2018 NHL Entry Draft Thread (Less then 24 Hours Edition)

[WeThreeKings]

And what Zadina did with his opportunity was even more impressive. Did you guys not watch the Czech/Canada game? Canada couldn't stop him (though obviously Canada was much better overall)

Five of 7 goals were on a man advantage (one empty net).. only two (against Canada) he created himself. The second one was a terrible rebound by the goalie.

Zadina absolutely feasted on a good PP which featured two outstanding passers in Necas and Kaut.

If anything his WJC performance confirms that his effectiveness level requires playmaking talent around him to unlock his true potential.

 

[Runner77]

How about trading one of our 2nd to trade up to 2nd overall and select Svechnikov?

Liking the idea but don't know if a 2nd would be enough to entice them.

 

[Mrb1p]

And that hes going to be a deadly weapon on the PP.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Let's also confirm that Svech had 9/10 scouts put him at #2 in McKenzie's rankings. If you extrapolate that, only 3 teams in the league disagree, or 10% that Svech isn't #2. That's like the percentage of flat earthers in the world.

What's the gap between Laine and PLD? Today vs 2016 when they were drafted? Pretty sure nobody had PLD ranked ahead of Laine back when. Heck, most had PLD ranked 4th from what I remember.

My point is Svechnikov is the 2nd ranked but Zadina is not significantly behind. Both of these kids can score goals and have proven that in their draft year. Svechnikov is definitely trending better today for sure though!

 

[Andrei79]

lol. Do you have any material to support your opinion or are you going to use this pointless card again? Not my problem if you can't debate and if you can't handle it when someone has a different opinion than you do.

Not in any way interested in getting into this.

I want a good discussion. Can you further your point, relating to my previous post on uneven opportunities at the WJC, or not?

 

[Runner77]

I just don't see any massive problems with his skating, he doesn't fly like McDavid/Mackinnon but he can skate, and is only 17y(still).

Is Kotkaniemi the youngest birthday in the draft? And how much leeway would you guys afford in terms of greater potential for growth on account of his young age vs. the other top prospects who are older?

 

[Andrei79]

Is Kotkaniemi the youngest birthday in the draft? And how much leeway would you guys afford in terms of greater potential for growth on account of his young age vs. the other top prospects who are older?

It's important. For Boqvist as well. A one year difference in development at that age is significant.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Not in any way interested in getting into this.

I want a good discussion. Can you further your point, relating to my previous post on uneven opportunities at the WJC, or not?

We were having a good discussion until you brought up BS where I am not aloud to disagree with you! When we got to a standstill, you pretended that your opinion > my opinion and it's foolish to argue against you. Come on man.

 

[Runner77]

BS. ...

Come on man, that's just BS. ...

I've read W3K long enough to know that he doesn't "BS".

Do you think it might be possible for you to make your point without resorting to this type of confrontational qualifier? I respect your points and enjoy reading you but that kind of term is really not justified with a poster who always provides ample justification and reasonable arguments to support his points. Thanks in advance for considering my request.

 

[Runner77]

Yes he needs to improve, or should improve, but not by a mile or anything. A fair assumption/expectation should be that he will improve. Given his age/development/group behind him. His father is a Liiga coach and I believe they have a good idea of where he is and where he needs to get.

I believe a lot of that(bolded) is due to him playing in Europe, he's not putting up +ppg numbers in juniors, he's putting up .5ppg in Liiga as a rookie, tougher to create hype like that. If he was in juniors and putting up +ppg with a 2way game and a 6'2 frame with this u18 performance do you think he would be seen atleast as a top5 pick?

I don't know where he should go, but I belive his skating issues are made bigger than they are, the overall feeling I get after reading threads.

While you may not know specifically where he should rank, would you be prepared to say that anywhere between 3 and 7 is plausible or far-fetched?

 

[Andrei79]

We were having a good discussion until you brought up BS where I am not aloud to disagree with you! When we got to a standstill, you pretended that your opinion > my opinion and it's foolish to argue against you. Come on man.

Like I said, I'm not interested in this.

I'm interested in how you relate Zadina's to Tkachuk's production, as well as their usage (including the effect their centers had on said production ), especially in regards to Svechnikov's own usage on that Russian team.

 

[Habs76]

I believe he has signed with an SHL team (Orebro) for the next season, of course if an NHL team comes around knocking he would probably leave.

Drafted =/= contract. We would be acquiring his rights if we picked him.

 

[Saxon]

Is Kotkaniemi the youngest birthday in the draft? And how much leeway would you guys afford in terms of greater potential for growth on account of his young age vs. the other top prospects who are older?

Given how much he grew this year alone, I'd say he's still growing relatively quickly.

 

[Mrb1p]

Is Kotkaniemi the youngest birthday in the draft? And how much leeway would you guys afford in terms of greater potential for growth on account of his young age vs. the other top prospects who are older?

Hes not the youngest but hes pretty young and would be eligible for the next draft with just 2 more months i believe.

His age doesnt matter much to me, its the way he progressed through the year. He went from showing hints to doing it in a matter of months.

 

[Habs76]

I wonder if NYI would entertain a 10 + 12 for 3 deal

 

[Runner77]

Listening to former head scout Alain Chainey on 91.9FM, he's suggesting like several have offered here, a swap with a team that owns two first rounders or a team who missed out on the player they wanted in the first round and use two of the 2nd rounders in a deal to pick up that extra first rounder. Nothing earth-shattering but he's saying that selling off the top 3 overall pick to take lower picks is not the best move since the player being selected at that slot is likely to be a high level performer.

His approach is to use the 4 2nd rounders for leverage to move up as it's a rare thing for an organization to be able to count on so many picks in the 2nd.

He spoke to other scouts who see Zadina very highly. However, he's also confirming that some of his sources are saying that Carolina has high interest in Zadina and may go for him based on his connection with Necas. That possibility is very real.

 

[Habs76]

Is Kotkaniemi the youngest birthday in the draft? And how much leeway would you guys afford in terms of greater potential for growth on account of his young age vs. the other top prospects who are older?

The youngest players in the draft are born on September 15th, 2000. Jesperi is born Aug 6.

 

[Runner77]

How about Pacioretty for NYI 2 first round picks?.....then draft Kotkaniemi AND Valeno......just a thought.

Not hoping for this.....more of a discussion/get a feel for what posters would like to see

Hope is not a plan. If the Isles would ever contemplate that, their GM should get fired on the spot. There is no way Pacioretty is worth that. Maybe one of the 2 picks could be in play with a signed Pacioretty and another asset involved, but then again, why would the Isles want Pacioretty?

 

[Redux91]

Because you can't prorate stats to be a sure thing over a 82 game schedule. How about Zadina's 7 goals in 7 games in the U20 World Juniors while Svechnikov scored 2 in 7 games? The gap between these two is not significant.

you keep saying svech scored 2 goals at the WJC but he actually didnt lol, he finished 5 GP 0 g 5 a 5 pts, not sure where eliteprospects is getting those 2 extra gp and 2 goals but it was not at the U20

 

[Habs76]

Listening to former head scout Alain Chenier on 91.9FM, he's suggesting like several have offered here, a swap with a team that owns two first rounders or a team who missed out on the player they wanted in the first round and use two of the 2nd rounders in a deal to pick up that extra first rounder. Nothing earth-shattering but he's saying that selling off the top 3 overall pick to take lower picks is not the best move since the player being selected at that slot is likely to be a high level performer.

His approach is to use the 4 2nd rounders for leverage to move up as it's a rare thing for an organization to be able to count on so many picks in the 2nd.

He spoke to other recuriters who see Zadina very highly. However, he's also confirming that some of his sources are saying that Carolina has high interest in Zadina and may go for him based on his connection with Necas. That possibility is very real.

Who is Alain Chenier?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Like I said, I'm not interested in this.

I'm interested in how you relate Zadina's to Tkachuk's production, as well as their usage (including the effect their centers had on said production ), especially in regards to Svechnikov's own usage on that Russian team.

Sorry, I didn't relate Zadina to Tkachuk. Wasn't that you? I showed you an example of Zadina's production vs Svechnikov at the worlds and prospects game and how I feel the gap between them is not significant. Players stats do change in different leagues and tournaments where they play with different players. Example: Tkachuk. He had a great world juniors but his NCAA year is not that impressive. Does that mean I think Tkachuk is as good as Zadina? NO! The world Juniors and prospects game was just an example on how stats can change.

You say your not interested but you were the one who got all tied up in a knot when I disagreed with you. I'm totally fine with you disagreeing but I am not ok with you thinking that it's not reasonable to disagree with you. You are correct, you should not be interested in that but you did try to use that card.

 

[NotProkofievian]

It's important. For Boqvist as well. A one year difference in development at that age is significant. Almost as much as the gap between Svechnikov and Zadina.

Also, it's important to pay attention to from a skills development point of view: not just physical maturity. For example, the late birthdays go through the USNTDP a year early. So, while Brady Tkachuk was young for the U18 program last year, he had still gone through his year of midget AAA, the u17 program, and the u18 program. He was in a ''normal'' draft eligible state last season. Developmentally speaking, this year is more like a D+1 year for him.

For Zadina, he has played his U18 year, his U20 year, his Czech Extraliga year, and now a year in the CHL. Rantanen had played Junior B, Junior A, a Liiga year, and yet another Liiga year.

 

[Habs Halifax]

you keep saying svech scored 2 goals at the WJC but he actually didnt lol, he finished 5 GP 0 g 5 a 5 pts, not sure where eliteprospects is getting those 2 extra gp and 2 goals but it was not at the U20

OK. Good pick up!

What I remember is Zadina shined and Svechnikov was not talked about too much. The stats example was pulled from elite prospects pretty quick. It was an example where Zadina scored more goals in the same tournaments but I still think Svechnikov is ahead of him at this stage.

The debate is I think the gap between the two is not significant.

 

[Elfward7]

What would a Zadina - Galchenyuk - Scherbak line look like?

I wonder.

 

[le_sean]

I'm not claiming Kotkaniemi is Barkov, so I have no idea what your point is here. If Jesperi accomplished what Barkov did, we wouldn't be debating anything: he'd be closer to #2 than #3. But we should be precise about what Jesperi Kotkaniemi did this year: his even strength production was better than Rantanen's, better than Puljujärvi's, better than Laine's. He didn't just cobble together a few points, he did very well, historically speaking..

I have to compare him to Barkov because there’s no other 1C that recently played in Finland to compare him to.

It’s also unfair to compare him to Laine and Pulju. Those two were on better teams and got less icetime. But internationally they were much better than Kotkaniemi and they didn’t disappear in the Finnish playoffs.