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GDT: 2018 Free Agency: Jay Beagle 4 x 3M, Antoine Roussel 4 x 3.25M, both w/ limited NTCs

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Jimbo57 said:
Contrary to the some of the opinions in here, Beagle is not a plug. He is one of the top face off guys in the league, excels at killing penalties, and can provide some C depth on a team that isnt exactly deep down the middle. Horvat will be freed up and can be put in a more offensive role, and Gaudette can be sheltered. He can either make Sutter redundant, or be flipped at a future trade deadline because he has proven that he can be a valuable contributor to a cup winning team.

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hes not good at hockey anymore
 
lindgren said:
Making Sutter redundant isn't a good thing unless the team trades Sutter, and there's been no hint that Benning plans to do so. Whether Beagle can be flipped or not depends in part on the contract, and the sings, at least, are discouraging. In the meantime, if Sutter isn't traded, the Canucks will have two centres who are exclusively defensive specialists.

That's not saying Beagle is a plug. It's saying he isn't a fit. He doesn't score. He doesn't set up his teammates. He's not a potential centre on a line with Pettersson. As CanucksArmy has pointed out, as Pass it to Bulis has pointed out, as others have pointed out, he doesn't make sense for the Canucks. For a team that needs a fourth line defensive specialist, sure. That's not what the Canucks need.

I've asked this question before, with no response from those defending the idea of signing Beagle. With Beagle and Sutter as two of the team's centres, what do you think the chances are of the Canucks improving in the coming season from their woefully low-scoring results of last year?
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But once you factor in the annual spend to the cap directive from Mr Aquilini...suddenly it all begins to make sense.
 
I don’t mind these moves IF we end up jettisoning a similar player on our team

Exit Sutter enter Beagle - acquire an asset parallel move
Exit Gagner/Granlund/Gaunce/ enter Roussel - acquire another asset and improve upon that position
Sign deHaan exit Gudbranson acquire another asset and improve the position
Trade Tanev for picks/prospects
Acquire a cap dump and a receive a draft pick
Sign an under valued player - pump and dump at the deadline, acquire a pick
Waiver wire predator.......snag a skilled player who needs an opportunity, not a 4th line plug like McWhatshisface, dalphe or Dowd

Draft 2-1sts 2-2nds 3-3rds 2-4ths


Wow this GMing thing is pretty easy
 
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lindgren said:
Pass it to Bulis chimes in on the redundancy of Beagle:

"Beagle is also, in some ways, a redundant player. He and Brandon Sutter are remarkably similar, though Sutter has a little more offensive upside and has put up better possession numbers given similar usage. But both are defence-first centres that soak up defensive zone faceoffs and eat up minutes on the penalty kill."

Canucks frontrunners to sign Jay Beagle, according to reports
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Given that Roussel takes so many undisciplined minors having 2 defensive PK specialist centres is starting to seem like a good idea.
 
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iceburg said:
Quite happy if the sign Beagle and trade Sutter...
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That's how I see it. Sign Beagle and as soon as Gaudette or Pettersson show capable of taking over a middle six center spot ship out Sutter. If they show that capability early then there's probably going to be some team starting the season that missed out on FA/trade that will need a reliable center and would flip you some good draft picks for Sutter.

What you don't want is to still have Beagle+Sutter 2-3 years down the road. With Benning though who knows what you're going to get... but at least we don't have Willie still who thought Sutter is a top line player.
 
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lindgren said:
Making Sutter redundant isn't a good thing unless the team trades Sutter, and there's been no hint that Benning plans to do so. Whether Beagle can be flipped or not depends in part on the contract, and the sings, at least, are discouraging. In the meantime, if Sutter isn't traded, the Canucks will have two centres who are exclusively defensive specialists.

That's not saying Beagle is a plug. It's saying he isn't a fit. He doesn't score. He doesn't set up his teammates. He's not a potential centre on a line with Pettersson. As CanucksArmy has pointed out, as Pass it to Bulis has pointed out, as others have pointed out, he doesn't make sense for the Canucks. For a team that needs a fourth line defensive specialist, sure. That's not what the Canucks need.

I've asked this question before, with no response from those defending the idea of signing Beagle. With Beagle and Sutter as two of the team's centres, what do you think the chances are of the Canucks improving in the coming season from their woefully low-scoring results of last year?
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Assuming they do sign him, we don’t know what they will do with Sutter. You are assuming he won’t be moved. You are guessing. All I’m saying is this move will give them the option of either flipping beagle or moving Sutter at some point.

Will the team be better with two defensive centers? Gaudette is unproven. If gaunce gets sent down to the ahl nobody would blink. In other words he’s better than what we have now In the bottom 6. Beagle is one of the top face off guys in the nhl. He can free up Bo from killing penalties and from getting mired in d zone draws.

If they sign this guy it gives them options and I don’t think it’s necessary to panic this early in the summer.

There will be a market for a proven guy like this at the next two trade deadlines so I’m not that worried if he does get signed as long as it’s less than 4 years
 
I was on the support of signing Beagle before but I wanted it a 2 year deal. As soon as I hear the words “bidding war” for a 4C that should be the cue to get the hell out of those negotiations.

Even worse Rousell on a 4 year deal? That’s insane. I know he LW depth is bad but that does literally nothing to help it.

Either of these guys are not worth getting into a bidding war over, at least not in getting term. Overpay on AAV for 2 years and if they don’t budge just wait a week and get the leftovers on 1 year deals.
 
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I think it's relevant to point out here that this is more or less what derailed Boston after their Cup run. Too much cap space spent on bottom six players forcing them to trade out guys like Kessel and Seguin when it was their time to get paid.
 
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Fact of the matter is that Benning will not be able to entice these "slightly in demand" players like Beagle and Roussell to come to Vancouver unless he offers 4 years. These are not players like Gagner and Del Zotto of whom there was no demand.

Bottom line is that the ridiculousness continues. If the team wants grit, sign Archibald. You can find replacement level agitator or 4th line centre types all over the place. Benning just continues to vastly overvalue these types of players. The pro-scouting errors of this administration are egregious and appear to have been lessons that have not been learned.

Disappointed here. Not surprised though.
 
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Jimbo57 said:
Assuming they do sign him, we don’t know what they will do with Sutter. You are assuming he won’t be moved. You are guessing. All I’m saying is this move will give them the option of either flipping beagle or moving Sutter at some point.

Will the team be better with two defensive centers? Gaudette is unproven. If gaunce gets sent down to the ahl nobody would blink. In other words he’s better than what we have now In the bottom 6. Beagle is one of the top face off guys in the nhl. He can free up Bo from killing penalties and from getting mired in d zone draws.

If they sign this guy it gives them options and I don’t think it’s necessary to panic this early in the summer.

There will be a market for a proven guy like this at the next two trade deadlines so I’m not that worried if he does get signed as long as it’s less than 4 years
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I'm not panicking. I'm saying it's a bad idea. If they trade Sutter for any return at all -- a fifth round draft pick, say -- then it's a good idea. If they then also trade Beagle at the deadline, also for any kind of pick, then it's an even better idea. If they don't trade Sutter and don't trade Beagle, then it's a very bad idea.

I'm predicting, which is different from assuming, that if they sign Beagle they won't succeed in trading either player this season, and they'll score even fewer goals than they did last year, and development of prospects, particularly Pettersson, will be delayed: he won't get to play centre and he won't play wing with a centre who can think the game offensively. That's my prediction.

If you're predicting that a Beagle signing will lead to a trade, and, if not, that they'll somehow find a way to make things work with two defensive specialists down the middle, well, we simply disagree. I think that my prediction is much more plausible, given Benning's record and given what these players are like on the ice. But it doesn't make me angry that we disagree; we'll simply have to wait and see.
 
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Buck Dancer said:
Fact of the matter is that Benning will not be able to entice these "slightly in demand" players like Beagle and Roussell to come to Vancouver unless he offers 4 years. These are not players like Gagner and Del Zotto of whom there was no demand.

Bottom line is that the ridiculousness continues. If the team wants grit, sign Archibald. You can find replacement level agitator or 4th line centre types all over the place. Benning just continues to vastly overvalue these types of players. The pro-scouting errors of this administration are egregious and appear to have been lessons that have not been learned.

Disappointed here. Not surprised though.
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If he can't entice them to come here then move on to someone else. As MS mentioned, Archibald would be much better at $650k than Roussel at over $3M per for 4 years. It's not even close.
 
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y2kcanucks said:
If he can't entice them to come here then move on to someone else. As MS mentioned, Archibald would be much better at $650k than Roussel at over $3M per for 4 years. It's not even close.
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100% agree. He doesn't get it though. He's an idiot.

This narrative that they will sign Beagle to enable them to trade Sutter makes me laugh. They won't trade Sutter - they'll just carry both of these overpaid bottom 6 vets at the detriment of the development of a younger player.

Moronic.
 
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MS said:
They aren't signing Beagle to trade Sutter.

Anyone thinking this is a possibility hasn't been following this team and how they go about their business well enough over the past 4 years.

Brandon Sutter is going nowhere.
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To them Brandon Sutter is the pinnacle of everything they love in a hockey player. Forget that he is not that good of a player - he's a nice guy who hails from an Alberta Farm, hence he knows how to play the "right way."
 
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Jimbo57 said:
Contrary to the some of the opinions in here, Beagle is not a plug. He is one of the top face off guys in the league, excels at killing penalties, and can provide some C depth on a team that isnt exactly deep down the middle. Horvat will be freed up and can be put in a more offensive role, and Gaudette can be sheltered. He can either make Sutter redundant, or be flipped at a future trade deadline because he has proven that he can be a valuable contributor to a cup winning team.

Click to expand...


McGuire also said the Gudbranson was a home run for the Canucks.
 
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McGuire is a dipshit

Craig Button and Ray Ferraro are my guys

I agree with about 98% of what Ray says.
 
If the Canucks sign Beagle and then trade Sutter for assets I will applaud Benning, but it's not happening, they're going to be ecstatic to have both of them on the team.
 
Why is your GM so adamant on signing bottom line guys instead of Tavares or Carlson? Terrible GM is terrible.
 
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