Salary Cap: 2020-21 Lightning Roster Discussion | Part 2

[Bozo Nicholson]

Swear? Where did I swear? No offense intended, I simply was emphasizing my belief that Cernak easily gets the lowest out of the 3.

H - E - Double Hockey Sticks

You're a bad, bad man.

 

[PJ817]

H - E - Double Hockey Sticks

You're a bad, bad man.

well, it was the emphasis that annoyed me

Did a thing in Excel taking what CF had listed as top 150 UFAs (all of them???); filtering on position - whichever way they were listed, graying out the ones already signed or retired, I highlighted the ones in yellow that are yet to be signed and over $1M; leaving the white lines as under $1M and available ...

looking at pts, games played, age, contract terms ... to me, it seems like there's a lot of choices for other teams to take yet before venturing into Johnson land

Edited to add: TyJo: 65 games, 31 pts, -6

 

[Stormbreaker]

 

[BoltzManConstant]

Frankly, I don't see Sergachev, Cirelli, and Cernak taking up more than $9 Million of cap space combined... that's top-end IMO. People expecting Sergachev to get an OS paying him $6.5+ Million AAV haven't really been paying attention. Some also forget that for long stretches last season, where all three were playing with their heads up their asses. Sure, they had plenty of times where they played well too. Extraordinarily well in some stretches but they weren't consistent enough to warrant major paydays. That inconsistency will cost them in these deals. Count on that.

Nice strawman. Who is saying that Serg will get $6.5m?

He can get a hell of a lot less than that, and we'd still struggle to fit those 3 in under $9m. Heck, let's say Serg gets $5.5m, how are we going to get Cirelli and Cernak for $3.5m?

I mean, it's _possible_ we can get them all for $9m, but that's certainly not the "top-end" estimate -- it's very low-end. It probably involves one of them giving us a sizable discount in expectation of a big payday, e.g. Cirelli taking $3m for 1 year and he cashes in next year.

And even keeping it to $9m doesn't do us much good. We likely have to move Killer and TJ to get that much free space.

 

[BoltzManConstant]

I'll bet you we don't trade Cirelli. DM me

No thanks.

 

[Stormbreaker]

There are still a few FA dominoes that need to fall before we start seeing more trades.

 

[Byrddog]

You obviously haven't been paying much attention to contracts and team space lately if you think these guys are getting much, if anything, over 3 million. You are also the only person that thinks losing Johnson and Killorn vs losing 2 of the 3 rfas is a benefit to the team. Brisebo

Yeah, I don't think he's ever had one good idea about how the Lightning should move forward. I usually just skip over anything he posts at this point.

Bookmarked this so we can return to it after this washes thru.

 

[CupsOverCash]

This would be surprising. I'm not expecting to trade Stamkos although I guess that move would basically help us bring back the team that just won the cup. I just don't like trading Stammer unless we get a great deal for him which I'm not sure we would.

 

[DownIsTheNewUp]

Man, if we trade Stamkos just so we can keep Killorn I’ll be pissed. That would be pants on head stupid. Injuries or not, I’ll take one legged Stamkos over Killorn every single day.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Man, if we trade Stamkos just so we can keep Killorn I’ll be pissed. That would be pants on head stupid. Injuries or not, I’ll take one legged Stamkos over Killorn every single day.

I dont think it will be to keep killorn. It would be because nobody wanted killorn or tj without us giving a lot to go with it is my suspicion. At least more than we would be willing to give. I honestly don't have too much issue just adding a first to tj to get it done. I dont see why that wouldn't interest some team.

 

[DownIsTheNewUp]

I dont think it will be to keep killorn. It would be because nobody wanted killorn or tj without us giving a lot to go with it is my suspicion. At least more than we would be willing to give. I honestly don't have too much issue just adding a first to tj to get it done. I dont see why that wouldn't interest some team.

Just going by what Friedman said in that audio clip, he makes it sounds like they’d be happy to move Stamkos but they’re very opposed to moving Killorn. Which might explain why Killorn hasn’t been moved yet if they’re that intent on keeping him.

 

[Fabiobest]

We won't trade Stamkos.

 

[Fabiobest]

A question for you all:
imagine that both Friedman and McKenzie are right. Imagine that JFBB will trade Stamkos.
In your opinion, when will we see this trade?
In case: who will come to Tampa?

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

A Stamkos trade just seems... so farfetched.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

Does this guy have 31 new hockey scoops every day?

 

[BoltsFanPinellasPark]

Ok, someone please tell me if this can work. I try to keep up but I don't really have the time to analyze. This is what I think the Bolts can do.

1 - Kuch, Point, Palat (Untouchable)
2 - Killorn, Stamkos, Johnson (Worst Pure offensive scoring line in the playoffs, Cirelli's value is clearly the PK, and no guarantee Stamkos rolls, Killer rolls both PK and PP)
3 - Goodrow, Gourde, Coleman (Untouchable, this is the grit line and really what I feel made the difference between round 1 in 2019 and the SCF in 2020)
4 - Maroon, Paquette, Volkov (Tinker line, remember they rolled 11 forwards for most of the playoffs, Paquette is gritty, Maroon is a beast and a vet, Volkov did well with limited minutes)

D1 - Hedman, Serg (Untouchable, I suppose you could argue that McD could take the second spot and pick one between Cernak and Serg)
D2 - McD, Cernak (Pick one, really would rather see Cernak develop, he can skate with Serg and anyone can skate with Hedman. McD is a rock no doubt. But he probably is the hidden gem as far as trade value on this roster, and he'd free up enough space to most likely get both Serg and Cernak under contract)
D3 - Coburn, Shenn (Pick one)

Call ups, well I've already got Volkov penciled in on the 4th line, but I think the Bolts can bounce around assignments here to get the team in playoff mode. So I think they have to be looking at calling up at least 2 defensemen and two forwards.

That second line needs to be broken up and rebuilt. Stamkos can anchor that line, but he needs someone to get under the net and get him the puck. I like Killorn for that job, and if they lose McD in what I think is probably the best trade value on the bolts, they will want to keep their other A. Clearly Hedman has earned the 2nd A.

So really I think, pick your favorite 2 forwards in the best two defenseman and call them up.

Cirelli will be a huge loss because of his PK skill and emergence as a solid #2 center, but we don't really have anyone to skate with him *right now* as evidence by the weakness on the playoffs. We will miss him on the PK for sure.

I really think of the 3 RFA's Cirelli is going to be the odd man out. However, if we move McD and Cirelli I think we free up enough cap space to get both Serg and Cernak under contract.

I realize that McD will be needed to ask to waive his NTC, but together with Johnson it would bring a nice valuable trade and possibly get some picks out of it.

We'll have two of the best lines in hockey in the 1st and 3rd. One of the two young forwards may emerge and can put him up there with Stamkos and Killorn as we mix and match that 4th line. We'll have to find something to click there.

The D will be solid in the top 4 and one of the two young Dmen may also emerge.

To me, that's the only way we keep at least 2 of the RFA's that we like.

Worse case tho, we end up losing Serg and Cirelli and keep Cernak around. And really, that aint all that bad.

Someone please poke some holes in my thinking. I just looked at cap friendly website to try and get an idea of what the big club is facing and that's what I came up with after reading all the posts and adding my thoughts.

 

[J T Money]

Zero chance Stamkos gets moved. He’d end up on LTIR before that happens.

 

[These Are The Days]

Lmao. Let's trade Stamkos but somehow get equal value in return without adding to our cap space. f***ing brilliant


Whatever you're on Friedman stop hogging it

 

[Major4Boarding]

A Stamkos trade just seems... so farfetched.

Exactly. I mean, we bought out VL4 when no one thought he'd never not-be a Bolt. So anything is kinda possible. But I have wonder out loud here. He still has positive value regardless in my mind because (triple knock-on-wood-crusha-jinx) he'd be a LTIR Godsend, wouldn't he?(See Mattias Ohlund). And moving Stamkos in favor of keeping (descending order) Johnson, Killorn, Coburn, Paquette, Gourde, Cernak, Cirelli, or Sergachev?

I mean EF is my #2 most-trusted NHL Insider, so I'm buying into there being smoke=fire. But still...

 

[JTBF81]

Bookmarked this so we can return to it after this washes thru.

Cool, you've never provided one good idea to helping the team, and thankfully, the team has never followed your line of thinking. Keeping Johnson and Killorn at the expense of Cirelli and Sergachev is quite possibly the most detrimental thing to the long-term success of this team possible. Killorn would be nice to keep, and there is a scenario where if Brisebois could move Johnson, Paquette and Coburn it might work. More than likely though Brisebois pays the price for Johnson and gets what he can for Killorn after the likes of Hoffman and Dadonov make up their minds, then re-signs the 3 rfa's and hopefully Rutta. Only a GM no longer interested in winning Cups/keeping the team strong would push for keeping Tyler Johnson and Alex Killorn while taking scratch off tickets for players like Sergachev and Cirelli in the hopes that in 3 years when the window is much shorter maybe 1 or 2 of them pay off. Again, so very thankful you have nothing to do with the Lightning's management as then they'd have no Cups and be well on their way to having a lottery pick.

 

[The Gongshow]

There's just no way we would get equal value in return for him. Look how messed up this offseason has been, some players are only getting 3rds. What is JBB gonna do trade Steven ****ing Stamkos for a 4th round pick.... now is not the off season to even think about trading Stamkos.

4 years left, Stamkos has earned playing out that contract. He's still very productive, just had some shit luck.

I want a motivated Stamkos next year, not a Stamkos who's thinking this franchise doesn't want him anymore...

 

[DownIsTheNewUp]

Exactly. I mean, we bought out VL4 when no one thought he'd never not-be a Bolt. So anything is kinda possible. But I have wonder out loud here. He still has positive value regardless in my mind because (triple knock-on-wood-crusha-jinx) he'd be a LTIR Godsend, wouldn't he?(See Mattias Ohlund). And moving Stamkos in favor of keeping (descending order) Johnson, Killorn, Coburn, Paquette, Gourde, Cernak, Cirelli, or Sergachev?

I mean EF is my #2 most-trusted NHL Insider, so I'm buying into there being smoke=fire. But still...

Problem is Bob Mckenzie also talked about the Lightning being open to trading Stamkos too, so there’s plenty of smoke going around. They wouldn’t bring it up if it wasn’t something that’s been discussed. Friedman said the Lightning have tried to keep it all quiet so I think that’s the only reason we aren’t hearing more.

Part of me is pissed at JBB for even considering trading Stamkos after what we went through with buying out Vinny and then the whole fiasco with Marty. It’s like we can’t ever keep our beloved figures around even while we are enjoying tons of success.

Then part of me is pissed at Stamkos since he has a NMC he could shut all of this down immediately, makes me wonder why the hell he’d be open to leaving at all anyway.

 

[TampaBoltz]

Stamkos to the Kings for a 2nd. He gets a fresh start and can hopefully stay healthy

 

[Fabiobest]

Problem is Bob Mckenzie also talked about the Lightning being open to trading Stamkos too, so there’s plenty of smoke going around. They wouldn’t bring it up if it wasn’t something that’s been discussed. Friedman said the Lightning have tried to keep it all quiet so I think that’s the only reason we aren’t hearing more.

Part of me is pissed at JBB for even considering trading Stamkos after what we went through with buying out Vinny and then the whole fiasco with Marty. It’s like we can’t ever keep our beloved figures around even while we are enjoying tons of success.

Then part of me is pissed at Stamkos since he has a NMC he could shut all of this down immediately, makes me wonder why the hell he’d be open to leaving at all anyway.

If all the athletes (not only the hockey players) has to shut down all the possible trades the reporters talk about, Twitter would be full of sh* and we'd real like 1500 different tweets, from 1500 different players, every single day.

 

[Master P]

Stamkos to the Kings for a 2nd. He gets a fresh start and can hopefully stay healthy