Rumor: 2020-21 Trade Rumours and FA Part VIII: Intra-Playoff Edition?

[PowerMac]

It would take about 88 mil to re-sign Saad, Landeskog, Makar and field a full team, then they'd still need to pay the goalies. If Grubauer wants more than 5mil then you probably should move on from him, that's not an amount of money you can afford to put in goalies for a team like this unless they maybe dump francouz and go with Jojo for 1 mil aav. So with goalies it's going to be around 94 mil which is 11 mil over the projected cap. Between the expendible players like Compher, Kadri, Graves, Donskoi, Girard they can free up 20 mil, Sakic should ask around and see what he can get for these 5 because all their values most likely peaked this season.

 

[redacted]

I'd agree with you if the options weren't Graves or Donskoi. If Graves continues his play in the postseason, he'd be able to return a low 1st or 2nd + B prospect without them taking on any extra salary. Donskoi would have his supporters as well and has proven he can produce when given top 6 minutes. Also considering both of them have the ideal length of contracts for an expansion team (2 years left) where they can either help bring the team to contending quickly like Vegas and be re-signed, or they can be sold off as a deadline rental in a year or two for a decent return.

I think Graves and Dong have their positives too for them being selected. I just think it is too early to get a sense of where it is going. How Seattle works to take on salary and turn that into assets will be a key part of where they go. It may not be necessarily Dong vs LOC... it might be Dong (that turns into a 2nd upon a trade) vs LOC + D Strome + 2nd. Until it is really known where teams will go and how much they are willing to pay for salary to be taken on, we don't know much.

 

[Pokecheque]

35+ rules changed under this new MOU.

Wait, what? They did? So there's no consequence now? I always thought those were stupid anyway.

 

[redacted]

If I’m Seattle, I take Graves over MacDonald every day of the week.

MacDonald piled up great advanced stats against non-playoff teams and has trended down since.

That's not how it went... MacDonald had 3 horrible games stats wise and 3 more that were bad. The rest were good to phenomenal. The 3 horrible came against Vegas twice and Arizona. The 3 bad were against San Jose, Anaheim and Minny. Of his games above 55% xGF (25 of them which is pretty absurd for 33 games)... 11 were against playoff teams or 44%. He had 8 games below 55% xGF, 3 were against playoff teams (2 Vegas). He had 12 games above 75% xGF... 5 were against playoff teams. To end the season MacDonald had 5 straight games after his Arizona disaster over 55% xGF including Vegas and St Louis. Prior to the Arizona game, he had 6 straight 55+% games after the Vegas debacle. He had some bad games, but he was still putting up absurd numbers.

To illustrate that further... the two bad games against Vegas happened in late March. Starting with those two games, MacDonald is still over 60% xGF. He's behind G, Makar, Toews and Timmins, but still ahead of anybody else with reasonable minutes played. Take out those two Vegas games and just have his end to the season... he tops the Avs in xGF%.

 

[redacted]

Wait, what? They did? So there's no consequence now? I always thought those were stupid anyway.

If they are structured right, no consequence. If you still dive off (say 9m, 9m, 4.5m, 4.5m) or have odd bonuses there can be some still.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

That's not how it went... MacDonald had 3 horrible games stats wise and 3 more that were bad. The rest were good to phenomenal. The 3 horrible came against Vegas twice and Arizona. The 3 bad were against San Jose, Anaheim and Minny. Of his games above 55% xGF (25 of them which is pretty absurd for 33 games)... 11 were against playoff teams or 44%. He had 8 games below 55% xGF, 3 were against playoff teams (2 Vegas). He had 12 games above 75% xGF... 5 were against playoff teams. To end the season MacDonald had 5 straight games after his Arizona disaster over 55% xGF including Vegas and St Louis. Prior to the Arizona game, he had 6 straight 55+% games after the Vegas debacle. He had some bad games, but he was still putting up absurd numbers.

To illustrate that further... the two bad games against Vegas happened in late March. Starting with those two games, MacDonald is still over 60% xGF. He's behind G, Makar, Toews and Timmins, but still ahead of anybody else with reasonable minutes played. Take out those two Vegas games and just have his end to the season... he tops the Avs in xGF%.

His advanced stats definitely dropped after his initial burst onto the scene in that stretch against the non-playoff teams. He was leading the league in CORSI at one point.

I just never saw the eye-test matchup with the advanced stats on MacDonald.

To me, he’s a bottom pair defenceman, which is maybe what Graves is too, but Graves has at least proven he can play in a top-4 at times.

I don’t think MacDonald is bad or anything like that, but the advanced stats don’t match what I’ve seen in the ice.

 

[redacted]

His advanced stats definitely dropped after his initial burst onto the scene in that stretch against the non-playoff teams. He was leading the league in CORSI at one point.

I just never saw the eye-test matchup with the advanced stats on MacDonald.

To me, he’s a bottom pair defenceman, which is maybe what Graves is too, but Graves has at least proven he can play in a top-4 at times.

I don’t think MacDonald is bad or anything like that, but the advanced stats don’t match what I’ve seen in the ice.

You're obviously going to drop when you start at over 70%. MacDonald was 2nd amongst defensemen who played 10+ games in xGF% to close out the season. That doesn't mean he's the best, but he still ended incredibly high.

 

[Foppa2118]

MacDonald is a good depth defenseman on a Cup team or an average bottom pairing defenseman on an average team.

He only played 33 games in a pretty sheltered and specialized puck mover role. They made sure to play him to his strengths not his weaknesses and get the right matchups. He also hasn't faced the test of being exposed in the playoffs.

Another example of why advanced stats can be misleading. I like MacDonald but I certainly hope Seattle picks him instead of Graves or Donskoi who provide more for the team.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

You're obviously going to drop when you start at over 70%. MacDonald was 2nd amongst defensemen who played 10+ games in xGF% to close out the season. That doesn't mean he's the best, but he still ended incredibly high.

That’s nice, but how much stock do you put into that? Are you rating him as an elite defenceman?

I think he’s a fine player, but if you just looked at the advanced numbers you’d think he was elite.

 

[cinchronicity]

Kadri is just fine for next season and we need the center depth. 4.5M is a solid cap hit and its not unreasonable to expect him to work harder during a contract year.

After that he can walk, don't think Kadri's game will age well.

I think this is spot on. Kadri does not like playing 3C, but our 3rd line will be as good as many 2nd lines, and if he wants any sort of a contract, he is going to have to play his rear off. Mac > Jost > Kadri > Newhook is decent center depth, followed by Mac > Hopefully Newhook> Jost > ??? the following year.

 

[PowerMac]

I'm glad that MacDonald isn't playing over Timmins at least, of course Timmins also made it hard for Bednar with his outstanding play (still only 7 minutes in game 4). If they can trade Donskoi or Graves for something of value in return they should do it, need to clear that cap space and I don't think Donskoi is going to put up 20 goals again.

 

[LTC Pain]

I think this is spot on. Kadri does not like playing 3C, but our 3rd line will be as good as many 2nd lines, and if he wants any sort of a contract, he is going to have to play his rear off. Mac > Jost > Kadri > Newhook is decent center depth, followed by Mac > Hopefully Newhook> Jost > ??? the following year.

I don't really give a damn what Kadri doesn't like! He's playing down to the 3rd or even 4th line center position as of lately. If his ass doesn't like it then by all means PRODUCE. I'm not seeing Kadri producing the "magical contract year" performance, so I'd trade him on draft day.

 

[Pokecheque]

His advanced stats definitely dropped after his initial burst onto the scene in that stretch against the non-playoff teams. He was leading the league in CORSI at one point.

I just never saw the eye-test matchup with the advanced stats on MacDonald.

To me, he’s a bottom pair defenceman, which is maybe what Graves is too, but Graves has at least proven he can play in a top-4 at times.

I don’t think MacDonald is bad or anything like that, but the advanced stats don’t match what I’ve seen in the ice.

I don't know what you weren't seeing. He got the puck out of danger on a regular basis, regularly won battles, and moved it fluidly in all zones. The only part of his game that still stinks is his finish. He also didn't quite connect with passes either. But that's fine because the defensive aspects of his puckhandling were, for the most part, elite. I figure there has to be a dropoff because I don't think he's elite by any means, but I think there's something there. This doesn't look like a fluke.

And yes he's probably a third pairing guy but he appears to be a high-end third pairing guy.

 

[redacted]

That’s nice, but how much stock do you put into that? Are you rating him as an elite defenceman?

I think he’s a fine player, but if you just looked at the advanced numbers you’d think he was elite.

I mean, he should win the Hart!

I don’t value him as an elite player. He’s not elite. He looks like a guy who slid through the cracks and could be an impact top 4 guy (could operative word). He’s a guy who could have a pretty high reward, but the sample is a large question. I wouldn’t pay up a 2nd for him and certainly not more. But I’d risk a mid round pick to see what he has and if it is true, you have Schmidt 2.0

 

[cinchronicity]

It would take about 88 mil to re-sign Saad, Landeskog, Makar and field a full team, then they'd still need to pay the goalies. If Grubauer wants more than 5mil then you probably should move on from him, that's not an amount of money you can afford to put in goalies for a team like this unless they maybe dump francouz and go with Jojo for 1 mil aav. So with goalies it's going to be around 94 mil which is 11 mil over the projected cap. Between the expendible players like Compher, Kadri, Graves, Donskoi, Girard they can free up 20 mil, Sakic should ask around and see what he can get for these 5 because all their values most likely peaked this season.

Girard is anything but expendable

 

[LTC Pain]

Girard is anything but expendable

Girard is NOT expendable. Good grief, how do posters hallucinate this stuff up???

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I don't know what you weren't seeing. He got the puck out of danger on a regular basis, regularly won battles, and moved it fluidly in all zones. The only part of his game that still stinks is his finish. He also didn't quite connect with passes either. But that's fine because the defensive aspects of his puckhandling were, for the most part, elite. I figure there has to be a dropoff because I don't think he's elite by any means, but I think there's something there. This doesn't look like a fluke.

And yes he's probably a third pairing guy but he appears to be a high-end third pairing guy.

Yeah, that’s fair.

I think he’s played pretty well for the most part. It’s more looking at the advanced stats and viewing him at that level that I disagree with.

I’m happy the Avs have the guy. He’s been a good find.

 

[Balthazar]

Between the expendible players like Compher, Kadri, Graves, Donskoi, Girard they can free up 20 mil, Sakic should ask around and see what he can get for these 5 because all their values most likely peaked this season.

lol'd

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

So with goalies it's going to Between the expendible players like Compher, Kadri, Graves, Donskoi, Girard they can free up 20 mil, Sakic should ask around and see what he can get for these 5 because all their values most likely peaked this season.

Imagine still being this clueless

 

[Foppa2118]

I don't know what you weren't seeing. He got the puck out of danger on a regular basis, regularly won battles, and moved it fluidly in all zones. The only part of his game that still stinks is his finish. He also didn't quite connect with passes either. But that's fine because the defensive aspects of his puckhandling were, for the most part, elite. I figure there has to be a dropoff because I don't think he's elite by any means, but I think there's something there. This doesn't look like a fluke.

And yes he's probably a third pairing guy but he appears to be a high-end third pairing guy.

Actual defending against the opposition in the D zone when they have the puck is still lacking with MacDonald. He's not a sieve, but it's not a strong point of his.

Fortunately the coaching staff was able to shelter him enough to prevent his weaknesses from being exposed too often. Which have probably led to distorting his advanced stats.

 

[PowerMac]

Looked pretty expendible to me when we did just fine when he was out of the lineup, offense from the blue line looked better with Timmins running things out there. Byram can easily replace what he brings and more.

 

[CaleMakaw]

I figure we're losing two out of three of graves, Donskoi and Sadd. Which scenario would you prefer?

Scenario 1: Seattle takes Graves, keep Dong, Sadd walks.

Scenario 2: Trade Graves, Seattle takes Dong, resign Sadd.

Scenario 3: Hope Seattle takes Donskoi. Keep graves. Make room for Sadd?

Can we get rid of compher with 1-1.5M retained?

 

[sethro109]

I figure we're losing two out of three of graves, Donskoi and Sadd. Which scenario would you prefer?

Scenario 1: Seattle takes Graves, keep Dong, Sadd walks.

Scenario 2: Trade Graves, Seattle takes Dong, resign Sadd.

Scenario 3: Hope Seattle takes Donskoi. Keep graves. Make room for Sadd?

Can we get rid of compher with 1-1.5M retained?

I like Saad, but we can't afford him. Scenario 1 is most likely and the one I'm hoping for. Graves needs to keep building his stock in the playoffs so they choose him over Dong.

 

[redacted]

G is the furthest thing from expendable. He’s probably third on the untouchable list just behind MacK and Makar. If his offense holds up, he’s a legit #1 on a sweetheart contract. If it doesn’t, he’s and elite #2 on a sweetheart contract.

 

[redacted]

I figure we're losing two out of three of graves, Donskoi and Sadd. Which scenario would you prefer?

Scenario 1: Seattle takes Graves, keep Dong, Sadd walks.

Scenario 2: Trade Graves, Seattle takes Dong, resign Sadd.

Scenario 3: Hope Seattle takes Donskoi. Keep graves. Make room for Sadd?

Can we get rid of compher with 1-1.5M retained?

4: trade Dong for McDavid.