Prospect Info: 2017 NHL Draft / Pick #7 - Lias Andersson (C) - Part II

[haohmaru]

The statement from Staal you quoted directly contradicts you.

How so?

 

[haohmaru]

Staal, at that moment, was not better than Stepan or Brassard. Should AV have played an inferior player over those two?

Based on his play in Carolina? Honestly, I don't know what the answer is. Actually, yes I do. They never should've traded for him in the first place but, since they did, they should've had a better plan than "well, he's not going to take Stepan or Brassard's job, and he's not really a 3C, so let's stick him on the wing"

Is AV part of the blame for that? I'd have to assume so since I assume he has input into trade acquisitions and, of course, lineups. I'm not saying it's ALL on AV. It's not. But he is certainly a part of that whole failure - as is Staal himself.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Based on his play in Carolina? Honestly, I don't know what the answer is. Actually, yes I do. They never should've traded for him in the first place but, since they did, they should've had a better plan than "well, he's not going to take Stepan or Brassard's job, and he's not really a 3C, so let's stick him on the wing"

Is AV part of the blame for that? I'd have to assume so since I assume he has input into trade acquisitions and, of course, lineups. I'm not saying it's ALL on AV. It's not. But he is certainly a part of that whole failure - as is Staal himself.

Staal had an awful season in Carolina, had an awful few weeks with us. If he was good enough, AV would have played him at center. He had a chance to earn a spot but apparently he did not. And whatever he did in Minnesota the next season is irrelevant because as mentioned by someone else earlier Staal had the entire off-season to get back to his old self. He was rejuvenated after a few months without playing games. You could argue an early exit by the Rangers gave Staal exactly what he needed.

 

[haohmaru]

Anyway, this isn't a Staal thread, it's an Andersson thread, so I'll stop talking about it. Water. Bridge. Under.

 

[Tawnos]

How so?

“I wasn’t taking the spots of the players who were having better seasons” and “It’s my fault I didn’t find a way to contribute” are directly in opposition to “the coach mis-used me” when the coach didn’t put him ahead of the players who were having better seasons because he wasn’t finding a way to contribute.

 

[haohmaru]

“I wasn’t taking the spots of the players who were having better seasons” and “It’s my fault I didn’t find a way to contribute” are directly in opposition to “the coach mis-used me” when the coach didn’t put him ahead of the players who were having better seasons because he wasn’t finding a way to contribute.

What you put in quotes is your interpretation of what he was trying to say which doesn't line up with my interpretation of it.

My interpretation of what he said is that his understanding of the trade is that he wasn't going to take somebody's job for the last 15 games of the season and they were going to find other ways for him to contribute to the team - which lines up precisely with what I was saying. They had no idea where to put him, didn't want to shake things up with the top 2, or 3 guys playing center in front of him, and really didn't have a plan that worked at all. That's on Gorton, AV, and even Staal.

We can interpret that differently and agree to disagree.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Considering how bad this team is, I find it surprising that the organization can't find meaningful NHL minutes for Andersson at this point in time.

 

[Tawnos]

What you put in quotes is your interpretation of what he was trying to say which doesn't line up with my interpretation of it.

My interpretation of what he said is that his understanding of the trade is that he wasn't going to take somebody's job for the last 15 games of the season and they were going to find other ways for him to contribute to the team - which lines up precisely with what I was saying. They had no idea where to put him, didn't want to shake things up with the top 2, or 3 guys playing center in front of him, and really didn't have a plan that worked at all. That's on Gorton, AV, and even Staal.

We can interpret that differently and agree to disagree.

No, what’s happening here is that you are spinning his words to fit your pre-conception and I’m taking his words at face value.

 

[mike14]

Considering how bad this team is, I find it surprising that the organization can't find meaningful NHL minutes for Andersson at this point in time.

I think they 'could' they chose not to with Chytil and Howden also needing to play centre (according to management). I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Lias up from around the 20 game mark assuming he isn't completely terrible for the Pack. This would have allowed Quinn to get a better feel for who he isn't interested in going forward

 

[haohmaru]

No, what’s happening here is that you are spinning his words to fit your pre-conception and I’m taking his words at face value.

No, you're spinning it too. Just agree to disagree and let's be done with it. I'm not going to agree with your "face value" interpretation because I don't believe it to be correct. Look at his possession numbers in Carolina before the trade, his uncharacteristically low shooting % the entire year and high danger shot attempts and then explain why he was a 3rd line winger on the Rangers. If that's the only spot they had for him, then they were stupid to trade for him - and that's on Gorton, AV, & Co.

 

[Tawnos]

No, you're spinning it too. Just agree to disagree and let's be done with it. I'm not going to agree with your "face value" interpretation because I don't believe it to be correct. Look at his possession numbers in Carolina before the trade, his uncharacteristically low shooting % the entire year and high danger shot attempts and then explain why he was a 3rd line winger on the Rangers. If that's the only spot they had for him, then they were stupid to trade for him - and that's on Gorton, AV, & Co.

You mean it’s all on Gorton.

And it doesn’t matter what role they put him in when he didn’t do well in that role. Perhaps, just perhaps, he would’ve gotten better opportunities if he had performed in the role they put him in. There was a little stretch where he had some chemistry with some players, but it didn’t last and he didn’t contribute with anything else. How do I know he didn’t contribute in the role? Well, if I weren’t confident in what I was watching at the time, he said so himself.

He said “it was up to me to find a way to fit in and contribute in other ways... and I didn’t feel like I did enough”

Saying what he said is what he said is not spinning.

But sure, let’s agree to disagree...

 

[Edge]

WELL THAT'S IT BOYS CLOSE UP SHOP THE DEBATE IS OVER ANDERSSON IS BETTER

Let’s be honest though, can you imagine the volumes written if this was posted about Andersson right now?

Dogs and cats living together. Mass hysteria.

 

[Edge]

Sure, but that's human nature. We tend to focus on the bad things and ignore the good, in my opinion because people expect positives to happen regardless of what else is going on. This goes for anything in life.

Eh, within reason. I think it’s one of those quirks that is magnified on HF.

While we often accuse the Rangers’ brass of having egos and thinking their the smartest guys in the room, in truth, it’s probably just as applicable to most of us (maybe more-so).

 

[haohmaru]

You mean it’s all on Gorton.

And it doesn’t matter what role they put him in when he didn’t do well in that role. Perhaps, just perhaps, he would’ve gotten better opportunities if he had performed in the role they put him in. There was a little stretch where he had some chemistry with some players, but it didn’t last and he didn’t contribute with anything else. How do I know he didn’t contribute in the role? Well, if I weren’t confident in what I was watching at the time, he said so himself.

He said “it was up to me to find a way to fit in and contribute in other ways... and I didn’t feel like I did enough”

Saying what he said is what he said is not spinning.

But sure, let’s agree to disagree...

AV had no input whatsoever? Sure.

Role doesn't matter? A guy that played 1C his entire career is now a 3rd line wing? Come on.

Of course role matters. Of course who he plays with matters. Of course I've said it's also on him. He said so himself.

Ah, but you did spin. Your quote wasn't what he actually said, it's what you thought he meant.

Yeah, let's agree to disagree without rolling our eyes. Thanks.

 

[Tawnos]

AV had no input whatsoever? Sure.

Role doesn't matter? A guy that played 1C his entire career is now a 3rd line wing? Come on.

Of course role matters. Of course who he plays with matters. Of course I've said it's also on him. He said so himself.

Ah, but you did spin. Your quote wasn't what he actually said, it's what you thought he meant.

Yeah, let's agree to disagree without rolling our eyes. Thanks.

Even if AV has input, and Gorton listens to that input... that's on Gorton. People are responsible for what they control. The coach does not control roster decisions, whatever input he might or might not have.

And when it comes to players in a role, people are responsible for what they can control... same thing... and at the end of the conversation about a player who is competent enough to play the role he was asked to, it comes down to whether or not a player performed in that role. Staal didn't. That's not on AV, that's on Staal.

And no... what I quoted was verbatim what Staal said without using it in another context. People who think that's spinning, deserve the eye roll.

 

[silverfish]

Let’s be honest though, can you imagine the volumes written if this was posted about Andersson right now?

Dogs and cats living together. Mass hysteria.

The only thing that truly gets on my nerves about Andersson is the insane amount of insecurity there is regarding Mittelstadt. People feel the need to constantly disprove Mittelstadt as some way to validate Andersson. It's annoying.

But I guess the only thing more annoying than that is complaining about it. So, here I am, my own worst enemy.

 

[Tawnos]

The only thing that truly gets on my nerves about Andersson is the insane amount of insecurity there is regarding Mittelstadt. People feel the need to constantly disprove Mittelstadt as some way to validate Andersson. It's annoying.

But I guess the only thing more annoying than that is complaining about it. So, here I am, my own worst enemy.

Well, that works both ways, right? People feel the need to prove Mittelstadt because they didn't like the Andersson pick too. All sides (including me) are culpable here.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Well, that works both ways, right? People feel the need to prove Mittelstadt because they didn't like the Andersson pick too. All sides (including me) are culpable here.

Some people just love rehashing the same debates over and over. How Lias can't skate, how great Mittelstadt is, how we reached, how Lias never had 1st line potential.

 

[silverfish]

Well, that works both ways, right? People feel the need to prove Mittelstadt because they didn't like the Andersson pick too. All sides (including me) are culpable here.

It doesn't matter because everyone is wrong and we should've picked Tippett

But yes, the people who constantly talk about CM are just as culpable as the people who go "BUST" every time Lias breathes without choking.

 

[Edge]

The only thing that truly gets on my nerves about Andersson is the insane amount of insecurity there is regarding Mittelstadt. People feel the need to constantly disprove Mittelstadt as some way to validate Andersson. It's annoying.

But I guess the only thing more annoying than that is complaining about it. So, here I am, my own worst enemy.

I've just about reached the point where I can't even discuss Andersson anymore. I'll chime in here and there, but it's just beyond tedious at this point.

I like Andersson, I like Mittelstadt. I like Italian food, I like Chinese food. Very different, don't particularly feel the need to elevate one over the other.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I've just about reached the point where I can't even discuss Andersson anymore. I'll chime in here and there, but it's just beyond tedious at this point.

I like Andersson, I like Mittelstadt. I like Italian food, I like Chinese food. Very different, don't particularly feel the need to elevate one over the other.

Edge, I feel like you're the zen master of the Rangers board.

 

[Edge]

Edge, I feel like you're the zen master of the Rangers board.

Sometimes.

Other times I'm just confused and trying to figure out what in the world we're talking about/debating.

You'd be surprised how often it's the latter.

 

[McRanger]

Sometimes.

Other times I'm just confused and trying to figure out what in the world we're talking about/debating.

You'd be surprised how often it's the latter.

Have you become a doddering old man already?

We should start a pool including every poster from the old boards, to see which one of us breaks first.

My money is on TB, there is no way he's not already shaking his morning newspaper at the neighborhood children and telling them to pull their pants up.

 

[Edge]

Have you become a doddering old man already?

We should start a pool including every poster from the old boards, to see which one of us breaks first.

My money is on TB, there is no way he's not already shaking his morning newspaper at the neighborhood children and telling them to pull their pants up.

Years of being a parent has done that long before this board could take its swings. =)

One of the cool things about the boards is that it represents a diverse array of cultures, languages, ages, and perspectives.

The challenge is that is can sometimes be difficult to decipher what people are trying to communicate.

I generally try to take that into account before responding.

 

[McRanger]

Years of being a parent has done that long before this board could take its swings. =)

One of the cool things about the boards is that it represents a diverse array of cultures, languages, ages, and perspectives.

The challenge is that is can sometimes be difficult to decipher what people are trying to communicate.

I generally try to take that into account before responding.

I've only been a parent for a few months and I feel like my brain has completely melted.

At least this message board gives me a minute to formulate my thoughts before responding.