Transfer: 2016 Summer Transfer Window

[hatterson]

It's still money not well spent. Again, long term is exactly what Kanté is. Amavi as well. I wrote it here last summer. I also wrote that Schneiderlin was highly overrated on these boards (depsite my current reputation among some that I always overrated french players).

Scouts just didn't do their job, and the coaching staff neither.

I'm not saying Kante wouldn't have been a good target, I'm saying that the reason they didn't acquire him had nothing to do with spending too much money on Martial. They already had acquired Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger who they believed would fill that type of role better, in addition to having Carrick still around.

Amavi wouldn't have had a spot with Darmian and Shaw occupying the sides either.

Again, I'm not saying Kante or Amavi wouldn't have been upgrades on what Utd are *currently* rolling out there. But the reason there's holes right now isn't because they ran out of money from paying too much for Martial, it's because the scouting and management didn't do a good job and they've had several injuries.

Saying it was a mistake to overpay for Martial because of the glaring holes in the first team is ignoring why those holes exist. Based on what the team thought *at the time* they were rolling out a solid lineup that was missing elite talent. They saw the chance to add potentially elite talent and took it.

It's easy to look back and say that in hindsight they should have targeted given players but at the time it wasn't like they were passing up on talent to pursue Martial. If anything, Martial was the last minute option after getting shut out on other targets, his price didn't affect them buying anyone else. So whether he's actually worth 70M or not is irrelevant. He's doing the job they bought him for and it didn't prevent them going after other players.

 

[Evilo]

As I said, it's still money down the toilets. It's toally relevant when fans pay the tickets.

Everyone here said United had glaring holes last summer. Nothing new here. If anything, they benefited from other teams struggling (Chelsea, City, etc...).

 

[Live in the Now]

I'd have to agree with the point that the scouts didn't do their job. There are some very simple solutions that would have left them with better players.

Clyne is better than Darmian for example, and with CL football he'd definitely have went there. Schneiderlin was very good for Southampton so I can't fault that one. Going for Schweinsteiger was a clear case of picking a name player over what contributions they could bring to the table. Depay, well, there's a lot that can be said about him but I don't want to start an argument. To sign no central defender last summer was also an interesting decision.

 

[hatterson]

As I said, it's still money down the toilets. It's toally relevant when fans pay the tickets.

Everyone here said United had glaring holes last summer. Nothing new here. If anything, they benefited from other teams struggling (Chelsea, City, etc...).

Money down the toilet is basically par for the course.

Again, my basic point was 1.) you can't buy half a good team for 80M when you're using the definition of good that United should be shooting for, and 2.) the holes in the team exist because they made bad decisions in regards to midfield and back end signings and Depay not being anything near what he should have been, not because they spent 30m too much on Martial

Martial has basically met expectations so far, at least for me. If anything, he's been more versatile and more of a playmaker than I expected. No, he's not "worth" 70M, but I don't think anyone thought he truly would be. But he is filling the role he was supposed to.

If you want to pick on overpayments, focus on Depay and Schweinsteiger, not on Martial.

 

[Evilo]

1.) you can't buy half a good team for 80M when you're using the definition of good that United should be shooting for

Again, totally disagree. United should target good players that play good football and who show a willingess to give it all for their team.
Kanté, Amavi, Ayew, Payet, just off the top of my head wuld have been great buys for United and all of them together would have cost less than 40M, half of Martial's fee.

Martial has basically met expectations so far, at least for me. If anything, he's been more versatile and more of a playmaker than I expected. No, he's not "worth" 70M, but I don't think anyone thought he truly would be. But he is filling the role he was supposed to.

I agree he's filled the expectations. A nice potential top striker who flashes brilliance but has ways to go before reaching top level if he ever does. Potential is there, no question.

 

[Theon]

I don't know why Amavi keeps brought up when we have Luke Shaw and Daley Blind. Kante, sure, the scouts missed that, but so did 19 other teams in England.

Our CBs have been fine. Blind's been great considering CB is not his natural position and Smalling, if not for De Gea or Martial, would've been the player of the year. So failing to sign Ramos in the summer didn't matter all that much given that we're one of the top 2 defenses in the league.

The main woes have been in attack because other than Martial and more recently Rashford, we've had no one to score goals. LvG sold too many attacking/creative players (Chicharito, Di Maria) without properly replacing them.

The Martial fee keeps getting brought up in every thread, but not one United fan will have any qualms about it. I'd pay the same fee again. This guy had an outstanding first season and will only get better.

 

[Evilo]

I don't know why Amavi keeps brought up when we have Luke Shaw and Daley Blind. Kante, sure, the scouts missed that, but so did 19 other teams in England.

Amavi is higher quality and you'll see it when he's finally back healthy. That's why I brought him up. And he'll probably be available this summer as well. And you said yourself Blind has played lots of CB.

 

[hatterson]

Amavi is higher quality and you'll see it when he's finally back healthy. That's why I brought him up. And he'll probably be available this summer as well. And you said yourself Blind has played lots of CB.

I'd rather have Shaw than Amavi, although it's not a huge advantage. And I'd rather sign another true CB to pair with Smalling than trying to push Shaw or Amavi out of position.

 

[Evilo]

CBs should be a priority indeed. They're hard to find.
But I'd find it surprising Lyon would turn down a 40M€ offer for Umtiti for instance. And I doubt he'd do worse than United's current group.

 

[Theon]

Amavi is higher quality and you'll see it when he's finally back healthy. That's why I brought him up. And he'll probably be available this summer as well. And you said yourself Blind has played lots of CB.

Sure, that's fair, but I rate Luke Shaw quite highly, so for me LB is not that big of a concern if he's healthy. Now that he's relegated, I wouldn't mind if United took a punt at him. He's no doubt better than Rojo at LB.

I do expect United to sign a CB. And from what I've been reading they are targeting smart signing rather than flashy one. Maksimovic, Koulibaly and Marquinhos have been mentioned a lot and I'd rather we go after them than haggle all summer for John Stones and Sergio Ramos.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

CBs should be a priority indeed. They're hard to find.
But I'd find it surprising Lyon would turn down a 40M€ offer for Umtiti for instance. And I doubt he'd do worse than United's current group.

40 million for a player like Umtiti would be incredibly insane. This whole market has gotten whacky.

Dybala was sold for 30 million ish...

 

[Evilo]

40 million for a player like Umtiti would be incredibly insane. This whole market has gotten whacky.

Dybala was sold for 30 million ish...

Totally agreed.
I was merely pointing half of Martial's fee and an insane number where Lyon would obviously say yes.

Besides, CBs are a tough market.

 

[Vipers31]

Dortmund officially announced that Hummels has requested a transfer to Bayern. Will come down to the teams finding an agreement, no offer has been made as of today, according to the statement.

 

[Evilo]

Barca rumored to be interested in Lacazette.
Pretty much confirmed today by OL's coach.

 

[Evilo]

Also Dembélé has agreed to a 5 year contract with Dortmund.
Now remains the fee to be agreed upon before it's official.

 

[cgf]

Also Dembélé has agreed to a 5 year contract with Dortmund.
Now remains the fee to be agreed upon before it's official.

What Tuchel could do with Dembele, Gotze and a Torres/Tielemans to relace Ilkay, is certainly exciting think about. Would be a simply gorgeous attack.

Reus/Dembele/Pulisic - Auba/Reus/Dembele - Miki/Dembele/Pulisic
Gotze/Malli - Miki/Torres
Weigl

Just needs Sule & Tah to replace Hummels & Subotic...

 

[YNWA14]

I know Reus isn't likely moving but this is pretty neat:

Reus and Grosskreutz as Liverpool mascots for the 2001 UEFA Cup final.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

What Tuchel could do with Dembele, Gotze and a Torres/Tielemans to relace Ilkay, is certainly exciting think about. Would be a simply gorgeous attack.

Reus/Dembele - Auba/Dembele - Miki/Dembele/Pulisic
Gotze/Malli - Miki/Torres
Weigl

Just needs Sule & Tah to replace Hummels & Subotic...

It's probably not best to rely on an 18 year to play a prominent role.

Question, didn't Hummels make a big stink about the likes of Götze/Lewa leaving to Munich?

 

[Vipers31]

Question, didn't Hummels make a big stink about the likes of Götze/Lewa leaving to Munich?

Yes, kind of. He does like to talk big words. That's what gotten him immensely popular among many Dortmund fans, and he had actively worked towards being an identification figure and captain - and now, it's obviously blowing up in his face, leaving him with far more backlash than Lewandowski. Hummels certainly comes out looking like a hypocrite, and has a majority of BVB fans furious at him, while his former comments have also stayed with many Bayern supporters, who are not going to make it the warmest of welcomes. He'll have to win many over like Neuer did. His big words will help him again - as long as he delivers. He certainly has the kind of ego that is generally loved by fans, as long is it matches the contributions.

 

[Luigi Habs]

 

[Vipers31]

Not really, though. We didn't become Leverkusen from buying Lucio, Ballack, Ze Roberto and Kovac. We didn't become Bremen from buying Klose, Ismael and Frings. We're not becoming Dortmund from buying Götze, signing Lewa for free and bringing back Hummels.

 

[Cin]

Don't worry about it, at all. We're looking at that from massively different angles, so that's natural, as is not being able to shrug of having another player (seemingly) split like that over a grand scheme type look at things. But if BVB will continue to do their work like that, it'll give them sustained rewards.

You're absolutely right! Haha thanks for understanding.

 

[JoemAvs]

What Tuchel could do with Dembele, Gotze and a Torres/Tielemans to relace Ilkay, is certainly exciting think about. Would be a simply gorgeous attack.

Reus/Dembele/Pulisic - Auba/Reus/Dembele - Miki/Dembele/Pulisic
Gotze/Malli - Miki/Torres
Weigl

Just needs Sule & Tah to replace Hummels & Subotic...

Sule & Tah does not make sense at all. One of them would be plenty enough.

They have Sokratis, Bender and Ginter. No way you can play 2 young guys over them.

If they somehow could get Tielemans as well (money should be there), this team could get crazy exciting under Tuchel.

I could absolutely see a CL-title in their not-so-immediate future (say 3 years from now) as long as they can keep Auba and Reus until then (highly doubtful. Think Auba is off to Real after next season if he keeps his current level. Also Mikhi would need to extend and I am not so sure about that one).


And as a Bayern fan I would love it. With Leverkusen also having a very good young core, Schalke finally with a good manager (and coach if they get Weinzierl) and Leipzig coming up (I hate them but I think they will be pretty legit pretty soon), things could get really exciting in the Bundesliga as long as they can keep the Premier League and their money at bay.


Teams like Gladbach, Hertha (hopefully) and Wolfsburg will probably decline heavily soon but more than 4-5 real competitors would be unrealistic anyways.

 

[Cin]

Nailed it.

 

[Cin]

I absolutely love Matic. Tremendous player surrounded by utter **** at Chelsea right now. I just think Bender already brings to the table what Matic does. Cheaper too.

The big problem for me with Dortmund moving forward, is that we really, REALLY need a strong target man/poacher to come off the bench or play in the lesser matches when Auba is tired.

Tiele would be awesome, and we've been linked with him for what feels like forever. I honestly think though, that this could be the summer Volland finally arrives at Dortmund.

I would also add that buying low on Schar right now might be decent business?