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Rumor: 2022-2022 Trade Rumors and Free Agency Part 14: Sakic goes back to bed

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The Abusement Park said:
He‘s frustrating man. The dude has unreal talent and should be a consistent 35 goal guy, but he’s as streaky a guy as your going to find. Think he’d be a good fit to help you guys through the rebuild and potentially a trigger man for Zegras. But I’d be somewhat wary of going long term with him.
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Thanks. Any word on what he's looking for in a new deal?
 
The Abusement Park said:
I mean do we really wanna sign Manson for 3/4/5 years at 30? It shouldn’t be too hard for this org to find a reliable guy to play bottom pairing minutes.
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You underestimate what Manson brings, and we've also seen how hard it's been to find players that can reliably play bottom pairing minutes in Bednar's system.

Sign Manson for 3-5 years without a second thought if it's $4 mil or under, can always offload his contract in year 4-5 if needed, much cheaper to offload him at that time than pay for a rental every deadline. Bednar's system still lives and dies with the defense being able to reliably transition the puck.
 
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Having Manson and EJ back to make this team hard to play against down low and in front of the net has been a big part of their playoff success this year.

I hope they don't take that for granted and let him go. Just keep as much of this team together as they can and they have a good shot and duplicating the success they've had.

Nuke and Manson should be priorities to bring back IMO. Bring back Cogs and Helm too. All four are the guys that have made them a complete team.
 
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If you bring back Manson it's to play 2nd pairing RD, not 3rd pairing.

I understand that EJ is playing more minutes in those playoffs but no one should assume that he's going to play in the top 4 next year.

PS: there's no such thing as a cheap 2nd pairing RD. Top 4 RD are super hard to find.
 
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PAZ said:
You underestimate what Manson brings, and we've also seen how hard it's been to find players that can reliably play bottom pairing minutes in Bednar's system.

Sign Manson for 3-5 years without a second thought if it's $4 mil or under, can always offload his contract in year 4-5 if needed, much cheaper to offload him at that time than pay for a rental every deadline. Bednar's system still lives and dies with the defense being able to reliably transition the puck.
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Manson is a perfect playoff dman, Joe should bring back helm and cogliano on another one year too.
 
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PAZ said:
You underestimate what Manson brings, and we've also seen how hard it's been to find players that can reliably play bottom pairing minutes in Bednar's system.

Sign Manson for 3-5 years without a second thought if it's $4 mil or under, can always offload his contract in year 4-5 if needed, much cheaper to offload him at that time than pay for a rental every deadline. Bednar's system still lives and dies with the defense being able to reliably transition the puck.
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But why would Manson sign for less than 4? He’ll easily get paid more on the open market by some team. I’d love to keep Manson, but he shouldn’t be anywhere near a priority signing with the upcoming cap crunch. Especially considering guys like Manson drop off a cliff faster than everyone save for power forwards maybe. The focus should be Nuke, Lehkonen, and figuring out how much Mack will be taking up.
 
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PAZ said:
You underestimate what Manson brings, and we've also seen how hard it's been to find players that can reliably play bottom pairing minutes in Bednar's system.

Sign Manson for 3-5 years without a second thought if it's $4 mil or under, can always offload his contract in year 4-5 if needed, much cheaper to offload him at that time than pay for a rental every deadline. Bednar's system still lives and dies with the defense being able to reliably transition the puck.
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Manson for 4 and especially 5 years shouldn't even be discussed. $3.5m X3, or $4mx3 tops.

That isn't to say that I don't like him, I think he's doing a great job, but paying 30+ bottom 4 Dmen is how you get into cap trouble and forced to trade core players.

There should be some solid Dmen available relatively cheap who can fill that role. Also, don't discount the vets who want to chase a cup, which we saw to some extent with Murray last off-season; along with Cogliano, Helm, JJ, and Manson (who waived his partial NMC) among others who were all keen to join the Avs this year.
 
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The Pwnerer said:
If the Avs go all the way with the hockey world watching I can almost guarantee Girard will be a hot commodity and fetch us a huge sum if traded. Team's are going to try and replicate our style. Everyone is seeing how important it is to having elite puck moving defenseman on the back end.
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If teams start favouring elite transition Dmen more that should in turn lower the price for traditional defensive Dmen, which would play into the Avs hands as those are the types they'll need to sign/acquire on short term deals or as rentals to fill out the bottom 3.
 
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What sort of contract do you guys think Andrew Copp is going to be asking for after this playoff run?

Gotta think that he'd at least be a bit tempted to join this powerhouse Avs team given the perfect stylistic fit and the gaping hole at 2C. Lehkonen-Copp-Rantanen would be a pretty solid 2nd line behind Landeskog-Mackinnon-Nichuskin.

Signing Copp would also most likely allow you to keep Girard and ensure that you have an elite puckmover on every D pairing.
 
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Richard88 said:
What sort of contract do you guys think Andrew Copp is going to be asking for after this playoff run?

Gotta think that he'd at least be a bit tempted to join this powerhouse Avs team given the perfect stylistic fit and the gaping hole at 2C. Lehkonen-Copp-Rantanen would be a pretty solid 2nd line behind Landeskog-Mackinnon-Rantanen.

Signing Copp would also most likely allow you to keep Girard and ensure that you have an elite puckmover on every D pairing.
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Damn. Sakic cloned Mikko? Impressive :sarcasm:
 
The Abusement Park said:
But why would Manson sign for less than 4? He’ll easily get paid more on the open market by some team. I’d love to keep Manson, but he shouldn’t be anywhere near a priority signing with the upcoming cap crunch. Especially considering guys like Manson drop off a cliff faster than everyone save for power forwards maybe. The focus should be Nuke, Lehkonen, and figuring out how much Mack will be taking up.
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Lehky would be smart to wait to extend unless he is afraid to get an injury that would affect his next contract.

IMO Nuke, Mack and 2C are the priorities going into the offseason. With that said I would love a Lehky extension this summer.
 
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One thing I’m sure of, is the Avs are not going to Landeksog’s contract with Nichushkin.

Landy is the captain and had a much longer track record of success.
 
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Richard88 said:
Manson for 4 and especially 5 years shouldn't even be discussed. $3.5m X3, or $4mx3 tops.

That isn't to say that I don't like him, I think he's doing a great job, but paying 30+ bottom 4 Dmen is how you get into cap trouble and forced to trade core players.

There should be some solid Dmen available relatively cheap who can fill that role. Also, don't discount the vets who want to chase a cup, which we saw to some extent with Murray last off-season; along with Cogliano, Helm, JJ, and Manson (who waived his partial NMC) among others who were all keen to join the Avs this year.
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You are the only person I have ever seen use the term “bottom 4 Dmen.” You’re aware there are only 6 of them, right? I think too many of you are getting caught up with stat watching. Manson has a good history of durability which Girard and EJ do not. Moving on from Girard can net some good pieces to restock the roster for players that are going to walk. After this postseason, holding onto EJ should be a plan too. Play him less during the regular season to keep him fresh for the playoffs, like they did this year.

Toews-Makar
Byram-Manson
xxx-EJ
 
xbestboybandever said:
You are the only person I have ever seen use the term “bottom 4 Dmen.” You’re aware there are only 6 of them, right? I think too many of you are getting caught up with stat watching. Manson has a good history of durability which Girard and EJ do not. Moving on from Girard can net some good pieces to restock the roster for players that are going to walk. After this postseason, holding onto EJ should be a plan too. Play him less during the regular season to keep him fresh for the playoffs, like they did this year.

Toews-Makar
Byram-Manson
xxx-EJ
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:laugh: at least we actually know the stats and aren't making shit up.


"Good history of durability" yes he's only missed 70 games over the last 3 seasons. Great durability really.


On the flip side, Girard actually has shown to.be quite durable, this year being the first year of his career where he's missed more then a couple games. One freak injury.
 
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xbestboybandever said:
You are the only person I have ever seen use the term “bottom 4 Dmen.” You’re aware there are only 6 of them, right? I think too many of you are getting caught up with stat watching. Manson has a good history of durability which Girard and EJ do not. Moving on from Girard can net some good pieces to restock the roster for players that are going to walk. After this postseason, holding onto EJ should be a plan too. Play him less during the regular season to keep him fresh for the playoffs, like they did this year.

Toews-Makar
Byram-Manson
xxx-EJ
Click to expand...
What's wrong with "bottom 4 Dman"? It conveys precisely which part of the lineup I'm referring to. Manson is never going to be a top pair Dman, but it's also not fair to say he's a bottom pair man. He's being used flexibly between the middle pair and bottom pair. Thus I like to use bottom 4 because it denotes a flexibility and covers the grey area between someone being a 4/5 Dman rather than an outright top 4 D.

More generally, we use terms like "top 9", "bottom 6", "4th line", "bottom 9", "top 6",... Not sure why the same usage wouldn't apply to the D group as well... in saying "top pair," "top 4", "bottom pair", "top 4", "bottom 4"..
 
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