2019/20 Roster Thread XXX - AKA the Ghost Thread

[Ghosts Beer]

What else are we supposed to conclude when people are criticizing Hagg and you hop in with single stats trying to show Hagg is better than Ghost?

Huh? Someone asked ITT, “Can someone wrangle up the advanced stats on our d-men” & I asked which ones & posted the 3 most commonly cited with d-men.

In your conspiratorial world, where you tell other people what they think based on your own projections, you have twisted my simple response to a question, providing nothing but the data he asked for, as some kind of unsolicited argument that Hagg is better than Ghost. That’s a form of derangement syndrome.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Huh? Someone asked ITT, “Can someone wrangle up the advanced stats on our d-men” & I asked which ones & posted the 3 most commonly cited with d-men.

In your conspiratorial world, where you tell other people what they think based on your own projections, you have twisted my simple response to a question, providing nothing but the data he asked for, as some kind of unsolicited argument that Hagg is better than Ghost. That’s a form of derangement syndrome.

Over the course of the last week you've made posts directly comparing Ghost and Hagg showing Hagg outperforming Ghost. I questioned what you're trying to show, exactly, each time and you refused to answer.

If you were trying to communicate anything besides "Hagg is better than Ghost" then you need to be better at communicating. Never mind that it fits perfectly in your recent narrative that Ghost is awful and the team is better without him while you note that the team has been winning with Hagg in, among various other pro-Hagg/Anti-Ghost points. Don't get indignant at me for reading the obvious point in a message as written (especially within the context of your greater body of work), ask you to clarify, and then have you refuse to clarify. Are you choosing to selectively forget what you post?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Playing his best hockey doesn't mean **** if he's still the 7th best guy on the roster....

Did I say it did? It was just an observation. It’s still the tallest building in Topeka. But some people can’t handle any variation of their black & white opinions & lazily categorize any differing viewpoints as only possibly created for the bald purpose of being “contrarian.” It really is the height of egocentricity.

 

[dragonoffrost]

Did I say it did? It was just an observation. It’s still the tallest building in Topeka. But some people can’t handle any variation of their black & white opinions & lazily categorize any differing viewpoints as only possibly created for the bald purpose of being “contrarian.” It really is the height of egocentricity.

The observation is useless. He needs to be in the press box and not playing is the point everyone else is making. 7th best means you don't play if there are 6 spots.

 

[TB87]

It clearly doesn’t help for me to repeat “Ghost is better than Hagg” & “Hagg stinks” for the thousandth time because you’re one of those people who ignore what people actually say & instead tell them what they think.

*I meant to respond to a different post....the one where you asked if I thought he's playing his best hockey of his career. My bad*



PIT game coming out of the break was probably his best game of the season. Otherwise, he's just been his normal middling self. Multiple times per game he'll allow an entry against and not even try to close the gap...which has led to numerous offensive zone cycles & OZ time for the opposition. He's been fortunate in that regard in not getting burned for goals against. The other defenseman on the team at least attempt to close those gaps in those situations.

He's still been slow on puck retrievals, overly deferential to his partner on breakouts, activating in OZ and just parking himself deep in the zone (instead of rotating back to the point when it's clear he's gotta get back), & he's reacting to the flow of play instead of asserting himself into the flow of play (indicative of a hockey sense deficiency).

Areas where he has shown growth this season: More hits separating players from pucks, and winning more 50/50 battles. Outside of that, it's just been more of the same from Bobby Two Hits.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

For a brief period of time, it appears that this thread will soon result in a Myers vs Hagg discussion instead of a Ghost vs Hagg discussion.

Not sure which is better.

Be prepared for Myers to sit when Ghost comes back. I can see why they'd sit Myers instead of Hagg, but I certainly don't agree with it.

Hagg was a clear press box body coming into the season, battling Morin for the #7 spot. Myers isn't impressing the coaches, who are distracted by the warts and ignoring the potential, while at the same time ignoring Hagg's warts and focusing on his low reward impact.

Frustrating.

 

[Tripod]

Hagg's "best hockey of his career"(last 6 games):

63 shot attempts for, 92 against
2.48 xGF, 3.44 xGA
29 scoring chances for, 38 against

Boy...that sure does scream "keep playing him!".

 

[Striiker]

If Hagg stays in I don't want to hear any white knights complaining about the coaches being called "stupid", "dumb", or "incompetent".

 

[Ghosts Beer]

So you are saying those stats are wrong or don't mean anything and Myers is playing poorly....and also saying Hagg is playing well, correct?

1. You used CF% as a definitive player rating system, which it is absolutely not. Higher CF% =/= better performance. Do you think Jordan Weal was the Flyers’ best player last season?

2. I made no comparisons of Hagg vs. Myers or Hagg vs. Ghost. That’s you & others pretending I did.

3. Why do I need to repeat my words? You can’t go back a couple posts & re-read them?

The problem is that you & others *desperately* want to read things into my words that aren’t there.

 

[Starat327]

Disengage people. I'm all for meaningful discussion. But were past that point now. We've moved to discussion with a clear bias. Theres literally nothing to be gained here, and obviously nothing will be corrected.

 

[Tripod]

1. You used CF% as a definitive player rating system, which it is absolutely not. Higher CF% =/= better performance. Do you think Jordan Weal was the Flyers’ best player last season?

2. I made no comparisons of Hagg vs. Myers or Hagg vs. Ghost. That’s you & others pretending I did.

3. Why do I need to repeat my words? You can’t go back a couple posts & re-read them?

The problem is that you & others *desperately* want to read things into my words that aren’t there.

I showed CF% because in LOTS of thos games, Myers has a WAY better result....like a 20% swing. That matters....well...except to you.

You made no comparison....except to say that Myers is not playing well and Hagg is playing the best hockey of his career.

How about this very straight forward question so no one can say you are saying one thing or another....when Ghost is healthy, who would you sit?

 

[Prongo]

Love when I’m lost on twitter with people talking about Couts for Eichel trade scenario. All because one dude wrote on a piss colored piece of loose leaf. In a vacuum trades almost early happen, especially when you take a look at the teams perspective and where they are trying to go.

now, if you want to talk Pietrangelo coming here via feee agency lets get it. Or trading for my boy Johnny Hockey.

 

[Curufinwe]

Myers has played 35/42 games at 16:41 since Fletcher called him up.

24/42 games at 15:14 for Hagg.

NHL.com Stats

 

[TB87]

Ghost....What are people thinking the odds are that he'll actually get traded (or stay with the team) this season?

 

[Prongo]

Love when I’m lost on twitter with people talking about Couts for Eichel trade scenario. All because one dude wrote on a piss colored piece of loose leaf. In a vacuum trades almost early happen, especially when you take a look at the teams perspective and where they are trying to go.

now, if you want to talk Pietrangelo coming here via feee agency lets get it. Or trading for my boy Johnny Hockey.

Jesus Christ I’m like Eskin with this shit post

 

[Prongo]

Ghost....What are people thinking the odds are that he'll actually get traded (or stay with the team) this season?

1/13th of a chance

 

[Starat327]

Ghost....What are people thinking the odds are that he'll actually get traded (or stay with the team) this season?

I'd think any Ghost move is held til this offseason, where it's still a large mistake. My hope is they are smart and move him formed exempt help, and not some aging vet, but I have little faith in Fletcher to actually make that happen, so I'm fully expecting Ghost for David Backes because "be a f***ing flyer" and "vet 3c help".

 

[flyersnorth]

I'd think any Ghost move is held til this offseason, where it's still a large mistake. My hope is they are smart and move him formed exempt help, and not some aging vet, but I have little faith in Fletcher to actually make that happen, so I'm fully expecting Ghost for David Backes because "be a ****ing flyer" and "vet 3c help".

His quotes are exactly the opposite of what you suggest... so that's positive.

 

[Striiker]

His quotes are exactly the opposite of what you suggest... so that's positive.

People were really liking his quotes before he signed Stewart too.

 

[PhlthyRich]

Ghost....What are people thinking the odds are that he'll actually get traded (or stay with the team) this season?

I think it's 30% chance he's traded. We certainly aren't going to trade him just for the sake of making a trade or cap relief. There's nothing wrong with having 7 playable dmen. I guess you could swap dmen in and out depending on the roster make up of the opponent. I do think AV/Chuck will give Ghost every opportunity to play to prove his worth. Whether that's worth for our team or for another team if a trade is presented.

 

[Curufinwe]

I'd think any Ghost move is held til this offseason, where it's still a large mistake. My hope is they are smart and move him formed exempt help, and not some aging vet, but I have little faith in Fletcher to actually make that happen, so I'm fully expecting Ghost for David Backes because "be a ****ing flyer" and "vet 3c help".

That would be almost as bad as the Gudas for Niskanen trade that ruined this season.

 

[Tripod]

Ghost....What are people thinking the odds are that he'll actually get traded (or stay with the team) this season?

I think it's 50/50 now.

Possibly the recent injuries to Ghost and Braun give them reason to no trade away D depth. But they do lots of things that make no sense so trying to predict is really hard.

But I don't think Ghost is on our team to start next season.

 

[Curufinwe]

I think it's 30% chance he's traded. We certainly aren't going to trade him just for the sake of making a trade or cap relief. There's nothing wrong with having 7 playable dmen. I guess you could swap dmen in and out depending on the roster make up of the opponent. I do think AV/Chuck will give Ghost every opportunity to play to prove his worth. Whether that's worth for our team or for another team if a trade is presented.

There's no better way to submarine a playoff push than by depleting your depth on defense, which is what Ghost for a forward would do.

If you trade Ghost and then a top 3 dman gets hurt, it would not be pretty.

Sanheim-Niskanen
Hagg-Braun
Friedman-Myers
Welinski

 

[PhlthyRich]

There's no better way to submarine a playoff push than by depleting your depth on defense, which is what Ghost for a forward would do.

plus, we have a few potential forward additions that are all internal: Patrick (highly unlikely), Frost who I believe hasn't been called up so he can focus on the little things and be more ready come playoff stretch time, and maybe even one of Allison or Lacynski when their college season concludes. The last two aren't the level of forward you'd get for Ghost, but they could be nice bottom 6 additions

 

[Beef Invictus]

There's no better way to submarine a playoff push than by depleting your depth on defense, which is what Ghost for a forward would do.

If you trade Ghost and then a top 3 dman gets hurt, it would not be pretty.

Sanheim-Niskanen
Hagg-Braun
Friedman-Myers
Welinski

I guess the upside of such a trade is that we'd be able to resign ourselves to the fact that no matter who is running the show, the Flyers are forever the Flyers and will never win again.