Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
It's TM, he'll start him on the 2nd line and promptly move him to the 4th in favor of Matt Luff after missing an assignment and then we'll never hear from him again.
WhY CaN'T yOu GuYs ScOrE iN mY sYsTem
Speculation: 2021-21 LA Kings News/Rumors/Roster discussion
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It's TM, he'll start him on the 2nd line and promptly move him to the 4th in favor of Matt Luff after missing an assignment and then we'll never hear from him again.
WhY CaN'T yOu GuYs ScOrE iN mY sYsTem
Eichel's injury and his want to attempt a surgery never done to a pro hockey player makes all of this moot. Would I sacrifice some prospects for healthy Eichel? Of course, if you wouldn't, I wouldn't want you running my team.
As for people asking why would they lie about expectations - really? Ticket sales kind of matter in the business.
As for people asking why would they lie about expectations - really? Ticket sales kind of matter in the business.
Would you buy season tickets to watch the current roster or would you wait to see what Blake does this summer? Of course you'd wait and I think many potential STH will wait. Blake lying a couple of weeks ago would be pretty shortsighted of him because it will only take 2-3 months to see if he was lying or not.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
This is what you'd like to happen and not what you think is going to happen, right?
T-Mac was given the money he was given so they can hopefully make the playoffs in the last year of his five year contract?
They've improved in the standings every season since the rebuild began in 2019 so how are they getting a Top 5 pick "again"? They are already out of the Top 5 this season.
To simply hope that the prospects start impacting in their D4-D6 years is insane. Also, nobody gets better and younger every year: your young good players get older and you don't just swap them out for new prospects. Back to just waiting on D4-D6 year prospects to provide progress in 2023, are you suggesting that Blake will not add any outside help that entire time? Again, this is why I ask if this is more what you would like to see v. what you think Blake will do because there is zero chance he stands pat and waits for 2024 to make the playoffs.
You can add and build at the same time. You can add someone now that is 27 or younger and they should still be productive by the time you have the playoffs pegged in 2024. I know you say it all could fall flat and, yeah, simply sitting on all of the prospects and hoping for another Top 5 pick is extremely risky.
The prospect pool is like a meme stock. Look at how high that price has risen! It's all unrealized gains until you cash it out and it probably isn't a good investment strategy to not realize some of those gains and invest it in something proven.
Herby
How could Blake have known?
Doughty is signed for another 6 seasons, how can I not factor him into the rebuild?
The last Kings rebuild had three star players, one at each position. In the 2008-2009 season when a lot of us kind of think the Kings sucked but made a whole lot of progress they had Kopitar as a locked in established star 1C at 21, Doughty as a locked in established star 1D at 19 and Quick who was showing major flashes of his star potential as a 22-23 year old goaltender.
SFKingshomer
Registered User
People lie all the time to sell their point, whether it's sports, politics, profession, etc.
- Mar 9, 2002
- 7,197
- 4,932
I kind of want Greenway and his size on our team. RFA in a year, only 24, and can actually pot a few goals here and there.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
GM's don't have to lay out their plans for the whole world to see and I'd expect Rob Blake to "lie" because he is Rob Blake, never mind the fact that he is a GM.
But I don't think he is lying about adding to this team. Now, that doesn't mean a blockbuster but it does mean that it won't be status quo and that expectations are higher for this upcoming season.
As for STH's, renewals are done during the preceding season prior to exit interviews. People that still have season tickets to these clowns, like this idiot right here, are going to be happy next season for these reasons:
a) Actually being able to go to a Kings game in my seats for the first time in 18-19 months. That might go away by Game 5 but I've already bought the tickets.
b) Byfield. Bjornfot. Kaliyev? Etc...
I'll be happier if they are winning and getting *new* season seat holders will depend on winning but STH'ers that have held on during this rebuild are going to be pleased by progress and the excitement of young talent.
- Mar 9, 2002
- 7,197
- 4,932
like I tell my wife, what isn’t now a days.
I know it’s not a need but Wild fans seem to be including Dumba or himself in a lot of their proposals and want centers or picks in return.
Herby
How could Blake have known?
So many people just fail to grasp this concept. You hear people talk about guys like Eichel and Marner like they are 30 years old with 6 more years on their contracts. You hear just insane comments like "Mortgaging the Future" or "Giving up the Rebuild" for trade offers for guys in their early to mid 20's that don't even involve the Kings only true elite prospect going the other way. I was messing with the future Kings lineups and it's so hard to build anything beyond Kaliyev and QB because everything is so muddled with similar caliber players. And there are some valid concerns.
If QB and Kopitar are the Kings top 2 centers for the next 3 years what becomes of those other guys? Alex Turcotte, a player the Kings drafted #5 overall two years ago, you move him to wing on a scoring line? I mean kind of kills the biggest asset of that pick, a potential two-way center. Turcotte would not have been drafted nearly as high had he been a winger. Do you try and run him as the 3C, again it really limits you because its such a less valuable role. Vilardi and Kupari are in the same boat, not top 5 picks but guys the Kings used decent picks on. Do people truly believe that any of these guys are going to be the high end offensive players the organization needs? Especially if 2 of them are going to be playing their non-natural position You add in JAD, Lias, Thomas and it's just beyond muddled with C+ to B+ level prospects. Not the end of the world, depth is a good thing but to much depth when you lack high end talent is not a good thing.
I guess for the stay the course crew they propose something like this for a Kings roster in 3 years.
[TABLE="class: brtb_item_table"][TBODY][TR][TD]Kaliyev[/TD][TD]Byfield[/TD][TD]Vilardi[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]Iafallo[/TD][TD]Kopitar[/TD][TD]FA/Trade[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]Kempe[/TD][TD]Turcotte[/TD][TD]Kupari[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]Moore[/TD][TD]JAD[/TD][TD]Thomas[/TD][/TR][/TBODY][/TABLE]
[TABLE="class: brtb_item_table"][TBODY][TR][TD]Bjornfot[/TD][TD]Doughty[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]FA/Trade[/TD][TD]Roy[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]Anderson[/TD][TD]Faber[/TD][/TR][/TBODY][/TABLE]
[TABLE="class: brtb_item_table"][TBODY][TR][TD]Peterson[/TD][/TR]
[TR][TD]Wallstedt[/TD][/TR][/TBODY][/TABLE]
Underwhelming IMO. But interesting to see what Blake does this summer, we won't have to wait long to see what direction they really will go. I am still betting on a big trade by the Kings this summer.
You are correct, they had Kopitar as a locked in established star 1C at 21, Doughty as a locked in established star 1D at 19 and Quick who was showing major flashes of his star potential as a 22-23 year old goaltender.
They had 3 yang stars.
Today they have Kopitar at 33 and Doughty at 30.
You cannot rebuild with these 2 on Kings…
Herby
How could Blake have known?
I'm not trying to rebuild with those two guys. I am hoping that the Kings trade some of their redundant prospects for a player who can both help the Kings contend again before both turn to dust and be young enough to continue with the next era of players like QB and Kaliyev.
If that isn't possible I'd rather just blow it up and try and get some very high picks that turn into guys like the Avs had on their PP last night.
SFKingshomer
Registered User
We aren't going to become the Avs even with their players. Fix the system and culture before adding an offensive fire power or we are going to be disappointed with the result.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Is that two seasons from now or three years from now? Only asking because Kopitar only has three years left on his deal. I guess the idea would be that Turcotte would slide up to 2C.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 21,479
- 18,925
It's an ideal scenario. Not what I necessarily expect to happen. The chances of a rebuild working out are always slim.
It's misleading to say the team has improved in the standings. Kings point percentage last 3 years:
18/19: .430
19/20: .457
20/21: .438
They looked better at the end of last season, then they did by the end of this season.
Remember in my post I said "If the Kings stay the current course"; meaning keep acquiring young assets don't make significant moves to improve the roster right now. If that continues, they'll likely be a bottom feeder team in the running for a top 5 pick again.
Anything can happen though. If Vilardi/Byfield/Andersson "hit" next season, the Kings could be a playoff team. I just think that's low probability and Kopitar looks like he's declining.
Hoping your prospects hit in their D4-D6 years exactly what you do in a rebuild. Expecting and hoping are two different things. "Getting better and younger" is a term Dean used to use. It means your team is starting to improve, while you simultaneously have new young players coming into the lineup.
As far as what Blake will do, I don't know. I suspect AEG doesn't want to spend. I also think it will come down to whether or not Blake feels like he needs to do something to save his job. My opinion is that the Kings should do nothing and stay on the current path. I suspect you disagree.
I agree there's more than one way to build a contender. But building through the draft is the best way IMO.
I like the investing analogy, but I think you've got it backwards. Building the farm is like taking the long term patient approach Warren Buffett style. Trying to "win now" is like trading meme stocks; you might get a short term boost, but it's a fools errand that never works out in the long term.
The key to success is almost always the same no matter what you're doing. Think long term, delay gratification.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Perhaps it is better relative to the rest of the league this past season haha. That said, they've been shedding veterans throughout that time and getting younger so I guess they have been getting "better and younger" than 2019, at least.
I disagree with your extended timeline but I've been on board with rebuilding. I think you have to cash in some of your lotto tickets for actual cash while the lotto tickets still have value. I've noted Lombardi trading Quincey and O'Sullivan. We all thought those guys were going to be fixtures and part of the solution. You can argue that we at least got to see more of those guys than the majority of the current prospects and I get that argument as well.
This rebuild is different though since DL's didn't have two legacy guys that still play at a high level. They are going to try to be relevant with Kopitar here and definitely Doughty. Since I believe that is the plan, I don't think another season in the cellar is a good move. For your ideal scenario? Sure. For Blake's "vision". No.
I can get on board with AEG not wanting to spend money but I think they would be okay with starting to add next year since it appears we are on track for full buildings again. I know they are world wide though so they aren't totally in the clear. The Kings aren't going to be a cap teams soon though by any means.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 21,479
- 18,925
Eichel is AMC stock. Seth Jones is GameStop stock.
Byfeild, Vilardi, Kaliyev, Turcotte, Madden, Faber, Bjornfot, Kupari, Anderson, JAD, Thomas is a diversified portfolio of long term investments; some will hit, some will miss, but you minimize risk through diversification.
You can try and get short term gains trading AMC/GME stock, but a diversified portfolio with a long term approach will almost always outperform in the end.
Byfeild, Vilardi, Kaliyev, Turcotte, Madden, Faber, Bjornfot, Kupari, Anderson, JAD, Thomas is a diversified portfolio of long term investments; some will hit, some will miss, but you minimize risk through diversification.
You can try and get short term gains trading AMC/GME stock, but a diversified portfolio with a long term approach will almost always outperform in the end.
Peter James Bond II
"Man, we were right there" - De-Luc-sional
- Mar 5, 2015
- 3,682
- 5,520
Let's not count out Tkachyov. I read he's flying here in Sept. I wish he was flying here now, meeting staff, meeting players, working out and getting acclimated. Oh well. While you cannot pencil him in,
you cannot count him out.
I would propose to try this, but I think it will never be considered. Instead of trading buku assets to get a #1 LHD, try Clague with DD. Sure, the best resolution would be to get that #1 LHD.
There are none out there...with exception to a Werenski? If dealing prospects for a top player, use them on a top 3 forward...there are more of those, than top pairing LHD out there.
Find a team in cap trouble - like there will be many.
I am sure 'trying Clague with Doughty' would be met with..."why?" I would say why not? There's nothing to lose. It's too bad Drew has had a new partner virtually every year.....Muzz..McNabb, Macd (WTF?)
Maatta, Bjornfot (short lived) Anderson...Ideally, it would be nice to just keep him with Anderson.
The case for Clague, is that he may go to Seattle. If he does, watch him become Theodore-light or Girard-light...Anaheim didn't see enough in Theodore, that he was exposed and Nashville gave up Girard
in the Duchene deal...probably thinking he would not reach the level he has. Some of the best young D, were let go, dealt, like these 2. Ryan Graves couldn't make the Rags; played 3 yrs in their system.
A year ago, I would give up Clague and be fine with that. After seeing him in about 15 games with the Kings, he made a good impression on me and several games, he really cut through the ozone like a
stud and activated....making great plays and passes. He had confidence and oozed true ability. He can sure skate and I never saw him make a bad pinch or hang anyone out. I think he has good vision
to be able to become what the Kings had hoped, when they drafted him. I think Drew would help him to become even better and would add to the offense. Anderson was really not adding any offensive
prowess at all. He said he's going to work on his shot this Summer and strength. That's awesome. I love him and Toby. If Clague was third paring, he will never get to use his ability....and he oozes abilty.
If MacD and McBadd could get a season with Drew, why not Clague? I do not see this happeing...but I think could work and be an answer to adding offense from the D....oppoed to losing 2-3 assets trying to upgrade to a LHD...unless, you could get Werenski, without giving up a #1, Turcotte, Bjornfot. type of deal.
you cannot count him out.
I would propose to try this, but I think it will never be considered. Instead of trading buku assets to get a #1 LHD, try Clague with DD. Sure, the best resolution would be to get that #1 LHD.
There are none out there...with exception to a Werenski? If dealing prospects for a top player, use them on a top 3 forward...there are more of those, than top pairing LHD out there.
Find a team in cap trouble - like there will be many.
I am sure 'trying Clague with Doughty' would be met with..."why?" I would say why not? There's nothing to lose. It's too bad Drew has had a new partner virtually every year.....Muzz..McNabb, Macd (WTF?)
Maatta, Bjornfot (short lived) Anderson...Ideally, it would be nice to just keep him with Anderson.
The case for Clague, is that he may go to Seattle. If he does, watch him become Theodore-light or Girard-light...Anaheim didn't see enough in Theodore, that he was exposed and Nashville gave up Girard
in the Duchene deal...probably thinking he would not reach the level he has. Some of the best young D, were let go, dealt, like these 2. Ryan Graves couldn't make the Rags; played 3 yrs in their system.
A year ago, I would give up Clague and be fine with that. After seeing him in about 15 games with the Kings, he made a good impression on me and several games, he really cut through the ozone like a
stud and activated....making great plays and passes. He had confidence and oozed true ability. He can sure skate and I never saw him make a bad pinch or hang anyone out. I think he has good vision
to be able to become what the Kings had hoped, when they drafted him. I think Drew would help him to become even better and would add to the offense. Anderson was really not adding any offensive
prowess at all. He said he's going to work on his shot this Summer and strength. That's awesome. I love him and Toby. If Clague was third paring, he will never get to use his ability....and he oozes abilty.
If MacD and McBadd could get a season with Drew, why not Clague? I do not see this happeing...but I think could work and be an answer to adding offense from the D....oppoed to losing 2-3 assets trying to upgrade to a LHD...unless, you could get Werenski, without giving up a #1, Turcotte, Bjornfot. type of deal.
- May 9, 2014
- 5,823
- 8,238
I think we both broadly agree with both adding and building concurrently. I’m just in the camp of not making a very big move yet as it likely just creates another hole. We will need to make such a move but I think it’s 12 months early. That said, if a no brainier deal comes along you have to do it, as we don’t have 100% control of the timing.
I fully expect to move a C or two at some stage, I just don’t think it will be to strengthen Center ice. It wouldn’t be the first time I was wrong though.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
How about this...I look at it like Eichel and Jones are the Dow 30 and all of the prospects are Bitcoin. Could be the future but I could also wake up one day and see half my portfolio value gone.
I'm not going to get rich though simply investing in something like the S&P 500. Safe returns, maybe a couple of playoff appearances but nothing life changing. So I'm not divesting all of my Bitcoin holdings but I am going to cash in some of it at an all-time high for a sure-thing. I'll ride the ups and downs of the volatile Bitcoin market with my remaining "shares" while also continuing to add to it.
I'm not even saying "Get Eichel or Jones at all costs" but I am very open to this 8OA pick being in play. A lot of what I look at is under the guise of Blake doing something relatively big this summer so, if I resign myself to that, I'm going to talk about what I think would be good.
Honestly, I'd like Reinhart if possible since wing is a real need at the NHL level and in the pipeline. Turns 26 in November and you can basically pencil him in for 20 goals and 50 points. 60 point pace the last two seasons and has been very durable. Have to imagine he costs less than Eichel or Jones and he can be a legit player to put on Byfield's wing. Have to also remember that we want to make the NHL transition as easy as possible for the prospects and playing with Kempe and Brown on your wings isn't exactly the best environment. Give me Iafallo and Reinhart on either side of Byfield next season and I really like that for QB. Kopitar can drag around Brown again for another year and you still might get your lottery selection.
Is 8OA + a non blue chip prospect too rich for Reinhart? If he refuses to sign, would 8OA be enough?
Steve Zissou
I'll order you a red cap and a Speedo.
Re-visiting the Grubauer / Orpik (Washington) trade for a 2nd rounder (Colorado) in 2018….
Feels exactly like the type of trade Rob needs to make this off-season in leu of the flat cap + expansion draft.
LeBrun: How much money could Grubauer make this offseason? And the fallout from Scheifele's hit on Evans
Feels exactly like the type of trade Rob needs to make this off-season in leu of the flat cap + expansion draft.
LeBrun: How much money could Grubauer make this offseason? And the fallout from Scheifele's hit on Evans
The Lukeman
Opinionated
- Apr 7, 2019
- 575
- 1,309
Just circling back on the Eichel rumors. This is such a mess. I’m getting less and less comfortable about acquiring him with our blue chip assets. I know Mayor put water on the fire. But man do I feel for Eichel.
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