2022/23 Roster Thread II: Worth Every Penny

[FlyerNutter]

We have official confirmation that Fletcher is able to keep breathing without having to think about doing so.

Little victories.

 

[Adam Warlock]

I love how Flyers fandom keeps having meltdowns about things that later come out as not true.

 

[deadhead]

I hope that's true because the rumoured offer is terrible

That wasn't even a rumor, more like rank speculation.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I think the $9M QO next off-season complicates things. DeBrincat could & probably should accept that given the payout & the walk right to UFA. Even if he likes a team there’s probably no point to sign a long term extension next summer unless someone matches that $9M for long term.

We’ve seen it with teams with lesser players where they actually didn’t extend the QO because the player would likely accept it but that was with players down the lineup. You obviously have to QO DeBrincat but it plays right into his hands.

Burakovsky in Washington was one. The way his contract was structured he was due for a nice raise with his QO but he never really progressed past a decent middle of the lineup guy so Washington never extended the QO.

In most cases the player accepting the QO does them no good as they could get more money/term.

 

[deadhead]

He kowtowed plenty in Columbus. He isn't the GM. He is the coach. He'll try to use the players he's given even if they're not his idea of ideal players, just like he always has his whole career.

He didn't get players he didn't like until the end, when it was obvious he was headed out the door.

Doubt Torts would have signed off on Laine, but at that point it didn't matter, once they let Panarin walk, Torts knew it was just a matter of time.

 

[Beef Invictus]

He didn't get players he didn't like until the end, when it was obvious he was headed out the door.

Doubt Torts would have signed off on Laine, but at that point it didn't matter, once they let Panarin walk, Torts knew it was just a matter of time.

Uh, he was walking out the door because he didn't have "players he liked" and he was making the call to leave for the good of the team and himself.

It's clear at this point you're just fabricating elaborate fantasies about Tortorella.

 

[renberg]

Kekalainen had a different vision for the style of play that he wanted on the ice and the players that he thought would bring that about. Torts wasn't the guy to do this for him so he was a goner. Both showed class in that there wasn't any fight in the media between them. No one was embarrassed by getting canned. They just agreed to disagree and cut the string between them.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I would take LeBrun’s word over NHL watcher or whoever the hell that it was that planted that ridiculous trade rumor

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I would take LeBrun’s word over NHL watcher or whoever the hell that it was that planted that ridiculous trade rumor

The “NHL Watcher” Twitter account just transcribes what Elliotte Friedman says on podcasts or radio interviews. It’s not the accounts words or thoughts. It’s often Friedman’s or his podcast partner Jeff Marek’s.

Friedman never said the Flyers were close to a deal just that were talks with Chicago & he thought the #5 pick would be the basis. But he admitted earlier on his podcast today that a source reached out to him after he said that & said the #5 pick isn’t on the table & likely won’t be going forward either.

 

[Rebels57]

Have you tried an inversion table? I spent $400 on one and worked better than I could have hoped.

Just got one myself and fully agree

 

[TheKingPin]

Suffering from some incredibly painful back spasms today. Still probably doesn’t hurt as much as the pain Cuck’s gonna give me over the next few weeks.

Oh happy day

Ice it up. I injured my back a few times lifting and put heat on it until others here told me ice. Then fixed my form and got a lifting belt and I’ve been good since.

 

[Evergreen]

I saw on the Trade board that teams are quietly approaching Calgary about Matthew Tkachuk. I wonder if the Flyers would be interested and what it would take to get it done. Tkachuk had 100 points this past season.

If Fletcher really wants to make a 2007-style splash, maybe he ships out some salary to sign Gaudreau and trade for Tkachuk. We would need to be sure that Tkachuk would re-sign beyond next season, however. It would probably put us in cap hell having those two plus Hayes and Couturier all making $7M plus at forward though.

 

[Rebels57]

I saw on the Trade board that teams are quietly approaching Calgary about Matthew Tkachuk. I wonder if the Flyers would be interested and what it would take to get it done. Tkachuk had 100 points this past season.

If Fletcher really wants to make a 2007-style splash, maybe he ships out some salary to sign Gaudreau and trade for Tkachuk. We would need to be sure that Tkachuk would re-sign beyond next season, however. It would probably put us in cap hell having those two plus Hayes and Couturier all making $7M plus at forward though.

Now that's a player I would trade 5th overall for.

 

[flyerslducks]

I saw on the Trade board that teams are quietly approaching Calgary about Matthew Tkachuk. I wonder if the Flyers would be interested and what it would take to get it done. Tkachuk had 100 points this past season.

If Fletcher really wants to make a 2007-style splash, maybe he ships out some salary to sign Gaudreau and trade for Tkachuk. We would need to be sure that Tkachuk would re-sign beyond next season, however. It would probably put us in cap hell having those two plus Hayes and Couturier all making $7M plus at forward though.

A lot of this could be achieved or tried at the very least….if we didn’t sign hayes and didn’t acquire risto. Two players that will never bring us to the promise land and are just using up almost 12 million. If we didn’t have them, we would have had higher draft picks, more cap space, and more assets. If we traded jvr this year that would’ve meant we had almost 20 mill to work with

 

[blackjackmulligan]

A lot of this could be achieved or tried at the very least….if we didn’t sign hayes and didn’t acquire risto. Two players that will never bring us to the promise land and are just using up almost 12 million. If we didn’t have them, we would have had higher draft picks, more cap space, and more assets. If we traded jvr this year that would’ve meant we had almost 20 mill to work with

Or Couturier for the next 8 years.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

It’s pretty debatable if the Flyers can even add one big salary/contract this summer let alone two. They have to make other moves to even facilitate this & they’re doing so with an entire league that knows they’re desperate as all hell.

We also got to stop comparing this off-season to 2007. The Flyers essentially had a real clean slate heading into that off-season in terms of assets & capspace. They added Briere, Timonen, & Hartnell all that summer to UFA deals. $6.5, $6.3M, & $4.2M caphits that summer without the need to move around salary. They acquired Timonen & Hartnell’s signing rights with the first rounder they got in the Forsberg in season trade in 2007. Beyond those guys you had guys like Richards, Carter, Coburn, Umberger, Lupul, Upshall, etc. who were on RFA deals.

 

[Curufinwe]

Or Couturier for the next 8 years.

1 of those things is not like the others. 1 of them is a 1C, which every team needs to be competitive.

 

[Diaper Mask Bandits]

Uh, he was walking out the door because he didn't have "players he liked" and he was making the call to leave for the good of the team and himself.

It's clear at this point you're just fabricating elaborate fantasies about Tortorella.

not as elaborate as the ones where we have so much depth and players are going to have to battle for a sport because of RAtcliffe, allison, lacyinzki, brink, york, zamula, attard, echo and bunnyman, tippet, frost

 

[blackjackmulligan]

1 of those things is not like the others. 1 of them is a 1C, which every team needs to be competitive.

With or without Couturier this team will not be going anywhere. Can’t wait to see how he is playing in 4 years. Signing him to an 8 year deal was foolish and dumb. Has nothing to do with the player himself. He should have bene moved at the 2021 deadline. Just another mismanaged opportunity the GM didn’t capitalize on.

 

[Curufinwe]

By that logic, Sanheim should be traded tomorrow. Just get rid of all our best players.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

It’s pretty debatable if the Flyers can even add one big salary/contract this summer let alone two. They have to make other moves to even facilitate this & they’re doing so with an entire league that knows they’re desperate as all hell.

We also got to stop comparing this off-season to 2007. The Flyers essentially had a real clean slate heading into that off-season in terms of assets & capspace. They added Briere, Timonen, & Hartnell all that summer to UFA deals. $6.5, $6.3M, & $4.2M caphits that summer without the need to move around salary. They acquired Timonen & Hartnell’s signing rights with the first rounder they got in the Forsberg in season trade in 2007. Beyond those guys you had guys like Richards, Carter, Coburn, Umberger, Lupul, Upshall, etc. who were on RFA deals.

This is the most asinine comparison of two offseasons I can think of. I can't stand when I see people act like they're even close to similar.

06-07 had picks, prospects, and tons of cap space. We made these big adds:

Hartnell $4.25 mill
Timonen $6.3 mill
Briere $6.5 mill
Lupul $2.3 mill
Smith $1.97 mill

That's 21 million (more or less) spent that 06-07 offseason on additions (about 41% of the 50.3 mill cap).
One of those moves cost us a 1st (Timonen & Hartnell trade rights)

We currently have 5.1 million with no easy way to create lots of cap without losing out on assets (so about 15% of our cap is open to play with now). We don't have many 1sts or extra picks to play with.

We had a cheap team with good prospects that were bolstered by trades/signings. We are *not* that team. Far from it.

By that logic, Sanheim should be traded tomorrow. Just get rid of all our best players.

I cringe when I see people say "Just trade Hart and start it all over"

I'll be anything that's the same guy who's been whining we can't find a franchise goaltender.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

2013 works better than 2007, especially if you discount the league throwing them the buyout life rafts. And without the superstar.

How's that for terrifying?

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

This is the most asinine comparison of two offseasons I can think of. I can't stand when I see people act like they're even close to similar.

06-07 had picks, prospects, and tons of cap space. We made these big adds:

Hartnell $4.25 mill
Timonen $6.3 mill
Briere $6.5 mill
Lupul $2.3 mill
Smith $1.97 mill

That's 21 million (more or less) spent that 06-07 offseason on additions (about 41% of the 50.3 mill cap).
One of those moves cost us a 1st (Timonen & Hartnell trade rights)

We currently have 5.1 million with no easy way to create lots of cap without losing out on assets (so about 15% of our cap is open to play with now). We don't have many 1sts or extra picks to play with.

We had a cheap team with good prospects that were bolstered by trades/signings. We are *not* that team. Far from it.



I cringe when I see people say "Just trade Hart and start it all over"

I'll be anything that's the same guy who's been whining we can't find a franchise goaltender.

The RFA guys were about to enter or just entered their prime too. Gagne was one of the older noteworthy pieces that were holdovers. But he was only 26-27 years old. He actually didn’t play much that initial season with only 25 games but the following season he was 70+ point guy. Giroux came along towards the last few years & was an impactful ELC guy.

Homer was starting from a good standpoint with a clean slate in 2007. He essentially pushed all his chips in from that point until it fall off in 2010-2011. Fletcher’s close to the end after pushing all his chips since he’s been hired. The roster is worse, it’s more expensive, & we’ve been shipping out way more picks than we’ve been bringing in even including some 1-2 rounders in multiple years.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

By that logic, Sanheim should be traded tomorrow. Just get rid of all our best players.

By what logic? He is 30 years old. He will be irrelevant if/when the flyers ever get into contention. Cap hit likely to be anchor. Not sure how you correlate that with getting grid of of all their best players. That might not be a bad thing anyway.

Well if he will not be signing an ext yes Sanheim should be moved. The draft will be a good time for that.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

2013 works better than 2007, especially if you discount the league throwing them the buyout life rafts. And without the superstar.

How's that for terrifying?

I think people forget about the advantage the Flyers had in the pre-2013 CBA without contract limits. Homer & the Flyers were one of the biggest reasons for the change. They manipulated caphits by adding fake years at the end to drive the price down. They front loaded all them so the players received the bulk of the contract in the beginning & middle with the end having barely money owed on it.

Obviously the league put limits & put rules in for how much you can front load. They also penalized the contracts with cap penalties which fortunately the Flyers avoided with Richards, Carter, & Weber anyway.

If the league never stepped in with changes & penalties that’s a big way to get around the hard cap for big market teams.