Prospect Info: 2017 NHL Draft / Pick #7 - Lias Andersson (C) - Part II

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don't think he was an off the board pick. Off the board is Calgary taking Jankowski or Arizona taking Wheeler. Andersson was rated in the 8-15 range by most lists I saw, so he may have been a slight reach but certainly not off the board.

People tend to take the public lists, or their own list, as the gospel but tend to forget there are 31 other lists that we almost never see -- the ones that really matter. McKenzie's list is always the most interesting for me because he's polling NHL scouts. The "5 out of 10 scouts had this guy rated in their top-5" snippets are always eye-opening. There's so much variation amongst teams that people just seem to ignore. The Rangers had Patrick, Pettersson, and Glass higher than Andersson on their list. So they obviously have an eye for talented players. If they were able to move up, or if Vegas or Vancouver went a different way, we could have very well ended up with one of those guys.

Now, what I will acknowledge is that the Rangers seem to put a premium on "tools" when it comes to amateur scouting. They like strong skaters, character players, guys with an elite shot, etc. Rarely do they seem to go with the "flashy" player. They seem to focus on the safer bet to make the NHL as opposed to the guy who might be a human highlight reel. I think a lot of that is a result of the way they ran their team for so long. They wanted to buy the talent and draft the filler and were very slow in changing their strategy. Kreider and Miller were safe bets to be 3rd liners in the NHL based on their size, skating, and gritty play. McIlrath was a safe bet had the league not pivoted away from that sort of player and he hadn't suffered the knee injuries. Skjei was a safe bet to be a 3rd pairing defensemen. They take these guys and then hope they take a step forward. It doesn't really lend itself to bagging elite talent, but you can't argue that they've managed to turn out a high number of solid NHL players.

I only see a couple of reoccurrences in our drafting and acquiring of prospects. Some of this also happens with the NHL club.

They like to acquire specific types of defenders. Big, strong, good skating and puck moving. They like this base. You mention Skjei, and I think its a good example. McDonagh is an example of what can happen when this type of player develops really well.

They do like "character" guys, and that is something that they might try to acquire more than the player's value indicates they are worth. This is a harder skill to try to acquire, so there are probably fewer of these examples, but I think its something they look to acquire.

They like to acquire European prospects in pro environments. When acquiring NA's, its usually Americans.

When they have a high pick, they tend to pick players that the consensus has a fair amount lower than they did. Not hugely shocking picks, but players that you would've expected to go lower than the Rangers picked them.

 

[Tawnos]

When they have a high pick, they tend to pick players that the consensus has a fair amount lower than they did. Not hugely shocking picks, but players that you would've expected to go lower than the Rangers picked them.

Here's the problem with "the consensus." The rankings, for the most part, don't account for the majority of opinions among the people who scout professionally... because those scouts work for teams. Just for example, ISS employs 13 scouts in the US. How many US scouts are employed by teams league-wide? You're probably talking 2 times the number of scouts watching in the US that we never, ever hear from compared to the ones we do.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Here's the problem with "the consensus." The rankings, for the most part, don't account for the majority of opinions among the people who scout professionally... because those scouts work for teams. Just for example, ISS employs 13 scouts in the US. How many US scouts are employed by teams league-wide? You're probably talking 2 times the number of scouts watching in the US that we never, ever hear from compared to the ones we do.

The consensus is based on public rankings. Those public rankings had Michael Dal Colle top 5. Those public rankings aren't flawless

 

[SnowblindNYR]

The consensus is based on public rankings. Those public rankings had Michael Dal Colle top 5. Those public rankings aren't flawless

The only rankings that matter are Pavel Buchnevich's rankings.

 

[haohmaru]

Centers drafted 7th overall since 1980:

Schiefele
Skinner
Kadri
Colin Wilson
Voracek
Olesz
Lupul
Kris Beech
Malhotra
Erik Rasmussen
Shane Doan
Jason Arnott
Dan Woodley

Not exactly the who's who of generational centers or even 1st line players. Let's keep our expectations REALISTIC. Like I said, 10+ years as a top 9 center = Rangers WIN.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Centers drafted 7th overall since 1980:

Schiefele
Skinner
Kadri
Colin Wilson
Voracek
Olesz
Lupul
Kris Beech
Malhotra
Erik Rasmussen
Shane Doan
Jason Arnott
Dan Woodley

Not exactly the who's who of generational centers or even 1st line players. Let's keep our expectations REALISTIC. Like I said, 10+ years as a top 9 center = Rangers WIN.

The problem is the Lias haters cherry pick a couple of picks that might be better. But it's not like those picks were the only options. We had to not only not take Lias but picked the specific players that turned out to be good. Hell, those players haven't even done anything in the NHL either.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Well I was referring to your post in my answer so yes you’re included!

Your last paragraph is spot on with what I see in him. Good winger. Good on boards and puck battles great shot and great around the net. Middle 6 LW and hopefully wearing a C. That’s to me his upside.

He cannot play center in this league and be a driver of offense. It’s not going to happen. We may disagree on his puck possession clearly but I don’t think we disagree on his upside

Still disagree about playing C, and I’d bet he turns out similar to a Horvat or young Alex Steen.

 

[NYR713]

Centers drafted 7th overall since 1980:

Schiefele
Skinner
Kadri
Colin Wilson
Voracek
Olesz
Lupul
Kris Beech
Malhotra
Erik Rasmussen
Shane Doan
Jason Arnott
Dan Woodley

Not exactly the who's who of generational centers or even 1st line players. Let's keep our expectations REALISTIC. Like I said, 10+ years as a top 9 center = Rangers WIN.

I always felt a decent comparison to look for is Kadri. Solid 2-way with a little grit and can produce decent offense.

 

[Alluckks]

And it's really only two posters making it that way.

(By the way, I don't have a problem with those posters having a different viewpoint. I think it's good to see.... but at some point the discussion has to be given a rest, right? We can wait to see how he performs this year instead of re-hashing the same draft discussion and D+1 discussion for the 93 millionth time... we don't HAVE to talk about this anymore. I'm as guilty as anyone, but still)

I have those two posters on ignore - so it makes these "loops" really interesting lol

 

[EdJovanovski]

 

[Miamipuck]

I have those two posters on ignore - so it makes these "loops" really interesting lol

Same, it's tiring seeing the same drivel.

 

[Raspewtin]

"has girl name" is so not funny and is reminiscent of "lulz cindy crosby xDDD"

 

[EdJovanovski]

"has girl name" is so not funny and is reminiscent of "lulz cindy crosby xDDD"

I see I have struck a nerve with the commie

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

"has girl name" is so not funny and is reminiscent of "lulz cindy crosby xDDD"

I think you’re entirely missing the point.

Him having a “girl name” isn’t the joke, the joke is it being listed as a negative attribute.

Like, come on. How is this your response to that beautiful meme?

 

[Ori]

I see I have struck a nerve with the commie

Yes I had a good laugh, well done!

 

[ManUtdTobbe]

so I'm literally saying he projects as a third liner and I think that's a bad value for a 7th overall pick. for a year I was told no way he's going to be at worst a second line center. now I'm seeing more of a 7th overall pick shouldn't be considered with a top line ceiling???

that doesn't pencil boys. shouldn't be drafting guys 7th overall that don't AT LEAST have top end ceilings. most are now agreeing that he probably doesn't. well mittelstadt and vilardi and necas all have first line ceilings. Suzuki maybe too. for a franchise desperate for exactly that. top end players you shouldn't use your 7th overall pick on a guy that now your saying which I've been saying, NEVER projected as a top line player.

Lias has a top line ceiling and he's Always been projecting as a 2C. You are an uninformed, negative and extremely biased poster.

 

[ManUtdTobbe]

Anyone who looks at what Lias did in SuperElit, SHL and AHL as a teenager and claims he doesn't have top line upside is a terrible talent evaluator and should be completely ignored.

It's fine to Project him lower, but the numbers he produced definitely has him with top line upside, stop being dumb.

 

[Ori]

I hope they call him up in near future, and Quinn need some complete line changes in NHL, because Lias can finish plays and I`ve seen him doing exact that many times in Sweden and in international tournaments, and in our pre season this year.

 

[Kovalev27]

Lias has a top line ceiling and he's Always been projecting as a 2C. You are an uninformed, negative and extremely biased poster.

Oh stop yourself. He doesn’t have a top line ceiling No one has ever put him as a future 1C. And if you’ve watched him without the rose colored glasses on you’d admit that as well. Calling me a negative and biased poster is extremely childish.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Oh stop yourself. He doesn’t have a top line ceiling No one has ever put him as a future 1C. And if you’ve watched him without the rose colored glasses on you’d admit that as well. Calling me a negative and biased poster is extremely childish.

When it comes to Lias, you start at the conclusion and then work your way back to find things that support it.

 

[haohmaru]

Oh stop yourself. He doesn’t have a top line ceiling No one has ever put him as a future 1C. And if you’ve watched him without the rose colored glasses on you’d admit that as well. Calling me a negative and biased poster is extremely childish.

No one put Stepan as a future 1C either, yet, there he is.

I notice, curiously, that you didn't respond to the 38 year history of centers drafted 7th overall resulting in, pretty much, zero first line centers. Your expectations of the 7th OA are waaaaaaaay, no, waaaaaaaaaaay too high - particularly for a center which is clearly where the Rangers want to be strong and wanted a "sure thing".

He's a safe pick and the Rangers needed a guy with a good floor because they want to be strong down the middle. Andersson was about as safe a bet to make the NHL, and have a lengthy career there, as anyone on the board. You want to make the argument that they should've taken more of a chance and drafted someone with more "elite" upside that isn't a sure thing? I get that. Obviously, that's not what they wanted to do with that pick.

 

[Kovalev27]

Stepan shouldn’t be a first line center we just didn’t have a guy better. Stepan was an elite 2C though. Lias becoming Stepan would be amazing but I don’t see that. You have to be able to skate in this league now if you’re going to be a legit center. It all comes back to that for me.

 

[haohmaru]

Stepan shouldn’t be a first line center we just didn’t have a guy better. Stepan was an elite 2C though. Lias becoming Stepan would be amazing but I don’t see that. You have to be able to skate in this league now if you’re going to be a legit center. It all comes back to that for me.

Stepan was a 1C here and he's a 1C in Arizona. Low end 1C, but 1C nonetheless.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Stepan shouldn’t be a first line center we just didn’t have a guy better. Stepan was an elite 2C though. Lias becoming Stepan would be amazing but I don’t see that. You have to be able to skate in this league now if you’re going to be a legit center. It all comes back to that for me.

Lias' skating isn't worse than Stepan.

 

[ManUtdTobbe]

Oh stop yourself. He doesn’t have a top line ceiling No one has ever put him as a future 1C. And if you’ve watched him without the rose colored glasses on you’d admit that as well. Calling me a negative and biased poster is extremely childish.

Just use basic f***ing Point projections from his time in SuperElit, SHL and AHL... He clearly has top line ceiling. Calling you a negative and biased poster is just facts at this point.