans identify that Eakins is the biggest culprit for this year's demise. Yet, the production between the two seasons can't reconcile that thought. Sometimes, you cannot make lemonade with lemons.

I still think Eakins is just an interim coach for a coach Verbeek wants, but still... roster construction is the most significant factor.

 

[SmokeyDuck]

Maybe I'm alone but I haven't found Kulikov, Strome, or Vatrano disappointing at all really? They've all been as productive as I expected. Guys like Jones, Silfverberg, Lundestrom, Comtois, Gibson, and obviously Klingberg have all been much more disappointing to me than any of those 3

I agree with this. They have been alright, and Im curious to how they would do under a better coach with a realistic system.

 

[Goose of Reason]

Henrique is very good

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Henrique is very good

And he kills penalties!

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I'm not in favor of trading Rico this year. And if Rico continues his very good play next year, then I wouldn't want to trade him then either b/c we really do lack top-6 talent to help our youths develop.

 

[Leonardo87]

I'm not in favor of trading Rico this year. And if Rico continues his very good play next year, then I wouldn't want to trade him then either b/c we really do lack top-6 talent to help our youths develop.

I am on this train also. The kids are getting that support they need. Mac is pacing around 50 points, Z around 65 points, Terry closer to 70 points. Rico has been a big supporter with that. The Top 6 is lacking as it is. How much do you gut the team to where you risk player development? I am actually excited that they are producing like this on this team, imagine when they have a better PP , system, and more support.

I think we’ll get a 1st for Klingberg, and a bunch of 3rd‘s for the other pending UFAs. Already have 3 2nd’s this draft, 2 3rds and our 1st round.

I know Verbeek wants as many darts as possible to throw at that board but he has to stop and look, and not totally blow up the entire team. Right now the trio development of Zegras, McTavish, and Terry are more important than any futures with the exception of a Top 3 pick. That would be the only reason to moving Rico, to help lock in that Top 3 pick, but at what expense? Kids are playing well, and that is very important. Can you Imagine this team worse than now? Lol.

 

[AngelDuck]

I'm not in favor of trading Rico this year. And if Rico continues his very good play next year, then I wouldn't want to trade him then either b/c we really do lack top-6 talent to help our youths develop.

But if you can get a 1st in this draft you have to consider it

 

[Leonardo87]

But if you can get a 1st in this draft you have to consider it

The offer has to be really good like crazy overpayment for Verbeek to consider. Sure, if we have three 1st round picks after moving Klingberg and Rico, will be nice, but do we really take all our vet support away from the kids. Strome has been playing better, but our Top 6 is lacking now as it is. Moving Rico would be really creating a big hole up there.

 

[AngelDuck]

The offer has to be really good like crazy overpayment for Verbeek to consider. Sure, if we have three 1st round picks after moving Klingberg and Rico, will be nice, but do we really take all our vet support away from the kids. Strome has been playing better, but our Top 6 is lacking now as it is. Moving Rico would be really creating a big hole up there.

You figure that out in the offseason IMO as far as a replacement goes. This season is toast and doesn’t matter anymore. We’re kind of committed to that at this point by keeping Eakins around

 

[FiveHoleTickler]

Henrique is very good

Quite the rebound after passing through waivers not too long ago.

 

[Goose of Reason]

Henrique will be 33 next month. He's playing awesome but does not fit our timeline and if you can get a first in this draft you take that and run with it. And I think Verbeek will be thinking along those lines as well.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

But if you can get a 1st in this draft you have to consider it

Take a look at this situation from a mile away. A late first round pick often will not be of help the very next season and probably not for a few seasons.

2018, 2nd C Groulx is still in the AHL.​

2019, late 1st LW Tracey is still in the AHL.​

2020, late 1st RW Perreault is still in the AHL.​

Any late first round pick will not produce like prime Rico produces this year and next year or a few years after their draft year. And if Rico continues his good play next year, then I'd consider offering him an extension. Last year's late first round pick was a shutdown center, not a potential scoring top-6 forward like 6'1 RW Snuggerud or 6'0 C Kulich.

We already have a top-5 farm team and will be adding a potential top-3 pick in this year's draft along with having a high 2nd and 3rd round pick. Anaheim has collected five top-10 picks for the last five drafts with C Zegras (9th), RD Drysdale (6th), C McTavish (3rd), RD Mintyukov (10th), and 2023 potential top-3 forward selection. Getting rid of Rico surely feels like the "decade of Oiler mediocrity" just to collect 1st round picks.

The offer has to be really good like crazy overpayment for Verbeek to consider. Sure, if we have three 1st round picks after moving Klingberg and Rico, will be nice, but do we really take all our vet support away from the kids. Strome has been playing better, but our Top 6 is lacking now as it is. Moving Rico would be really creating a big hole up there.

I wouldn't entertain trading Rico because I feel like we're heading towards a "decade of Oiler mediocrity".

Verbeek already gutted the defense and we are terribly struggling. We're battling for the worst record in the league. Our PK would be vastly worse if we had not converted Rico to play on the PK. Rico has helped Z and Terry to start the season. Rico is now helping McTavish as the new 1C. Rico is also on the PP. Despite a terrible season, Rico is the common factor in helping the offenses of Terry, Z, and, now, McTavish.

Rico is a talented top-6 forward who knows how to play the right way. He is a great example as well as sets a great standard of play for all of our forwards despite being in rebuild seasons. For any Duck player who has played 20 games or more, Rico has the best +/- rating with a -2. The next closest are D Shattenkirk and F Comtois with -11. You can be offensively talented and be defensively responsible.

Which is why I'm disappointed with PV's veteran acquisitions of C Strome and RW Vatrano (also Klingberg). Both are/were playing on the 2nd line and not facing opposing team's best defensive forward lines. Rico is like the Lindholm on our offense and doesn't get enough credit.

2021-22 Ducks Plus/MInus

Lindholm (61 games) +0 - Drysdale -26​

Fowler -9, Manson (45 games) +0​

2022-23 Plus/Minus

Line 1: Rico (-2) - Zegras (-25) - Terry (-14)​

Line 2: xxx - Strome (-22) - Vatrano (-24)​

Rico hasn't quit. When Rico was waived during COVID season, that was a wakeup call to his professionalism and Eakins was there to help him find it again. With no top-6 veteran help on the horizon, Verbeek is going to compound a terrible situation to be worse with trading Rico this year. We want high standards. We want players who are responsible offensive and defensively. We want top players who don't quit.

 

[AngelDuck]

Take a look at this situation from a mile away. A late first round pick often will not be of help the very next season and probably not for a few seasons.

2018, 2nd C Groulx is still in the AHL.​

2019, late 1st LW Tracey is still in the AHL.​

2020, late 1st RW Perreault is still in the AHL.​

Any late first round pick will not produce like prime Rico produces this year and next year or a few years after their draft year. And if Rico continues his good play next year, then I'd consider offering him an extension. Last year's late first round pick was a shutdown center, not a potential scoring top-6 forward like 6'1 RW Snuggerud or 6'0 C Kulich.

We already have a top-5 farm team and will be adding a potential top-3 pick in this year's draft along with having a high 2nd and 3rd round pick. Anaheim has collected five top-10 picks for the last five drafts with C Zegras (9th), RD Drysdale (6th), C McTavish (3rd), RD Mintyukov (10th), and 2023 potential top-3 forward selection. Getting rid of Rico surely feels like the "decade of Oiler mediocrity" just to collect 1st round picks.



I wouldn't entertain trading Rico because I feel like we're heading towards a "decade of Oiler mediocrity".

Verbeek already gutted the defense and we are terribly struggling. We're battling for the worst record in the league. Our PK would be vastly worse if we had not converted Rico to play on the PK. Rico has helped Z and Terry to start the season. Rico is now helping McTavish as the new 1C. Rico is also on the PP. Despite a terrible season, Rico is the common factor in helping the offenses of Terry, Z, and, now, McTavish.

Rico is a talented top-6 forward who knows how to play the right way. He is a great example as well as sets a great standard of play for all of our forwards despite being in rebuild seasons. For any Duck player who has played 20 games or more, Rico has the best +/- rating with a -2. The next closest are D Shattenkirk and F Comtois with -11. You can be offensively talented and be defensively responsible.

Which is why I'm disappointed with PV's veteran acquisitions of C Strome and RW Vatrano (also Klingberg). Both are/were playing on the 2nd line and not facing opposing team's best defensive forward lines. Rico is like the Lindholm on our offense and doesn't get enough credit.

2021-22 Ducks Plus/MInus

Lindholm (61 games) +0 - Drysdale -26​

Fowler -9, Manson (45 games) +0​

2022-23 Plus/Minus

Line 1: Rico (-2) - Zegras (-25) - Terry (-14)​

Line 2: xxx - Strome (-22) - Vatrano (-24)​

Rico hasn't quit. When Rico was waived during COVID season, that was a wakeup call to his professionalism and Eakins was there to help him find it again. With no top-6 veteran help on the horizon, Verbeek is going to compound a terrible situation to be worse with trading Rico this year. We want high standards. We want players who are responsible offensive and defensively. We want top players who don't quit.

Sure but there’s also Shea Theodore’s, Rickard Rakells, Olen Zellweger’s etc that get picked in the late 1st.

We’ve botched some late 1sts in recent years(and I think some of that is poor development) but I’m willing to roll the dice on it again

 

[DavidBL]

Sure but there’s also Shea Theodore’s, Rickard Rakells, Olen Zellweger’s etc that get picked in the late 1st.

We’ve botched some late 1sts in recent years(and I think some of that is poor development) but I’m willing to roll the dice on it again

Ducks have drafted 1 top 6 forward in the last 11 years not including Z or McTavish. We have bombed on pretty much ALL of our forward picks since Rakell: Jones, Steel, Kerdiles, Roy, Sorenson, Ritchie, Kase(There is an argument he would have been except for injuries), Nattinen, MC(jury is still out but chances aren't looking great), Morand, Lundestrom, Groulx. That is really depressing to see written out as most of these are all first or second round picks.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Ducks have drafted 1 top 6 forward in the last 11 years not including Z or McTavish. We have bombed on pretty much ALL of our forward picks since Rakell: Jones, Steel, Kerdiles, Roy, Sorenson, Ritchie, Kase(There is an argument he would have been except for injuries), Nattinen, MC(jury is still out but chances aren't looking great), Morand, Lundestrom, Groulx. That is really depressing to see written out as most of these are all first or second round picks.

Does seem Forwards are an area of weakness for Madden and some new scouts being brought in by Verbeek would be good. Perreault, Tracey, Colangelo and Pastujov could all bust and all they would have to show is Zegras, McTavish as top6 forwards. Pastujov seems high risk high reward.

So many Madden drafted Dmen have either panned out on other teams or in Anaheim. No surprise they seem to have struck gold on Mintyukov. Even Mahura seems to be playing good now.

 

[DavidBL]

Does seem Forwards are an area of weakness for Madden and some new scouts being brought in by Verbeek would be good. Perreault, Tracey, Colangelo and Pastujov could all bust and all they would have to show is Zegras, McTavish as top6 forwards. Pastujov seems high risk high reward.

So many Madden drafted Dmen have either panned out on other teams or in Anaheim. No surprise they seem to have struck gold on Mintyukov. Even Mahura seems to be playing good now.

I think the criticism is fair, Outside of 2011 I think Palmieri was the only other top 6 forward who did not get that until we traded him. Our Drafting success has been very focused on D and G. As a whole it kept us competitive for years but now its really evident how much that aspect has hurt the org.

 

[TopShelfWaterBottle]

Montour having a great season

 

[AngelDuck]

Ducks have drafted 1 top 6 forward in the last 11 years not including Z or McTavish. We have bombed on pretty much ALL of our forward picks since Rakell: Jones, Steel, Kerdiles, Roy, Sorenson, Ritchie, Kase(There is an argument he would have been except for injuries), Nattinen, MC(jury is still out but chances aren't looking great), Morand, Lundestrom, Groulx. That is really depressing to see written out as most of these are all first or second round picks.

No argument, they haven’t been great drafting in that particular area lately.

I have to wonder if it’s drafting or developing problems though and I think I lean towards the latter

 

[Duck Off]

Maybe I'm alone but I haven't found Kulikov, Strome, or Vatrano disappointing at all really? They've all been as productive as I expected. Guys like Jones, Silfverberg, Lundestrom, Comtois, Gibson, and obviously Klingberg have all been much more disappointing to me than any of those 3

I agree though the Strome one is due to my low expectations of him going into this season. Still think that was a very stupid signing

 

[Leonardo87]

I agree though the Strome one is due to my low expectations of him going into this season. Still think that was a very stupid signing

I think Strome will be a good stop gap for the team till some of the younger prospects are ready to make the NHL. He has been finding some decent chemistry with Z, so that’s a good sign.