OT: 2021 Football Thread: Mock Draft SZN

[NYSPORTS]

Which is why I don't think Wilson should play straight away. If you grab someone like Mullens (as suggested by Jimmy) you start him.

imo, the #2 overall pick has to be the starter from Day 1.

 

[Maximus]

I don't think Darnold has that much value. Some teams see a guy with great arm talent and smarts that was never given a real chance, others see a guy who just doesn't have what it takes to read NFL defenses at the speed needed to be successful, who makes poor decisions and is due a lot of money after this upcoming season. If your team falls into the latter category, there's no amount of "sweetening" you can do, a deal that involves Darnold isn't going to get you into the top ten. If you don't think highly of the guy, you don't think highly of him. And you won't want to give up much, or potentially anything, to acquire him.

As far as your previous point about holding out on Carolina, making them cave--I've now seen multiple reports that Carolina was the only team seriously making a push for Darnold at this point. They were essentially bidding against themselves it sounds like. That only works for so long--I think they did "cave" in offering up a package of picks that no other team was willing to match. If you're holding out for some colossal cave where they literally sell the farm for Sam f***ing Darnold, I just don't think that was ever going to happen.

This is a similar situation to when we moved Bridgewater, and there were a lot of complaints that we moved him too soon, that had we held on to him, more of a market could have developed. That was possible, but it was also possible that the market evaporated for him. A good GM can read the market and determine when the time is right to move the guy. I'm not the biggest fan of Douglas, but I think he timed it right.

Unlike you I am probably one of the biggest fans of Douglas in here and IMO he did a masterful job with the Darnold situation as he got just about as much as any of us could have possibly hoped.

Considering Joe had absolutely no leverage whatsoever once he telegraphed he was taking Wilson after the big Philly/Miami/San Fran trade was made, the mini haul he got for Darnold is actually stupendous.

So no complaints whatsoever from this part of Jet Nation as Douglas continues to show for first time since Parcells, Jets have a GM who is competent, respected around the league, has a plan and knows what the F he is doing.

 

[Maximus]

general concur.
Some clarification:
Bold: the big $ next season is an option. Sam's team does not have to go there unless it opts to. I suspect they can even decline, and then renegotiate. So the risk aspect of that imo is not extended. However the cost is the cost, and that is a separate issue and you raise a good pt in that regard. Either you see a guy who is gonna eff up at the pro level regardless of talent; or you see a guy with talent who could benefit all the dif from a change of scenery.
I would argue objectively that that small run of competitive games end of last season was just enough to prove that, yes, can't put the team all on his shoulders by himself [few can], but has sufficient tools to win with enough to work with.

Underline: not expecting a ridiculous level cave, but I am saying there is a measure of CAR paying for SD level talent now as opposed to later.
SD is to some extent plug n play.
Who else is available that can step in for CAR as an alternate? Clearly they did not want to develop the best available talent from scratch, while they wanted a guy young enough to build with.
Jimmy G -- too much $, health risk, age. so no.
who else?

Darnold was a good fit.
I admit I could be wrong.
But I think if we made them sweat, and we played ATL as an alternate [albeit an expensive one], they would have caved.

good sharing this chat w/ya

Bern...love your passion but read my reply to Ny2k....Carolina gave us a very very fair return for a QB who has shown neither that he was worth being a 3rd overall pick or that he wasn't worth it whether it's his fault or the Jets fault for not supporting him better. That's neither here nor there tho as Douglas had no leverage at all. He did very well getting what he got while the getting was still good.

Can't be to greedy when you are the one who doesn't have the leverage...Douglas did a great job here and no way we could have gotten more than what we got if we would have waited longer. Be happy...don't worry!....lol

 

[Maximus]

This was a pretty good deal for everyone. Don't mind them getting a 2 and 4 next year. Hopefully by September, we're under some more normal conditions for colleges and students aren't dealing with COVID protocols while trying to stand out on the field.

Now next season they have multiple picks in each of the first 4 rounds. If there is any specific player they want in the next draft (or even this draft), they'll have the ammunition to make a move and get their player.

Now it is 100% obvious that Zach Wilson will be their QB, but they will need a backup. I don't think it would be smart to have James Morgan as the only other QB on the roster. I'd like Alex Smith or Nick Mullens. Smith would obviously be a veteran mentor for Wilson and who wouldn't listen to him at this point, with what he did to get back on the field and into the game. Mullens would know the offense and could help in that regard. Also wouldn't be a bad option to have on the field either if needed.

Top 3 picks should be Wilson with either a guard or corner at 23 and 34. Maybe a pass rusher in one of those spots. Definitely want some WR help, possibly with their own 3rd round pick.

I'm good with an Alex Smith coming in as mentor/back up. I sincerely doubt Morgan is anything more than a Kellen Clemens type backup anyways so why not bring in an experienced guy like Smith or I guess Mullens would be fine I guess.

I've said it before a hundred times and I'll say it again...at 23, the Jets are going to take Etienne if he's there. I feel it in my gut that Douglas wants a dynamic playmaker to join the offense and Etienne would be a fantastic fit. I know I'm on an island here as everyone in here wants an Olineman there or a CB. I'm the opposite. Jets have a ton of draft picks in this draft. Oline is apparently very deep.

Douglass can adress O-line at #34. Jets need an Etienne type player to help make this new offense more diversified and dangerous and take the pressure off of Wilson as defenses would need to game plan for an Etienne.

Anyways, that's fine that most peeps in here think it's just folly for the Jets to go RB and Etienne at 23 but when he comes on board and gets us 1200+ combined yards and 6+ TD's his rookie year, there won't be to many peeps in here who'll be complaining about Douglas taking Etienne at 23...just sayin!....lol

 

[Maximus]

Jets are in no position to really play the need card.

23ov, 34, and the 2 3s should go BPA.

For example, if the Notre Dame LB is there, he's in play because of the hybrid game he will play in a Saleh system.

And Etienne as well at 23 as I've said infinitum. I agree with you...Jets need playmakers regardless of position. Etienne would be such a dynamic player in this offense. I really believe Douglas will take him if he's there...just wait and see. Only 3 weeks from now baby...can't wait!

 

[Maximus]

imo, the #2 overall pick has to be the starter from Day 1.

No question about it. Jets can't afford to go the Aaron Rodgers, Mahomes route and let their stud rookie QB sit for a year or so....they aren't good enough team to do so.

It would be an absolute luxury if we could do that. We can't tho. Wilson will be the man right away and we should all embrace it as that's the way it's going to be.

 

[nyr2k2]

I'm good with an Alex Smith coming in as mentor/back up. I sincerely doubt Morgan is anything more than a Kellen Clemens type backup anyways so why not bring in an experienced guy like Smith or I guess Mullens would be fine I guess.

I've said it before a hundred times and I'll say it again...at 23, the Jets are going to take Etienne if he's there. I feel it in my gut that Douglas wants a dynamic playmaker to join the offense and Etienne would be a fantastic fit. I know I'm on an island here as everyone in here wants an Olineman there or a CB. I'm the opposite. Jets have a ton of draft picks in this draft. Oline is apparently very deep.

Douglass can adress O-line at #34. Jets need an Etienne type player to help make this new offense more diversified and dangerous and take the pressure off of Wilson as defenses would need to game plan for an Etienne.

Anyways, that's fine that most peeps in here think it's just folly for the Jets to go RB and Etienne at 23 but when he comes on board and gets us 1200+ combined yards and 6+ TD's his rookie year, there won't be to many peeps in here who'll be complaining about Douglas taking Etienne at 23...just sayin!....lol

I don't dislike Douglas, I'm just not 100% sold on him yet. Like last year, everyone knew we desperately needed an O-Line overhaul, and he brought in McGovern, Fant, and Van Roten. Those were largely whiffs. Minimal commitments but whiffs. We passed on keeping Anderson and signed Perriman, which ended up being a big miscalculation, IMO. The fact that the secondary continues to be an absolute horror show. The LBs. Etc. I know his approach in free agency is to not go above his price and to build through the draft, but that has drawbacks, which include--as he himself acknowledged--the fact that they gave Darnold nothing to work with and stalled his development.

He did well at the top of the draft with Becton and Mims, and potentially with Davis, but lots of questions beyond that. I'd curious to see what he does this year--he really needs to fortify the OL and DBs. If he doesn't do that in a big way, I will have a big problem with him.

He's done some good things, no doubt, and I do trust him. But, I haven't seen enough to say, "This guy is the guy to get us back to where we need to be." He has a plan but I need to see him execute on it successfully.

 

[SRHRangers]

And Etienne as well at 23 as I've said infinitum. I agree with you...Jets need playmakers regardless of position. Etienne would be such a dynamic player in this offense. I really believe Douglas will take him if he's there...just wait and see. Only 3 weeks from now baby...can't wait!

The #1 guy I want at 23 is CB Jaycee Horn.

Perfect CB in Saleh's system.

 

[Maximus]

The #1 guy I want at 23 is CB Jaycee Horn.

Perfect CB in Saleh's system.

Don't know much about Horn honestly and so I'd have to do a little research. Etienne I know about. But if Horn is as good as you say he is...I'm not going to be all to upset if the Jets went that route as CB is a no doubt it about it bigtime need!

 

[Maximus]

I don't dislike Douglas, I'm just not 100% sold on him yet. Like last year, everyone knew we desperately needed an O-Line overhaul, and he brought in McGovern, Fant, and Van Roten. Those were largely whiffs. Minimal commitments but whiffs. We passed on keeping Anderson and signed Perriman, which ended up being a big miscalculation, IMO. The fact that the secondary continues to be an absolute horror show. The LBs. Etc. I know his approach in free agency is to not go above his price and to build through the draft, but that has drawbacks, which include--as he himself acknowledged--the fact that they gave Darnold nothing to work with and stalled his development.

He did well at the top of the draft with Becton and Mims, and potentially with Davis, but lots of questions beyond that. I'd curious to see what he does this year--he really needs to fortify the OL and DBs. If he doesn't do that in a big way, I will have a big problem with him.

He's done some good things, no doubt, and I do trust him. But, I haven't seen enough to say, "This guy is the guy to get us back to where we need to be." He has a plan but I need to see him execute on it successfully.

You make some valid points as Douglas absolutely needs to nail this year and next year's draft in order to truly change the direction of this franchise and keep his job if we want to be honest.

I just like the way he goes about things but yes he still has plenty to prove. But he just gives off an air of confidence and competency that I haven't felt as a longtime fan, from a Jet GM since like I mentioned previously....the Big Tuna!

PS: I would add Perine in the 4th, Hall in the 5th and Mann in the 6th as picks I feel reasonably confident that will turn out to be solid picks as well and will be Jets for a long time besides the three you mentioned...Becton,Mims and Davis...just sayin!

 

[bernmeister]

Bern...love your passion but read my reply to Ny2k....Carolina gave us a very very fair return for a QB who has shown neither that he was worth being a 3rd overall pick or that he wasn't worth it whether it's his fault or the Jets fault for not supporting him better. That's neither here nor there tho as Douglas had no leverage at all. He did very well getting what he got while the getting was still good.

Can't be to greedy when you are the one who doesn't have the leverage...Douglas did a great job here and no way we could have gotten more than what we got if we would have waited longer. Be happy...don't worry!....lol

I appreciate the shout out with love, and this old hippie sends the same back to you.

I largely agree.
The only real dif is I believe w/dwindling options for CAR, etc, we were not fully out of the driver's seat.
Yes, it would cost us to hold out and not take this deal now [tho that is not much this year (a 6th), and the 2 and 4 are next season].
But it would HURT Panthers unless they either got someone else [not likely due to minimum alternative options, who else is available?] or, they gotta draft a guy AND WAIT.

There's talk they were desperate to grab Darnold for the 1 yr on the cheap and are looking at a QB still with their 1st. I don't think that is as much insurance on Darnold failing as it is a big $ increase after this yr, so grab a guy who competes/gives depth. Fine. But the guy they are grabbing closer to 10 is not gonna be much better than what they would have gotten at 22OA w/SEA's 1st.

Any hoo, it is water under the bridge now.

We can only hope that MAYBE Atlanta thinks 22OA + NYJ 2022 1st and an impact player like Mims is enough for 4OA.

 

[nyr2k2]

You make some valid points as Douglas absolutely needs to nail this year and next year's draft in order to truly change the direction of this franchise and keep his job if we want to be honest.

I just like the way he goes about things but yes he still has plenty to prove. But he just gives off an air of confidence and competency that I haven't felt as a longtime fan, from a Jet GM since like I mentioned previously....the Big Tuna!

PS: I would add Perine in the 4th, Hall in the 5th and Mann in the 6th as picks I feel reasonably confident that will turn out to be solid picks as well and will be Jets for a long time besides the three you mentioned...Becton,Mims and Davis...just sayin!

Bryce Hall I really like. Perine, I'm not sure he's anything more than a rotational runner. Like he doesn't seem very explosive, he doesn't break tackles. He's fine, I'm sure he'll be a decent contributor during his rookie deal but then he's probably gone for someone cheaper or better. I think he's an okay pick. I was all about Mann last year until I read something on a blog about his final year in college and some troubling regressions. Then last year, despite punting more than any other player, was one of only 8 guys to not kick the ball 60 yards. Only one other guy landed less than a quarter of his punts inside the 20. He was near the bottom in all the averages. Of course the Jets comically inept offense put him often in bad spots, but still, he didn't exactly kick the leather off the ball last year. I'm hopeful for him but not super optimistic. We'll see I guess.

 

[Maximus]

Bryce Hall I really like. Perine, I'm not sure he's anything more than a rotational runner. Like he doesn't seem very explosive, he doesn't break tackles. He's fine, I'm sure he'll be a decent contributor during his rookie deal but then he's probably gone for someone cheaper or better. I think he's an okay pick. I was all about Mann last year until I read something on a blog about his final year in college and some troubling regressions. Then last year, despite punting more than any other player, was one of only 8 guys to not kick the ball 60 yards. Only one other guy landed less than a quarter of his punts inside the 20. He was near the bottom in all the averages. Of course the Jets comically inept offense put him often in bad spots, but still, he didn't exactly kick the leather off the ball last year. I'm hopeful for him but not super optimistic. We'll see I guess.

Perine even in his limited reps reminds me of Shonn Green who was a pretty good north south type runner. I think if you combine Perine with say an Etienne, I think we'd all be happy. Hall looks definity like a keeper and like you say Mann was disappointing but his pedigree and college exploits warrants at least one two more years to see if last year was a fluke.

I guess what I'm saying is Douglas had a pretty good 1st draft certainly tho it's not saying much, but he definitely had a better draft since probably Tannenbaum in the mid to late 2000's. I also like the way Douglas knows how to work with other GM's and trade down to garner more draft capital.

What he did to get Mims despite trading down twice and getting an additional 4th round pick was pretty masterful. I dunno...I trust the guy and I think he's going to nail the draft for us...we'll see soon enough!

 

[sbjnyc]

I appreciate the shout out with love, and this old hippie sends the same back to you.

I largely agree.
The only real dif is I believe w/dwindling options for CAR, etc, we were not fully out of the driver's seat.
Yes, it would cost us to hold out and not take this deal now [tho that is not much this year (a 6th), and the 2 and 4 are next season].
But it would HURT Panthers unless they either got someone else [not likely due to minimum alternative options, who else is available?] or, they gotta draft a guy AND WAIT.

There's talk they were desperate to grab Darnold for the 1 yr on the cheap and are looking at a QB still with their 1st. I don't think that is as much insurance on Darnold failing as it is a big $ increase after this yr, so grab a guy who competes/gives depth. Fine. But the guy they are grabbing closer to 10 is not gonna be much better than what they would have gotten at 22OA w/SEA's 1st.

Any hoo, it is water under the bridge now.

We can only hope that MAYBE Atlanta thinks 22OA + NYJ 2022 1st and an impact player like Mims is enough for 4OA.

Carolina's options were to:

• Stick with Teddy and keep their draft picks
• Sign a veteran (Alex Smith) and keep their draft picks
• Draft a QB at 8 (probably one of Lance, Fields, Jones)
• Trade some future picks for a young QB (Darnold).

Darnold has had 3 years to show he is going to be a good NFL QB yet has been significantly outplayed by the likes of Gardner Minshew on a similarly lousy team. Not only that, Darnold has a poison pill with his looming $19 million 5th year option. The Jets also have $5 million in dead money for their trouble. So getting a future 2 is the best we could have hoped for. Carolina probably thinks it is better than using 8OA to take a crapshot on this years QB lottery. Still they could have had a veteran and kept their draft picks. The jets really had no leverage here.

You're dreaming about a trade for 4OA. The 49ers traded up from 12 to 3 for an additional 2 firsts. What would it cost to go from 23 to 4? 3 extra firsts? The jets are not in a position to be trading up. They need as many picks as possible.

 

[darko]

We can only hope that MAYBE Atlanta thinks 22OA + NYJ 2022 1st and an impact player like Mims is enough for 4OA.

Good luck with that.

 

[NYSPORTS]

with the 2nd pick in the 2021 NFL draft the NY Jets select . . .


Justin Fields

 

[Maximus]

with the 2nd pick in the 2021 NFL draft the NY Jets select . . .


Justin Fields

Not a chance that happens....you be funny. It's 99.99999% Zach Wilson my friend.

 

[sbjnyc]

with the 2nd pick in the 2021 NFL draft the NY Jets select . . .


Justin Fields

Zach Wilson is a -2000 favorite to be taken at 2. Mac Jones is -200 to be taken by the 9ers.

 

[SRHRangers]

Don't know much about Horn honestly and so I'd have to do a little research. Etienne I know about. But if Horn is as good as you say he is...I'm not going to be all to upset if the Jets went that route as CB is a no doubt it about it bigtime need!

Horn is big physical CB that fits into the Saleh system perfectly as a bump/man or zone CB.

Also love the fact that he's Joe Horns son. If he's anything like Dad, he was infinite amount of confidence and swag that won't let a bad play bother him.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Not a chance that happens....you be funny. It's 99.99999% Zach Wilson my friend.

Wouldn’t shock me to hear the name Pat Freiermuth with Gettleman’s 1st pick.

 

[RGY]

Wouldn’t shock me to hear the name Pat Freiermuth with Gettleman’s 1st pick.

Would turn off the draft and finish the whole bottle right there on the spot.


In all seriousness, I am not sure who you are hoping for at this point, but I am still all for one of the 3 WRs if they are still on the board at 11. Go Edge/OL in rounds 2 and 3

 

[NYSPORTS]

Would turn off the draft and finish the whole bottle right there on the spot.


In all seriousness, I am not sure who you are hoping for at this point, but I am still all for one of the 3 WRs if they are still on the board at 11. Go Edge/OL in rounds 2 and 3

OL or WR i’m fine with. Not sure if there is an edge worth it. Best could be if a QB drops and trading back. Saw a proposed trade with Chicago online including a swap of picks and getting the Bears 2022 #1. Now that i would like.

 

[LionsHeart]

I want one of the Receivers or Best OL.

If they like one of the Edge Rushers I’d hope they’d trade back or wait and see who falls. I know Rousseau is a question mark, but if he falls into the 2nd Round I’d be okay with that. There’s a part of me that wouldn’t be surprised by Paye.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Slater
Ojulari
Smith/Waddle
Vera-Tucker

is who I expect the NYG to take

 

[RangerBlues]

Gardner Minshew LOL