WJC: 2017 Canada Roster Talk - Part 1

[snipes]

Ethan Bear not being invited is a joke. I have a feeling he'll play his way onto the team when it is all said and done though.

Forward group looks strong.

 

[jj cale]

I mentioned his name because he may fit the criteria you are describing: Born/raised in the U.S. by Canadian parents and who (apparently) identifies as Canadian. The fact Hockey Canada invited him to the camp this year means:

* He is eligible under some circumstances we are not aware of
* He is ineligible this year but they are bringing him along for experience in order to get him in the fold when he does become eligible

Thanks.

 

[xxxx]

How many players do you think will be playing in the NHL in December? It looks like there's a possibility - not a strong one - but still possibility that we could be missing the whole top-six among forwards.

I personally have no doubts that Crouse and Strome will be playing the NHL. Marner could be available I think. What about Barzal and Konecny?

 

[JackSlater]

How many players do you think will be playing in the NHL in December? It looks like there's a possibility - not a strong one - but still possibility that we could be missing the whole top-six among forwards.

I personally have no doubts that Crouse and Strome will be playing the NHL. Marner could be available I think. What about Barzal and Konecny?

I'm hoping and expecting that it's just McDavid/Strome/Crouse/Marner. Barzal would struggle to make it into a pretty deep group of NYI centres, and realistically Konecny is still too small to play his type of game at the NHL level. If The top six forwards are all missing, it's going to take a coaching/goaltending performance that Canada hasn't seen since probably 2007 to win the tournament.

 

[Urbanskog]

This type of situation is worse in other sports like basketbll and especially soccer. In hockey, the soap opera element should simply be removed from the player's control by the IIHF. In what country's development system did you spend the most time playing hockey? There - play for that country. If you don't want to, then don't play. Pretty simple.

So we'd have Galchenyuk representing Italy or Belarus.

 

[JackSlater]

So we'd have Galchenyuk representing Italy or Belarus.

What is your point? Galchenyuk makes no sense as a representative of American hockey.

 

[Urbanskog]

What is your point? Galchenyuk makes no sense as a representative of American hockey.

I do agree.

 

[1Gold Standard]

How many players do you think will be playing in the NHL in December? It looks like there's a possibility - not a strong one - but still possibility that we could be missing the whole top-six among forwards.

I personally have no doubts that Crouse and Strome will be playing the NHL. Marner could be available I think. What about Barzal and Konecny?

Both probably make their teams but in a limited role. They should be made available. Hopefully they don't pull a Tyler Seguin and say I'd rather sit in the press box in an NHL rink than go to the World Juniors.

here's what I got for now. I imagine Toronto will make Marner available for a Toronto/Montreal tournament, but who knows really how ready Marner is for the NHL. If we remove Marner or any 1 of Barzal-Konecny, then I'd forgo our traditional 13F-7D config and go 12F-8D. Drive the offense through them and keep our fingers crossed that Hart is the goaltender of the tournament...because short of him pulling MVP out of his ass, it's going to be difficult if NHL GMs want to play Ebenezer this Christmas.

Dubois may even stick with the jackets...but that would be a colossal mistake by CBJ.


P-L DUBOIS M BARZAL M MARNER
T JOST N PATRICK T KONECNY
A BEAUVILLIER N ROY J GAUTHIER
G KNOTT M STEPHENS N MERKLEY
T SOY

J BEAN E BEAR
J LAUZON D FABBRO
T CHABOT J ROY
J CHYCHRUN N JUULSEN

C HART
Z SAWCHENKO

 

[JackSlater]

Both probably make their teams but in a limited role. They should be made available. Hopefully they don't pull a Tyler Seguin and say I'd rather sit in the press box in an NHL rink than go to the World Juniors.

here's what I got for now. I imagine Toronto will make Marner available for a Toronto/Montreal tournament, but who knows really how ready Marner is for the NHL. If we remove Marner or any 1 of Barzal-Konecny, then I'd forgo our traditional 13F-7D config and go 12F-8D. Drive the offense through them and keep our fingers crossed that Hart is the goaltender of the tournament...because short of him pulling MVP out of his ass, it's going to be difficult if NHL GMs want to play Ebenezer this Christmas.

Dubois may even stick with the jackets...but that would be a colossal mistake by CBJ.


P-L DUBOIS M BARZAL M MARNER
T JOST N PATRICK T KONECNY
A BEAUVILLIER N ROY J GAUTHIER
G KNOTT M STEPHENS N MERKLEY
T SOY

J BEAN E BEAR
J LAUZON D FABBRO
T CHABOT J ROY
J CHYCHRUN N JUULSEN

C HART
Z SAWCHENKO

Looking at this NHL draft... the 2017 team had best win. The 2018 team is going to be brutal. This is also a year where even a single surprise NHLer (like McCann last year or O'Reilly in 2010 and 2011) would cripple the team.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Looking at this NHL draft... the 2017 team had best win. The 2018 team is going to be brutal. This is also a year where even a single surprise NHLer (like McCann last year or O'Reilly in 2010 and 2011) would cripple the team.

There was a brief window there for about 3 days when I thought the 2018 team would be at least competitive and had a shot at a medal. My opinion has totally gone in the opposite direction now, about as bleak as ever. The 2018 team could be the very worst Team Canada from a talent perspective since Hockey Canada began sending true NTs in 1982.

All the fine work of Scott Salmond and crew. since he started his ascent up the Hockey Canada food chain in 2010, it's been a steading decline in the other direction for our junior programs. I'm not pointing any elbows or anything. just a coincidence I'm sure.

 

[JackSlater]

There was a brief window there for about 3 days when I thought the 2018 team would be at least competitive and had a shot at a medal. My opinion has totally gone in the opposite direction now, about as bleak as ever. The 2018 team could be the very worst Team Canada from a talent perspective since Hockey Canada began sending true NTs in 1982.

All the fine work of Scott Salmond and crew. since he started his accent up the Hockey Canada food chain in 2010, it's been a steading decline in the other direction for our junior programs. I'm not pointing any elbows or anything. just a coincidence I'm sure.

It certainly looks like the worst crop since the early 2000s, and like that period it looks like Canada won't even be missing many elite players due to NHL involvement. Just a dearth of top end talent. We'll see, but I'm not optimistic. The 2017 team had best win.

The problem also goes beyond Salmond though. Winning the WJC is obviously good, but the draft is a better indicator of future success. I didn't like last year's draft for Canada outside of McDavid, this year's draft is obviously bad and as of right now the next few don't look great. It's not acceptable for Canada to have consistently poor drafts.

 

[1Gold Standard]

It certainly looks like the worst crop since the early 2000s, and like that period it looks like Canada won't even be missing many elite players due to NHL involvement. Just a dearth of top end talent. We'll see, but I'm not optimistic. The 2017 team had best win.

The problem also goes beyond Salmond though. Winning the WJC is obviously good, but the draft is a better indicator of future success. I didn't like last year's draft for Canada outside of McDavid, this year's draft is obviously bad and as of right now the next few don't look great. It's not acceptable for Canada to have consistently poor drafts.

winning this year is the preferred outcome of course. but if it's anything less than an appearance in the gold medal game, then I hope Renney starts cleaning out some of the bureaucrats doing nothing more than taking up space at HC. Renney may want to update his CV as well. just in case.

 

[1Gold Standard]

It certainly looks like the worst crop since the early 2000s, and like that period it looks like Canada won't even be missing many elite players due to NHL involvement. Just a dearth of top end talent. We'll see, but I'm not optimistic. The 2017 team had best win.

The problem also goes beyond Salmond though. Winning the WJC is obviously good, but the draft is a better indicator of future success. I didn't like last year's draft for Canada outside of McDavid, this year's draft is obviously bad and as of right now the next few don't look great. It's not acceptable for Canada to have consistently poor drafts.

2014 wasn't particularly great either outside of Ekblad. i.e. 1996 born players. not including Reinhart a 1995 born player. I am a big Fabbri fan though.

That's 5 subpar drafts, potentially. The good news is, with continued Rogers Sportsnet coverage, I won't be a fan much longer anyway for it to even matter. A couple of nephews (5-6 years old) have started. So, I'll just get my hockey fix from hanging out at the local arena watching them play.

 

[Jerrico]

Both probably make their teams but in a limited role. They should be made available. Hopefully they don't pull a Tyler Seguin and say I'd rather sit in the press box in an NHL rink than go to the World Juniors.

here's what I got for now. I imagine Toronto will make Marner available for a Toronto/Montreal tournament, but who knows really how ready Marner is for the NHL. If we remove Marner or any 1 of Barzal-Konecny, then I'd forgo our traditional 13F-7D config and go 12F-8D. Drive the offense through them and keep our fingers crossed that Hart is the goaltender of the tournament...because short of him pulling MVP out of his ass, it's going to be difficult if NHL GMs want to play Ebenezer this Christmas.

Dubois may even stick with the jackets...but that would be a colossal mistake by CBJ.


P-L DUBOIS M BARZAL M MARNER
T JOST N PATRICK T KONECNY
A BEAUVILLIER N ROY J GAUTHIER
G KNOTT M STEPHENS N MERKLEY
T SOY

J BEAN E BEAR
J LAUZON D FABBRO
T CHABOT J ROY
J CHYCHRUN N JUULSEN

C HART
Z SAWCHENKO

Chabot on the third pairing? He will be the number 1 dman on this team...

 

[Mehar]

Foote's another Chychrun/Brown situation.

Hockey Canada made a mistake with Brown. Wish he was playing for Canada this year. Guy thought he did enough to make the Ivan Hlinka team last August, but gets cut from the team, and was upset about that.

Wanted to represent Canada internationally, but after he gets cut last August- he decided to go the US route. So, he plays in the All-American prospects game the next month, and plays for USA in the Under 18, where he shines this year. Sucks, since he would look good for Canada this year.

 

[canuck2010]

In hockey, the soap opera element should simply be removed from the player's control by the IIHF. In what country's development system did you spend the most time playing hockey? There - play for that country. If you don't want to, then don't play. Pretty simple.[/QUOTE]

I don't agree at all. The NHL with 24 US teams provides a unfair advantage for the USA. There are an increasing number of dual citizens because the kids are born to hockey players plying their trade in the USA. No longer just Canadian but Europeans as well. If I'm a Canadian player who is drafted by a US team, play there and have a child there I want him to be a Canadian. I know, I know, things can change and factors can influence the way you think.

I think for the good of the game these players should be left to decide for whom they want to play.

 

[canuck2010]

As far as the the 2017-18 Canadian team goes I think '99 is a strong year especially at forward. Just have to hope they develop quickly.

 

[JackSlater]

Hockey Canada made a mistake with Brown. Wish he was playing for Canada this year. Guy thought he did enough to make the Ivan Hlinka team last August, but gets cut from the team, and was upset about that.

Wanted to represent Canada internationally, but after he gets cut last August- he decided to go the US route. So, he plays in the All-American prospects game the next month, and plays for USA in the Under 18, where he shines this year. Sucks, since he would look good for Canada this year.

Hockey Canada did the right thing with Brown. Players should not get to make teams just because they have dual citizenship as leverage against Hockey Canada. Additionally, Brown is an American player (lived there his whole life as far as I know) and seems all too happy to be playing for USA. I don't want American players on team Canada, and I don't want players who are willing to play for another country against Canada.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Hockey Canada made a mistake with Brown. Wish he was playing for Canada this year. Guy thought he did enough to make the Ivan Hlinka team last August, but gets cut from the team, and was upset about that.

Wanted to represent Canada internationally, but after he gets cut last August- he decided to go the US route. So, he plays in the All-American prospects game the next month, and plays for USA in the Under 18, where he shines this year. Sucks, since he would look good for Canada this year.

I disagree.
I'm all for players with dual citizenship having the right to make that choice, but it should be a long-term big picture choice, not short-term career aspirations of the player. i.e. Brown and "I didn't make the U18 Hlinka team therefore screw you Hockey Canada I have options." If this is what international play means to players like Brown, then I'd rather he not wear a Maple Leaf at all and he's better off in the Stars and Stripes. Good luck to him. I don't often give credit to Hockey Canada, but in this case, I have no complaints.

If he really wanted to represent Canada internationally, getting cut from a summer exhibition team at 17 years old shouldn't really matter long-term. but it did, so how much did he want to play for Canada really? I'd say his commitment to playing for Canada internationally was no deeper than a puddle of spit. And if that's his commitment level, then be on your merry way, Mr. Brown.

besides all that, I really don't see him as having a future with a real Team Canada at the senior level anyway.

and I got a chuckle from your line "The guy thought he did enough to make Team Canada..." well, boo-hoo... welcome to what it means to be a hockey player in Canada! maybe Mr. Brown should have a sit down and heart to heart with Claude Giroux.

And if USAH is counting on the sons of Canadian NHLers as a part of their future, then I think we can just get on with game planning for the Finns.

Neither Hockey Canada or USAH should attempt to recruit any of these types of players. Allow them simply to make a family choice on their own at age 17 or 18 when the decision has to be made and inform the appropriate governing body of that choice. No more invites back and forth, 1 year USAH, next year Hockey Canada and then flip flop back to the USAH when Team Canada appears to be too tough to make off the hop... But, if the sons of Canadian NHLers want to "come home" then they should have the right of that choice at 17 or 18 and then live with it... but be aware that the competition is fierce for roster spots and your "dual status" doesn't give you "privileged status." i.e., if you get cut from a team you feel you deserved to be a part of, suck it up, deal with it and try again for the next Team Canada, and not pull the I have options card. Good for Hockey Canada for weeding out these types of players.

I don't agree with the JackSlater position that players with dual citizenship should only represent the country where he grew up. I can't support that option, because as a Canadian who spent a large chunk of my professional life living and working abroad, if I had children in tow then they would be obligated to represent that country based on my career choices, in this case Russia...and that is simply not acceptable. I simply shudder at the thought of that scenario playing out. but thankfully I didn't have children in tow while working and living abroad.

 

[Mehar]

Good points made by both JackSlater and Mr Writer. Reflecting on what they said- i cannot disagree where they are coming from. It is important to get players that are totally committed to Canada. Obviously, Brown was not. He made his choice with USA Hockey.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Happy Canada Day post. Hope everybody will enjoy the day at the cottage...or whatever your plans happen to include...


I have a worst case scenario roster if all the likely candidates to remain with their NHL teams are unavailable for the Christmas tournament.

*13th F T Soy only because he played the Hlinka and played well, so may as well stick with what I know.

*And I imagine out of the 8 D, Fabbro is the one that doesn't make it, as the tournament will be ending in Montreal, Hockey Canada will make the political choice of the QMJHL player (Roy) and the Montreal draft pick (Juulsen) over the better player.(Fabbro)

A BEAUVILLIER P-L DUBOIS J GAUTHIER
T JOST M STEPHENS N MERKLEY
G KNOTT N PATRICK Z SENYSHYN
B HOWDEN N ROY J KYROU
T SOY

J BEAN E BEAR
J LAUZON D FABBRO
T CHABOT J ROY
J CHYCHRUN N JUULSEN

C HART
Z SAWCHENKO

 

[JackSlater]

Happy Canada Day post. Hope everybody will enjoy the day at the cottage...or whatever your plans happen to include...


I have a worst case scenario roster if all the likely candidates to remain with their NHL teams are unavailable for the Christmas tournament.

*13th F T Soy only because he played the Hlinka and played well, so may as well stick with what I know.

*And I imagine out of the 8 D, Fabbro is the one that doesn't make it, as the tournament will be ending in Montreal, Hockey Canada will make the political choice of the QMJHL player (Roy) and the Montreal draft pick (Juulsen) over the better player.(Fabbro)

A BEAUVILLIER P-L DUBOIS J GAUTHIER
T JOST M STEPHENS N MERKLEY
G KNOTT N PATRICK Z SENYSHYN
B HOWDEN N ROY J KYROU
T SOY

J BEAN E BEAR
J LAUZON D FABBRO
T CHABOT J ROY
J CHYCHRUN N JUULSEN

C HART
Z SAWCHENKO

Happy Canada Day to all. Hoping that Konecny and Barzal are available to spare us from that terrible roster. At the moment I am also optimistic regarding our goaltending relative to the other countries. Hope it plays out that way.

 

[Striiker]

I'd guess the odds are about 66%-33% in favor of Konecny going back to the OHL and being available for the WJC.

He'll have to have a very strong camp to make the Flyers, especially since they'd need to actively make room to fit him in.

Hopefully if he does playing the WJC he'll be used properly, unlike last year.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Happy Canada Day to all. Hoping that Konecny and Barzal are available to spare us from that terrible roster. At the moment I am also optimistic regarding our goaltending relative to the other countries. Hope it plays out that way.

I agree, it does look rather bleak... and that's missing just 6 players. That says a lot right there. 6 players missing and the team looks no better than a average club team.

We'll see how it goes coming out of camp and the 9 game cut off for junior returnees. Konecny for Captain and Barzal wears an A, both Philly and NY would go along with that.

 

[tade]

There's probably only outside chance for Pascal Laberge, correct? He should have much better chance at 2018 WJC, I assume. But I still think he could be perfect player for the 3rd/4th line.

Regarding Konecny, he looks incredible on the Flyers development camp and a lot of people think that he's going to make the Flyers and he is going to have nearly whole summer to improve.
Although, I am still skeptical and I think that Hextall will send him down but it will be tough decision for him.

What about Phil Myers? He's not getting much attention here, but he was also invited to CAN Development Camp, obviously a lot will depend on his start to the season, but if he picks up the pace right where he left off, then I think he has to be in the conversation, he's also RHD and terrific 2-way defenseman.

And looks like Carter Hart has more than a good chance, arguably a lock to be there? It could be really exciting WJC for the Flyers fans in regards to Team Canada.