Speculation: 2021-21 LA Kings News/Rumors/Roster discussion

[SFKingshomer]

Seems to me that you can aspire to the black hole or with some extra expenditure in assets aspire for the playoffs. At least if you make the playoffs at least 50% of the fans will be happy. No one will be happy with a black hole finish...tanksters least of all.

If it's the kids leading us there then I don't have a problem with it. We need to see some improvement from the kids or this rebuild is going nowhere.

 

[tomd]

If it's the kids leading us there then I don't have a problem with it. We need to see some improvement from the kids or this rebuild is going nowhere.

The kids ain't leading the team anywhere in 21-22 and Blake knows he has to proceed this summer under that assumption.

 

[SFKingshomer]

The kids ain't leading the team anywhere in 21-22 and Blake knows he has to proceed this summer under that assumption.

They can get progression from Kupari, Vilardi, Anderson, Bjornfot, Turcotte, and Byfield and it be considered a successful season. It's about the long game...

 

[tomd]

They can get progression from Kupari, Vilardi, Anderson, Bjornfot, Turcotte, and Byfield and it be considered a successful season. It's about the long game...

Even you have to admit that of the players you mentioned only Anderson and Bjornfot should be "guaranteed" positions on the team in 21-22 based on performance. Vilardi will be on the team but likely (hopefully) in a diminished role. The others (Kupari, Turcotte, and Byfield) will have to come to camp and EARN a position. Nothing should be gifted to them and no openings should be left for them assuming they're ready for full-time NHL duty. Kupari and Turcotte are very likely to start the year again in Ontario. Byfield will stick around for 9 games because of his age and they'll see how things go from there. THAT'S how the long game is played.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Even you have to admit that of the players you mentioned only Anderson and Bjornfot should be "guaranteed" positions on the team in 21-22 based on performance. Vilardi will be on the team but likely (hopefully) in a diminished role. The others (Kupari, Turcotte, and Byfield) will have to come to camp and EARN a position. Nothing should be gifted to them and no openings should be left for them assuming they're ready for full-time NHL duty. Kupari and Turcotte are very likely to start the year again in Ontario. Byfield will stick around for 9 games because of his age and they'll see how things go from there. THAT'S how the long game is played.

Ok then they are at the Handzus, Nagy, Preissing stage. They certainly aren't ready to trade multiple top assets for Eichel or any other fantasy deal.

 

[tomd]

Ok then they are at the Handzus, Nagy, Preissing stage. They certainly aren't ready to trade multiple top assets for Eichel or any other fantasy deal.

Now we're back to the black hole argument. I'm sorry to tell you this but if the team is legitimately aiming for the playoffs in 21-22 then multiple top assets may need to be traded. And the Kings may be better off for that in both the short and the long term if done correctly.

 

[Rusty Batch]

So sick of the "black hole" talking point. Just gets introduced into every discussion about adding anything to this team as if we will immediately enter permanent mediocrity if we even think about dipping into a massive and ever growing prospect pool that might already contain 20ish players with NHL potential.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Now we're back to the black hole argument. I'm sorry to tell you this but if the team is legitimately aiming for the playoffs in 21-22 then multiple top assets may need to be traded. And the Kings may be better off for that in both the short and the long term if done correctly.

They aren't aiming for the playoffs in 21-22. Progression from their prospects at all levels is the only thing that matters at this point. Eichel isn't going to turn this around and who do you move? You don't even know what you have at this time. Trade Byfield, Turcotte, and multiple 1sts for Eichel to do what? He's got about 4-5 years left of his prime production and will need a new contract, even larger than the 1 he has now. That is a terrible idea and 1 they aren't ready for at this stage in the rebuild. All they're doing with Eichel is making some fans and Doughty happy for a few seasons. It's not going to put them into contention.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Here come good news from Mayor’s Manor

Kings Summer Shopping List Doesn’t Include Jack Eichel (mayorsmanor.com)

Why do people still listen to this guy?

 

[tomd]

They aren't aiming for the playoffs in 21-22. Progression from their prospects at all levels is the only thing that matters at this point. Eichel isn't going to turn this around and who do you move? You don't even know what you have at this time. Trade Byfield, Turcotte, and multiple 1sts for Eichel to do what? He's got about 4-5 years left of his prime production and will need a new contract, even larger than the 1 he has now. That is a terrible idea and 1 they aren't ready for at this stage in the rebuild.

Do you have a citation for the "they aren't aiming for the playoffs in 21-22"? Doughty's comments were directly focused on making the playoffs in 21-22 and both Blake and Luc have said the organization agrees with him. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

You keep coming back to Eichel as if he is the only trade available. He's not! But if the Kings really want to acquire two top 6 forwards and a top 4 LHD this summer it is going to come at the cost of picks and prospects. Those are the only valuable pieces that are left in the Kings asset bag. Surely you can agree with that.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Do you have a citation for the "they aren't aiming for the playoffs in 21-22"? Doughty's comments were directly focused on making the playoffs in 21-22 and both Blake and Luc have said the organization agrees with him. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

You keep coming back to Eichel as if he is the only trade available. He's not! But if the Kings really want to acquire two top 6 forwards and a top 4 LHD this summer it is going to come at the cost of picks and prospects. Those are the only valuable pieces that are left in the Kings asset bag. Surely you can agree with that.

That's smoke being blown up your ass and there's nothing to it. Sure they will try to improve but they aren't trading any of the top prospects yet. I don't expect anything major this summer. Maybe sign a couple top 6-9 guys like re-sign AA and overpay for a vet UFA or 2. Exactly what Mayor is saying because they simply aren't at a point where they can afford to trade their top assets this early into their development.

 

[Rusty Batch]

What the Kings should be doing now is avoiding long term contracts (greater than three years) unless that player is young and we are as confident that they will be a long term impact player for us.

We should have already identified prospects in our system that are expendable based on our superior knowledge of our prospect pool and look to include them in trades that take advantage of our cap space and other teams lack of cap space to acquire young long term impact players for our organization that you would not normally be available. Winning trades and using our strengths to take advantage of other teams weaknesses to acquire long term pieces should absolutely be a part of our rebuild.

There is going to be some risk and luck involved with building a cup contender. There is no surefire way to do it. We can continue to tank and get shit luck in the lottery or get bad injuries that derail a promising career. We can make the wrong draft picks (which almost always happens anyways, it's extremely rare that you pick the best player available in a draft, you draft these guys at 18 yrs old from a variety of different leagues in a variety of different circumstances after all).

If the Kings are going to be a cup contender alot has to go right and tbh alot already had to go right. And Kings are going to probably have to find difference makers outside of the first round anyway.

 

[tomd]

That's smoke being blown up your ass and there's nothing to it. Sure they will try to improve but they aren't trading any of the top prospects yet. I don't expect anything major this summer. Maybe sign a couple top 6-9 guys like re-sign AA and overpay for a vet UFA or 2. Exactly what Mayor is saying because they simply aren't at a point where they can afford to trade their top assets this early into their development.

LOL...ok. You're calling Blake and Luc liars today. If you're right I'll be calling them liars in 3 months. My guess is that it will be some of both but that you are likely to be more unhappy with this summer than I will be. Changes are coming...some that you probably won't like and one or two that you might actually hate. I'll leave it at that.

 

[SFKingshomer]

LOL...ok. You're calling Blake and Luc liars today. If you're right I'll be calling them liars in 3 months. My guess is that it will be some of both but that you are likely to be more unhappy with this summer than I will be. Changes are coming...some that you probably won't like and one or two that you might actually hate. I'll leave it at that.

They are selling a product. Do you want them to say we are several years away from where we want to be? You take peoples word at face value. That's like trusting a politician to live up to their promises.

 

[Lt Dan]

tomd are you forgetting how the team was built last time?
Blake is going to use the same blueprint.
Boxes have been and are being filled and the reserve list has reservations at The Palm.
The next step is teaching them how to win and face some adversity. These peeps coming in are indeed going to be of the Smyth and Williams variety.
The Kings aren't ready for Richards and Carter and absolutely can't give up those kind of assets.....yet

 

[Schrute farms]

 

[Rusty Batch]

tomd are you forgetting how the team was built last time?
Blake is going to use the same blueprint.
Boxes have been and are being filled and the reserve list has reservations at The Palm.
The next step is teaching them how to win and face some adversity. These peeps coming in are indeed going to be of the Smyth and Williams variety.
The Kings aren't ready for Richards and Carter and absolutely can't give up those kind of assets.....yet [/QUOTE]

We aren't in position to give up the equivalent of Jack Johnson and a first for Jeff Carter?

 

[HookKing]

Folks, just being in the Pacific means you're in the playoff hunt. Blake didn't exactly go out on a limb. The only "guaranteed" playoff team is Vegas. Edmonton, perhaps -- of course they're just 1 injury away from the lottery. Seattle will be a wildcard but I doubt lightning strikes twice...

 

[Fishhead]

So sick of the "black hole" talking point. Just gets introduced into every discussion about adding anything to this team as if we will immediately enter permanent mediocrity if we even think about dipping into a massive and ever growing prospect pool that might already contain 20ish players with NHL potential.

Absolutely. Especially considering that most of the main players who led us to cups were from the black hole draft range. We can't forget about the learn how to win stage in player development, they don't just go from top prospect to contender. That's usually the shittiest stage, because they don't quite have it yet and you wonder if they ever are going to be good enough, but it's absolutely essential.

 

[Lt Dan]

We aren't in position to give up the equivalent of Jack Johnson and a first for Jeff Carter?

It would be counterproductive and keep us in the black hole longer. We could give up Jack Johnson, because we have a better player ready to step in with Voynov. We aren't at that position with D or especially F

I would compare your idea to the Palffy trade. We got a legit guy, but the team wasn't complete and we didn't have a continuous influx of prospects and we won one playoff round . One playoff round.

What would you rather have?

This

or this?

 

[tomd]

They are selling a product. Do you want them to say we are several years away from where we want to be? You take peoples word at face value. That's like trusting a politician to live up to their promises.

Until now, when fans called their GM a liar it was because they hated him. Now we have fans calling Blake a liar because they like him. Interesting...

 

[tomd]

Folks, just being in the Pacific means you're in the playoff hunt. Blake didn't exactly go out on a limb. The only "guaranteed" playoff team is Vegas. Edmonton, perhaps -- of course they're just 1 injury away from the lottery. Seattle will be a wildcard but I doubt lightning strikes twice...

Works both ways...what do you say to your fans if you CAN'T make the playoffs in this division? Especially when you said you were trying to do so? (And yes, I now know Blake was lying when he said that but I'm not sure all the little people have gotten word yet that he is a liar so they might be somewhat chagrined by Blake's failure.)

 

[SFKingshomer]

We aren't in position to give up the equivalent of Jack Johnson and a first for Jeff Carter?

Johnson was still considered a top 4 defenseman with potential at that point. Would you trade Bjornfot and a 1st for a top 6 forward? That just opens up a hole on the blueline, Voynov filled the hole opened up with the departure of JJ.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Until now, when fans called their GM a liar it was because they hated him. Now we have fans calling Blake a liar because they like him. Interesting...

I don't like or dislike Blake. I'd prefer to bring Lombardi back if we are being completely honest. This team needs a kick in the nuts and a culture change from top to bottom.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

They don't need difference makers. They need quality NHL depth. None of which requires altering any plans with Byfield or Turcotte. A new cast. Not one intimately familiar with the beach yet.

You don't jump from terrible to contender. DL had a black hole team for a couple years, and was still well on his way to having that in 11-12 before he got desperate and things managed to work out. That's all it did. Sutter was not part of any plan. Carter was not part of any plan.

Being a real contender is not a goal you can set. It emerges over time. If the Kings get swept in the 1st rd next year, but don't touch any important prospect while doing so, that's a win.

This is all they were going to do until they were 30th in late Jan 2019. That was the worst showing from that general group in a decade. Even the 16-17 team was better, and they were trash.

The entire roster is depth playing the role of skill players.