Prospect Info: 2022 - 1st OA] Juraj Slafkovsky (LW) Part 4

[HuGort]

As the cap goes up, so will player salary demands.

Gallagher's contract will be a problem, only question is how big of a problem. At any rate I don't see us contending for an ol there 4 years, so hopefully in the last couple of years of his deal, the cap space he takes up doesn't prevent us from landing or keeping a key piece. I suppose can we can always do what C as lgary did with Monahan, Chicago did with Bickel, Toronto did with Marleau, etc... and give a team good futures to get rid of the contract.

Going to be 4 years before we playoff team again. By then Gallagher contract be mostly over. His leadership next few years what Gorton wants.

 

[River Meadow]

What a bunch of baloney.

By virtue of the ice surface, European players tend to play a more finesse game than North Americans (obviously not often as talented though). This is exactly what Slaf has to improve — unless you’re happy with him being the next Armia or Anderson.

The issue of them adapting to North America is minor, not many genuinely talented players struggle with this and have it derail their careers. There have been plenty of European superstars like Hossa, Kopitar, and such.

Slaf could have been in Europe playing and being a big dog. Figuring things out on his own. Instead he’s rushed into the NHL, on pace for 20 points.

It’s not as if he had outgrown or outplayed Liiga ffs

In any case, the Habs are certain of their approach and confident in their ability to develop him and Dach. So… let’s see

People think the NHL is a develop league and he is ready.

We're most likely gonna learn the hard way just like we did with Gally and KK.

R.I.P



At least they did the right thing with Mesar..

 

[BaseballCoach]

People think the NHL is a develop league and he is ready.

We're most likely gonna learn the hard way just like we did with Gally and KK.

R.I.P



At least they did the right thing with Mesar..

Galchenyuk developed into a ppg player in the latter part of his 4th season and into his 5th season, then got hurt by Kopitar and had personal issues during rehab.

The NHL is not a "development league", but it is a league in which players develop ALL THE TIME.

Kotkaniemi was a ridiculous reach at #3 OA, and I agree he was NOT physically ready for the NHL in terms of balance, strength or stamina.

 

[BaseballCoach]

What a bunch of baloney.

By virtue of the ice surface, European players tend to play a more finesse game than North Americans (obviously not often as talented though). This is exactly what Slaf has to improve — unless you’re happy with him being the next Armia or Anderson.

The issue of them adapting to North America is minor, not many genuinely talented players struggle with this and have it derail their careers. There have been plenty of European superstars like Hossa, Kopitar, and such.

Slaf could have been in Europe playing and being a big dog. Figuring things out on his own. Instead he’s rushed into the NHL, on pace for 20 points.

It’s not as if he had outgrown or outplayed Liiga ffs

In any case, the Habs are certain of their approach and confident in their ability to develop him and Dach. So… let’s see

I don't agree that being a big dog is necessary for Slaf. He is already very confident in his abilities, but humble enough to work hard.

I also don't think it is necessarily better that he figure things out on his own, when the NHL has great skills coaches, and practicing with his teammates will allow him to pick up a LOT.

Competitive European teams looking to win now don't play 18 year olds in key situations, especially if they have been NHL drafted and the benefits of any investment in the player will be short lived.

Alexander Romanov played restricted minutes in the KHL at ages 18-19, and when he came to NA at 20 years old, developed here. He also never had to go to Laval because he was able to be a 6th D and physically he was not frail. Barron on the other hand, at around the same age, has to go to Laval because he is NOT able to be a 6th D.

We all overthink this sometimes, it is often as simple as being good enough to play here versus not.

At anywhere from 18 to 22, learning and progressing is more the norm than the exception, whether at the NHL, AHL, European, NCAA or Junior levels.

The level at which you learn is dictated by the level you can handle (and some legalities).

The speed at which you learn depends on learning ability, quality of coaching, quality of mentoring, and quality of opposition.

The results on the ice depend on the levels of talent and development. The more talented players tend to do better, unless they have challenges learning, either mental or physical or both.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Going to be 4 years before we playoff team again. By then Gallagher contract be mostly over. His leadership next few years what Gorton wants.

I doubt that it takes 4 years to become a playoff team. We have a crapload of good prospects, which increases the chances a number of them will become good NHL players.

We also have a larger number of high draft picks than the average over the next two years, and assets that will get us even more.

And we have a TON of cap space ($22M in July 2024 as of today's projection) to add other real and solid contributors. That's a LOT of power to tilt the odds.

 

[Habs10Habs]

If he misses next game I'm done.

So, you don't believe he's injured?

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

People think the NHL is a develop league and he is ready.

We're most likely gonna learn the hard way just like we did with Gally and KK.

R.I.P



At least they did the right thing with Mesar..

If he busts, I think this will be the worst flop in franchise and even NHL history, bigger than Daigle.

 

[BaseballCoach]

If he busts, I think this will be the worst flop in franchise and even NHL history, bigger than Daigle.

Wickenheiser?

 

[Andrei79]

If he busts, I think this will be the worst flop in franchise and even NHL history, bigger than Daigle.

Right. Daigle was seen as one of the next ones and completely fizzled. And you think one of the weaker 1st OAs in years would be a bigger flop ? Ok. Why is this even talked about, he's played 5 NHL games.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Right. Daigle was seen as one of the next ones and completely fizzled. And you think one of the weaker 1st OAs in years would be a bigger flop ? Ok. Why is this even talked about, he's played 5 NHL games.

Regrettably, some came to that conclusion after Slafkovsky played one game. For some here, waiting 5 games is an exercise in measured restraint.

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

Right. Daigle was seen as one of the next ones and completely fizzled. And you think one of the weaker 1st OAs in years would be a bigger flop ? Ok. Why is this even talked about, he's played 5 NHL games.

Never said he will. Some posters here seem to think so.

Wickenheiser?

The Habs were pretty strong back then, therefore it was tossed under the rug.

 

[ReHabs]

Going to be 4 years before we playoff team again. By then Gallagher contract be mostly over. His leadership next few years what Gorton wants.

What leadership? He can’t even lead himself to finish a shift.

I don't agree that being a big dog is necessary for Slaf. He is already very confident in his abilities, but humble enough to work hard.

I also don't think it is necessarily better that he figure things out on his own, when the NHL has great skills coaches, and practicing with his teammates will allow him to pick up a LOT.

Competitive European teams looking to win now don't play 18 year olds in key situations, especially if they have been NHL drafted and the benefits of any investment in the player will be short lived.

Alexander Romanov played restricted minutes in the KHL at ages 18-19, and when he came to NA at 20 years old, developed here. He also never had to go to Laval because he was able to be a 6th D and physically he was not frail. Barron on the other hand, at around the same age, has to go to Laval because he is NOT able to be a 6th D.

We all overthink this sometimes, it is often as simple as being good enough to play here versus not.

At anywhere from 18 to 22, learning and progressing is more the norm than the exception, whether at the NHL, AHL, European, NCAA or Junior levels.

The level at which you learn is dictated by the level you can handle (and some legalities).

The speed at which you learn depends on learning ability, quality of coaching, quality of mentoring, and quality of opposition.

The results on the ice depend on the levels of talent and development. The more talented players tend to do better, unless they have challenges learning, either mental or physical or both.

If Slaf is good enough to play scoring line minutes in the NHL, then he is good enough to play scoring line minutes in any European league. It is BALONEY to say that a European team would intentionally underplay him because of his age — he wasn’t given good minutes in Liiga because he didn’t or couldn’t earn it (according to Liiga/TPS fans).

Competitive teams try to win their competitions. The NHL’s incumbent 1OA should be, theoretically, good enough to play top6 minutes for many (or any) European team.

Of course, allegedly 2022 was an exceptionally bad year for the draft… so it only goes to reinforce how Slaf had no business being rushed into the NHL.

In any case, if he still can’t earn and sustain scoring minutes today, on the dead last ranked team that is desperate for his success and has a lot of garbagio dead weight, then that’s his problem to overcome. No amount of skills coaching and coaxing can change the fact that in an immediate sense a team’s coach will lean on the players he feels are likeliest to help his team win. If Hoffman, Drouin, and Gallagher are above Slaf on the depth chart then there is too much of a gap for him at this time.

From the onset I said he should go back to Liiga and actually put up league points for the first time in his adult career. My second preference was big minutes in Europe or AHL. Third was CHL because of the concern of him learning bad habits against weak defences. The worst option was to rush him into the NHL when he’s not yet NHL quality for even the dead last ranked team.

I otherwise agree with your position on development but I disagree with your position on Slaf. I want his success but I think too many here have been convinced nothing can go wrong with this project… couldn’t be further from the truth.

 

[BaseballCoach]

What leadership? He can’t even lead himself to finish a shift.


If Slaf is good enough to play scoring line minutes in the NHL, then he is good enough to play scoring line minutes in any European league. It is BALONEY to say that a European team would intentionally underplay him because of his age — he wasn’t given good minutes in Liiga because he didn’t or couldn’t earn it (according to Liiga/TPS fans).

Competitive teams try to win their competitions. The NHL’s incumbent 1OA should be, theoretically, good enough to play top6 minutes for many (or any) European team.

Of course, allegedly 2022 was an exceptionally bad year for the draft… so it only goes to reinforce how Slaf had no business being rushed into the NHL.

In any case, if he still can’t earn and sustain scoring minutes today, on the dead last ranked team that is desperate for his success and has a lot of garbagio dead weight, then that’s his problem to overcome. No amount of skills coaching and coaxing can change the fact that in an immediate sense a team’s coach will lean on the players he feels are likeliest to help his team win. If Hoffman, Drouin, and Gallagher are above Slaf on the depth chart then there is too much of a gap for him at this time.

From the onset I said he should go back to Liiga and actually put up league points for the first time in his adult career. My second preference was big minutes in Europe or AHL. Third was CHL because of the concern of him learning bad habits against weak defences. The worst option was to rush him into the NHL when he’s not yet NHL quality for even the dead last ranked team.

I otherwise agree with your position on development but I disagree with your position on Slaf. I want his success but I think too many here have been convinced nothing can go wrong with this project… couldn’t be further from the truth.

I agree with your principle or approach. If Slaf is worse than all of Hoffman, Drouin and Dadonov, he does not merit being in the starting lineup, and should not be gifted a spot. He should go to, I would say, Laval. I think he needs to learn the NA ice surface so why delay that?

 

[NotProkofievian]

NHL teams, especially the rich ones like the Habs, have coaches for pretty much every single aspect of the game.

Yet 18 years old should be figuring things out on their own.




from people who know better....

The habs didn't have a skating coach or a skills coach until HuGo arrived.

 

[BlackEye from Xhekaj]

What leadership? He can’t even lead himself to finish a shift.


If Slaf is good enough to play scoring line minutes in the NHL, then he is good enough to play scoring line minutes in any European league. It is BALONEY to say that a European team would intentionally underplay him because of his age — he wasn’t given good minutes in Liiga because he didn’t or couldn’t earn it (according to Liiga/TPS fans).

Competitive teams try to win their competitions. The NHL’s incumbent 1OA should be, theoretically, good enough to play top6 minutes for many (or any) European team.

Of course, allegedly 2022 was an exceptionally bad year for the draft… so it only goes to reinforce how Slaf had no business being rushed into the NHL.

In any case, if he still can’t earn and sustain scoring minutes today, on the dead last ranked team that is desperate for his success and has a lot of garbagio dead weight, then that’s his problem to overcome. No amount of skills coaching and coaxing can change the fact that in an immediate sense a team’s coach will lean on the players he feels are likeliest to help his team win. If Hoffman, Drouin, and Gallagher are above Slaf on the depth chart then there is too much of a gap for him at this time.

From the onset I said he should go back to Liiga and actually put up league points for the first time in his adult career. My second preference was big minutes in Europe or AHL. Third was CHL because of the concern of him learning bad habits against weak defences. The worst option was to rush him into the NHL when he’s not yet NHL quality for even the dead last ranked team.

I otherwise agree with your position on development but I disagree with your position on Slaf. I want his success but I think too many here have been convinced nothing can go wrong with this project… couldn’t be further from the truth.

Dear @ExpatHabs,

Continuing your rants written in a variety of ways does not convey your opinion any better than yesterday. Again, when you say "put up points for the first time in his adult career," you again base this argument off of stats seen on a web page, or base it off those who share a similar view point that you would like to follow. Until you take the time to go back and watch his usage, his role, and his play in Liiga, your opinions are invalid.

Once again, you continue to say that he is being rushed to the NHL. He is dipping his toes in the wadding pool at the moment, and is in no way being thrown into the deep end. He is being given limited minutes in a bottom 6 role to learn and adapt to the NHL game.. this is not "being rushed."

To your other point, 1oa picks are not all the same. European teams often rely on their veteran players to help win league championships, this is no secret. Slafkovsky could absolutely play a top 6 role for many clubs, I am confident of that, but he's not in Europe, nor will he be going back to Europe (which again, I don't understand your logic, because you would simply look at the box score after each game and judge his performance in Liiga as you've done before). Thus your argument is once again, going nowhere.

I'm happy to hear that you would like him to succeed, but you are far too critical of his past (which to you was all secondary accounts), and him being in the NHL currently seems to bother you immensely. What I suggest is taking a step back, go watch his Liiga games (which I know you will not do, but until then your arguments are falling on deaf ears), reassess, and then come back here with a clear head and fresh eyes.

Hope to hear from you soon,

Signed,

A concerned fan

 

[CHfan1]

Is Slafkovsky’s going to play?

 

[morhilane]

Is Slafkovsky’s going to play?

Slaf and Armia in?

 

[jrom]

Slaf and Armia in?

Dach - Monahan with Slaf or Armia ? The other one would likely play with Evans and Pezz

 

[BaseballCoach]

NHL teams, especially the rich ones like the Habs, have coaches for pretty much every single aspect of the game.

Yet 18 years old should be figuring things out on their own.




from people who know better....

I did not mention only coaches. I also mentioned teammates, opposition, and the ice surface. Besides the coaching, he gets to figure things out on his own interacting with teammates, seeing what they do and what works or does not work, measuring himself against opponents and absorbing the reads and positioning of the smaller ice surface.

 

[26Mats]

Is Slafkovsky’s going to play?

Replace Rem with Hoffman and you have the perfect trio of healthy scratches.

Caufield - Suzuki - Slaf
Monahan - Dach - Evans
Anderson - Dvorak - Gallagher
Pez - Pitlick - Armia
Hoffman, Drouin, Dadonov

 

[Kennerback]

Slaf and Armia in?

Pezzeta in?

 

[FF de Mars]

What leadership? He can’t even lead himself to finish a shift.


If Slaf is good enough to play scoring line minutes in the NHL, then he is good enough to play scoring line minutes in any European league. It is BALONEY to say that a European team would intentionally underplay him because of his age — he wasn’t given good minutes in Liiga because he didn’t or couldn’t earn it (according to Liiga/TPS fans).

Competitive teams try to win their competitions. The NHL’s incumbent 1OA should be, theoretically, good enough to play top6 minutes for many (or any) European team.

Of course, allegedly 2022 was an exceptionally bad year for the draft… so it only goes to reinforce how Slaf had no business being rushed into the NHL.

In any case, if he still can’t earn and sustain scoring minutes today, on the dead last ranked team that is desperate for his success and has a lot of garbagio dead weight, then that’s his problem to overcome. No amount of skills coaching and coaxing can change the fact that in an immediate sense a team’s coach will lean on the players he feels are likeliest to help his team win. If Hoffman, Drouin, and Gallagher are above Slaf on the depth chart then there is too much of a gap for him at this time.

From the onset I said he should go back to Liiga and actually put up league points for the first time in his adult career. My second preference was big minutes in Europe or AHL. Third was CHL because of the concern of him learning bad habits against weak defences. The worst option was to rush him into the NHL when he’s not yet NHL quality for even the dead last ranked team.

I otherwise agree with your position on development but I disagree with your position on Slaf. I want his success but I think too many here have been convinced nothing can go wrong with this project… couldn’t be further from the truth.

You are in big baloney on this one, Expat. How do you know TPS fans' opinion, have you read their message board? I did, thanks to a poster here, I read a google translation of what they said and it isn't nearly close to what you are saying here. They said opposite! Mainly because they were concerned no blue chip prospects would ever sign with them but they still said the opposite of what you just said! Since you're an expat I wish you well because I really like the work of expats like Nietzsche and Cioran and I also have been an expat in the past so I know where you're coming from. Just can't wait to watch Slafkovsky tonight! He really makes the games more interesting with his flashes of greatness.

 

[morhilane]

Pezzeta in?

I totally forgot him *sorry Pezz*, but yes if those 3 forwards are sitting that means Slaf, Armia and Pezz are in.

And with Armia being taken out of IR, Habs are at 23 players on 23 so no place for Eddy on this trip unless someone is traded (waived/sent down to Laval would be weird during a trip, also Laval has too many players of its own right now).

 

[Kennerback]

What leadership? He can’t even lead himself to finish a shift.


If Slaf is good enough to play scoring line minutes in the NHL, then he is good enough to play scoring line minutes in any European league. It is BALONEY to say that a European team would intentionally underplay him because of his age — he wasn’t given good minutes in Liiga because he didn’t or couldn’t earn it (according to Liiga/TPS fans).

Competitive teams try to win their competitions. The NHL’s incumbent 1OA should be, theoretically, good enough to play top6 minutes for many (or any) European team.

Of course, allegedly 2022 was an exceptionally bad year for the draft… so it only goes to reinforce how Slaf had no business being rushed into the NHL.

In any case, if he still can’t earn and sustain scoring minutes today, on the dead last ranked team that is desperate for his success and has a lot of garbagio dead weight, then that’s his problem to overcome. No amount of skills coaching and coaxing can change the fact that in an immediate sense a team’s coach will lean on the players he feels are likeliest to help his team win. If Hoffman, Drouin, and Gallagher are above Slaf on the depth chart then there is too much of a gap for him at this time.

From the onset I said he should go back to Liiga and actually put up league points for the first time in his adult career. My second preference was big minutes in Europe or AHL. Third was CHL because of the concern of him learning bad habits against weak defences. The worst option was to rush him into the NHL when he’s not yet NHL quality for even the dead last ranked team.

I otherwise agree with your position on development but I disagree with your position on Slaf. I want his success but I think too many here have been convinced nothing can go wrong with this project… couldn’t be further from the truth.

He would absolutely put points up in Liiga. Because he wouldn’t sign with a team that puts him in a bottom-6 grinder role, like has happened with dozens of NHL superstar in Euro men’s league in their draft year. I would add that the fact he was in Liiga less than 6 months removed from his seventeenth birthday as a foreigner is unheard of.

Many stars in the NHL on their Draft year including drafted top-5 never even had a whiff Of a men’s pro leagues. They were either in U-20 juniors or second League (their AHL) When drafted. Off the top of my head 1OAs Sundin and Kovalchuk.

 

[ReHabs]

Dear @ExpatHabs,

Continuing your rants written in a variety of ways does not convey your opinion any better than yesterday. Again, when you say "put up points for the first time in his adult career," you again base this argument off of stats seen on a web page, or base it off those who share a similar view point that you would like to follow. Until you take the time to go back and watch his usage, his role, and his play in Liiga, your opinions are invalid.

Once again, you continue to say that he is being rushed to the NHL. He is dipping his toes in the wadding pool at the moment, and is in no way being thrown into the deep end. He is being given limited minutes in a bottom 6 role to learn and adapt to the NHL game.. this is not "being rushed."

To your other point, 1oa picks are not all the same. European teams often rely on their veteran players to help win league championships, this is no secret. Slafkovsky could absolutely play a top 6 role for many clubs, I am confident of that, but he's not in Europe, nor will he be going back to Europe (which again, I don't understand your logic, because you would simply look at the box score after each game and judge his performance in Liiga as you've done before). Thus your argument is once again, going nowhere.

I'm happy to hear that you would like him to succeed, but you are far too critical of his past (which to you was all secondary accounts), and him being in the NHL currently seems to bother you immensely. What I suggest is taking a step back, go watch his Liiga games (which I know you will not do, but until then your arguments are falling on deaf ears), reassess, and then come back here with a clear head and fresh eyes.

Hope to hear from you soon,

Signed,

A concerned fan

Insisting that anybody has to watch his Liiga games is the surest sign of boneheaded hockey talk. I've watched his actual NHL games -- he is not NHL ready as of today. This is admitted as fact by even big Slafkovskt believers.

You can claim he is "dipping his toes" but our difference is in description, not definition or fact: The Habs are playing this just-drafted 18 year old on their NHL roster.

Add the two together: A not-NHL ready player is being rushed onto an NHL-roster.

You don't otherwise disagree with me, so you don't need to put up such obnoxious flourishes.

He would absolutely put points up in Liiga. Because he wouldn’t sign with a team that puts him in a bottom-6 grinder role, like has happened with dozens of NHL superstar in Euro men’s league in their draft year. I would add that the fact he was in Liiga less than 6 months removed from his seventeenth birthday as a foreigner is unheard of.

Many stars in the NHL on their Draft year including drafted top-5 never even had a whiff Of a men’s pro leagues. They were either in U-20 juniors or second League (their AHL) When drafted. Off the top of my head 1OAs Sundin and Kovalchuk.

1) You think he would, I think he'd struggle. Putting up points in Europe won't suddenly come easier to him when (in my opinion) his hockey IQ is below where it should be. Against top-tier defences he'd look worse but against normal Europe he'd still have to deal with point-less nights and frustrations... he isn't that much better than any other player when he's on the ice.

2) Interesting analysis. Should look into it more and present a case

You are in big baloney on this one, Expat. How do you know TPS fans' opinion, have you read their message board? I did, thanks to a poster here, I read a google translation of what they said and it isn't nearly close to what you are saying here. They said opposite! Mainly because they were concerned no blue chip prospects would ever sign with them but they still said the opposite of what you just said! Since you're an expat I wish you well because I really like the work of expats like Nietzsche and Cioran and I also have been an expat in the past so I know where you're coming from. Just can't wait to watch Slafkovsky tonight! He really makes the games more interesting with his flashes of greatness.

I'm an Expat Montrealer, living/working/raising kids abroad.

People who've seen TPS also said he was very raw. I don't need to count about his time with TPS at all any more, I can point to his NHL games and see the same things.