2019 Training Camp Thread - Pride and Passion

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Navin R Slavin

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But isn't something equivalent to that going to be the price for Laine? Maybe WPG won't desire Nino, but you somehow have to open a hole for Laine in the lineup, both in terms of roster structure and salary. I suppose it could be a second defenseman instead of Nino, but then you're sliding one of Dzingel, Nino, Svech, or TT down to the third line...not to mention a kid like Gauthier trying to carve a spot out for himself. You've merely created for your forward group much of the same problem you were trying to fix with Faulk in the group of defensemen. And this doesn't even dip into how problematic it is to essentially define the core of your team for years without allowing it establish itself organically. All these awesome prospects ripening, young players creating the beginnings of organizational success, then you trade away roster players to bring in one guy and cement him into your lineup. Sure, it might work.

Putting the Faulk luxury aside, the Hurricanes don't currently have a problem they are trying to solve. Attempting to weed out that small problem by uprooting a small portion of the flower bed isn't wise.

Tellin' ya: Faulk for darts. Maybe non-first ones, but picks.

Addendum thought: how many times do we on HFBoards shut down potential trades because there *has* to be a (particular-positioned) roster player coming in return? We have a luxury with the Faulk situation in that we don't need anything. Darts are easy for your trade partner to give up, and we love playing darts.

Again: if the price for Laine is too high, I don't think anyone thinks we should do it.

The question is, is Laine a distressed property that the Jets have to unload at below market value? If so, we're prime candidates. If not, not really worth discussing, and that's it. (And I don't think he is.)

I agree: the two most likely scenarios for Faulk are darts (plus some underperforming salary coming back if it's a cap team) or no trade at all.
 

Lempo

Recovering Future Considerations Truther
Feb 23, 2014
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Again: if the price for Laine is too high, I don't think anyone thinks we should do it.

The question is, is Laine a distressed property that the Jets have to unload at below market value? If so, we're prime candidates. If not, not really worth discussing, and that's it. (And I don't think he is.)

I agree: the two most likely scenarios for Faulk are darts (plus some underperforming salary coming back if it's a cap team) or no trade at all.
He is not. The reporter guy who peddled up the controversy has been paddling back, and the Jets organisation hasn't even flinched about it.

The guy was interviewed on their own publications video, and pretty much gave himself up calling Little's "albatros contract" the worst problem the Jets have (he then paddled back on that too and said they have many problems). He backed his view up by saying that Jets have for two years now traded their 1st for a 2C who they couldn't then keep and are now in the same peccadillo. So it was about a Finn reporter guy wanting a good C for Laine.
 

tarheelhockey

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Feb 12, 2010
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Again: if the price for Laine is too high, I don't think anyone thinks we should do it.

The question is, is Laine a distressed property that the Jets have to unload at below market value? If so, we're prime candidates. If not, not really worth discussing, and that's it. (And I don't think he is.)

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TheBigKahuna

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Dec 6, 2010
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I get its fun to play "what if". But Laine isnt coming here. This isn't a Skinner situation. And it would involve a lot of players moving to make room and cap space. Who in our top 6 shouldnt be there?
 
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Lempo

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Just my 0.02 €. I believe the character issues of Laine are overblown. Yes, he doesn't do proper Ontario lad hockeytalk, he is a blunt and proud Finn who says what he thinks.

If Canes sign him, I can guarantee Laine will sign a decent bridge knowing he will be stapled to Aho's hip. If there's really a buy-low opportunity Canes should take it but not if the price is Faulk+Nino+Necas.

There absolutely would not and should not be any kind of implied or expected guaranteed spot next to Aho or anyone for any player. If situation demands that lines be juggled, then lines be juggled.
 

Helsinki Hurricanes

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There absolutely would not and should not be any kind of implied or expected guaranteed spot next to Aho or anyone for any player. If situation demands that lines be juggled, then lines be juggled.

True, Canes shouldn't and even couldn't promise anything like that. However, there's a reason why I put it in with so strong words.

1) If Laine is traded (big if) that is at least partly because of feeling neglected for not getting to play with the teams best playmaking center and having the prime minutes.

From my understanding his disappointment in his current role/playing time/center is a major reason why he hasn't signed yet.

2) Aho is pass-first, playmaking center and having shoot-first goalscorer in Laine flanking him just makes too much sense. That would leave TT driving Staal's line.

It just makes too much sense to play him with Aho. I just cannot see him playing with Staal or Haula. But I'll agree, promising first line minutes is not the Canes or RBA way.
 

Vagrant

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to me, the trade that has always been there with winnipeg revolves around faulk for ehlers. there's no chance they're giving us laine and in my estimation there's precious little chance (pun intended) that he's not a jet at least for one more contract.

faulk and mcginn for ehlers, move tvr to the ltir and you're cap compliant.
 

My Special Purpose

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Apr 8, 2008
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Vegas off the board at number seven. We are six or higher.

7. Vegas Golden Knights
Projected points: 100.1 points
Playoff chances: 88 percent
Stanley Cup chances: 8 percent

That also means we're projected over 100 points and a virtual lock for the playoffs. I'm starting to get nervous.

Also, we're not No. 1:
Vegas has a 31 percent chance of making it to the conference final, which trails only the league’s top projected team, (spoiler alert) the Tampa Bay Lightning.
 

TheReelChuckFletcher

Former TheRillestPaulFenton; Harverd Alum
Jun 30, 2011
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7. Vegas Golden Knights
Projected points: 100.1 points
Playoff chances: 88 percent
Stanley Cup chances: 8 percent

That also means we're projected over 100 points and a virtual lock for the playoffs. I'm starting to get nervous.

I think that Jake Gardiner moves the needle far more than people on this board are giving credit for. It's the kind of move that turns our defense from elite (last year) to the best in the league, which is often a bigger jump than going from great to elite.
 

My Special Purpose

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I think that Jake Gardiner moves the needle far more than people on this board are giving credit for. It's the kind of move that turns our defense from elite (last year) to the best in the league, which is often a bigger jump than going from great to elite.

Again, I agree that Gardiner moves the needle and is the reason we're a bit higher than early previews had us. But again, I disagree as to why. I think Gardiner makes us a better team, and helps improve the power play and the speed/transition game. I don't think it has anything to do with changing our defense's title from one thing to another. For one, our defense wasn't elite last year. For another, our defense isn't the best in the league now. It's a team game and Gardiner makes us a better team.
 
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Jul 18, 2010
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7. Vegas Golden Knights
Projected points: 100.1 points
Playoff chances: 88 percent
Stanley Cup chances: 8 percent

That also means we're projected over 100 points and a virtual lock for the playoffs. I'm starting to get nervous.

Also, we're not No. 1:

If you haven’t listened to the Tulsky podcast yet, do so. He says people don’t realize how good this roster is yet. I believe him.
 

My Special Purpose

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If you haven’t listened to the Tulsky podcast yet, do so. He says people don’t realize how good this roster is yet. I believe him.

Considering half the roster is busts and/or underperforming so far according to the board, I believe him too

Oh, I believe him. I'm beyond sold. But we do have some work to do. It's still up to the coaching staff to find the right way to deploy all the weapons. Our first attempt was a total dud. Now Brindy has to decide if it was a personnel issue or a rustiness issue. It's a tough balancing act in only three weeks. This league comes at you fast, and you don't have a lot of time to adjust. I think Brindy saw that last year when he basically punted with the power play. Hopefully, with a full season and a playoff run under his belt, he'll have sorted out when and how to make changes on the fly.

The talent is definitely there to be elite. But it plain takes time to adjust to new players (Haula, Dzingel, Gardiner, Reimer). Hell, Slavin and Hamilton are still figuring out how to best play together and they've had most of a season. The pressure is on. We play nine games in the first 16 days of the season, so getting all these new guys -- and semi-new guys -- on the same page from Day 1 is going to be a challenge. Hopefully, they're working a lot of this out in practice. That's what it's for, after all.
 

Highest Boss

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Jan 15, 2014
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That Tulsky interview is fire.

Tulsky is an interesting guy which I think makes him perfect for this org. I would love to see the interaction between him and Dundon. I also think it's interesting that he's one of a few holdovers from the past regime and he seems content.

> is there anyone in the public analytics community that you read?
>> i read a lot of things
> so no one you want to shout out?
>> not until i hire them
 
Jul 18, 2010
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Again, I agree that Gardiner moves the needle and is the reason we're a bit higher than early previews had us. But again, I disagree as to why. I think Gardiner makes us a better team, and helps improve the power play and the speed/transition game. I don't think it has anything to do with changing our defense's title from one thing to another. For one, our defense wasn't elite last year. For another, our defense isn't the best in the league now. It's a team game and Gardiner makes us a better team.

Welp. Dom’s projection for us is finally out. And he’s got us with the best defense in the league. He’s got Slavin - Hamilton as the league’s best pairing, and Gardiner - Pesce as the league’s 6th best pairing. No joke, we have two defensive pairings in the top 6 in the league per his model.
 

bleedgreen

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Welp. Dom’s projection for us is finally out. And he’s got us with the best defense in the league. He’s got Slavin - Hamilton as the league’s best pairing, and Gardiner - Pesce as the league’s 6th best pairing. No joke, we have two defensive pairings in the top 6 in the league per his model.
We should be up there on paper. That assessment is eye roll worthy though. I’ve never seen Slavin look more confused than when he’s playing with Dougie. I know the analytics say it worked great but I just didn’t see it. They are both good at getting the puck out of the zone, which I know is a big part of the stats but in their end they misplay off each other....frequently.
 

Svechhammer

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Love the comments on that article that just go in to crap on analytics because the stats don't conform to their beliefs.
 
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