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Line Combos: 2016-2017 Kings Roster

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Great coverage of players with the LAKingsInsider.com piece on all the defensemen competing for a spot, the FrozenRoyalty.com articles on Adrian Kempe and Derek Forbort (complete with Mike Futa quotes), and Jason Lewis' interview with new additions Zach Trotman and Michael Latta. Sheng Peng also has an analysis of Tom Gilbert over at todaysslapshot.com.







 
Imagine if a guy like Trouba or Vatanen or Maatta were removed from their respective clubs and they were lost for nothing in return.

It would be a major blow and setback to those teams. Voynov really did **** this team over. This is the second season the team is entering since losing Voynov and they still have not recovered from it.
 
Voynov is a 1B defenseman. He was very special and is showing what he can do in his prime in the KHL. I would hope to see the Kings bring him back. I dont see why not. Varlamov is still in the dam league

Muzzin-Doughty
Martinez-Voynov
Mcnabb-Gravel
Gilbert

Would be a Stanley Cup defense
 
tsanuri said:
You lose a legit top 4 on any team and arguably a top 2-3 on most it's not something easily recovered from. And I'd say most if not all teams would be reeling from it just like we still are.
Click to expand...

No question. Especially with the cap. Can't just go out and get a guy. Not that the Kings were always going out and getting a guy in the no cap days.

You look at what the top 4 was supposed to be today; Doughty, Muzzin, Voynov, Martinez. All on the younger side, all signed for multiple years. That was one thing Lombardi wasn't going to have to worry about. At least there would be 4 solid defensemen.

Voynov, Brown, Richards. What are the Kings looking for on the roster? A top 4 defenseman, a scoring winger, and a top 3 center. They haven't replaced Voynov. Because Brown stopped scoring, they had to get Gaborik, and then had to sign Gaborik because he was stupid good in 2014. When Lombardi got Richards for Simmonds and Schenn, I don't think he expected about 2 years worth of a player, even with all he did for the 2012 team.
 
Kingsfan1 said:
Voynov is a 1B defenseman. He was very special and is showing what he can do in his prime in the KHL. I would hope to see the Kings bring him back. I dont see why not. Varlamov is still in the dam league

Muzzin-Doughty
Martinez-Voynov
Mcnabb-Gravel
Gilbert

Would be a Stanley Cup defense
Click to expand...

Where he might get back to the NHL I don't expect him to ever play for the Kings again.
And in order to play he'd likely have to set out another year.
Since that is kind of what I would expect the league to suspend him for. And doing so he would have to be under contract in the NHL and therefore couldn't play in the KHL.
And then after doing that, which I'm not holding my breath for him to do. He would be traded by the Kings just so they don't have to take the bad press.
As to your example he was never convicted of a crime. If he had been he likely wouldn't be playing.
 
Should have added that there is also the problem that you'd have to carry that dead space for the whole year.
Where a suspended player doesn't count against the cap as a team you must keep the amount avail in case the player comes back right away.
And when you consider whatever punishment is handed down would likely go to an arbitrator that could reduce it. You'd need all that dead cap space for a year.
 
tsanuri said:
Where he might get back to the NHL I don't expect him to ever play for the Kings again.
And in order to play he'd likely have to set out another year.
Since that is kind of what I would expect the league to suspend him for. And doing so he would have to be under contract in the NHL and therefore couldn't play in the KHL.
And then after doing that, which I'm not holding my breath for him to do. He would be traded by the Kings just so they don't have to take the bad press.
As to your example he was never convicted of a crime. If he had been he likely wouldn't be playing.
Click to expand...

I dont think the Kings would take any bad press actually . Look around whata happening in the world. We live in an illusion where money makes the world go round . Everything is a lie. If we have a president candidate who is leaked to so much corruption and is not taking any bad press i doubt Voynov coming back would . Varlamov got off easier because the Ray Rice incident hadnt happened yet
 
Losing Voynov wasn't the problem. Not replacing Voynov is/was the problem even with a player that isn't quite as good.

edit: Not ****ing Sucderi!

Which brings me to my next point. Poach one of the available RFA D!
 
DontgoZiggy said:
I was always surprised how much borderline **** that stoll got away with, without having to answer the bell, he was great at pushing the envelope.
Click to expand...

He went super saiyan in the 2014 Sharks series, game three.

Say what you will, but guys like Richards, Williams, and Stoll were always emotionally engaged when it mattered. And now they're all gone.
 
SettlementRichie10 said:
He went super saiyan in the 2014 Sharks series, game three.

Say what you will, but guys like Richards, Williams, and Stoll were always emotionally engaged when it mattered. And now they're all gone.
Click to expand...

And their replacements have been soft as butter.

I'm not clamoring for guys like Stoll and Richards given how they were wastes of cap space and roster spots in 2014-15, but prior to that, the Kings at least had some center depth that could chip in occasionally in addition to playing on the PK, blocking shots and passes, playing with a physical edge, and winning key faceoffs.

Kopitar, Carter and Lecavalier aside (and I do admire what he brought to the team in his short tenure here), the Kings got very little from their centers. Shore was a major disappointment and didn't cut it, Andreoff and Lewis were better suited as wingers, and Dowd is a player yet to be determined.

It is no wonder that they are trying to see if Kempe can grab a hold of a center spot. They may need him to step in to that role seeing how bleak that position is throughout the pipeline. Amadio will likely be in Ontario over the next two seasons, and beyond him, there really isn't much else to look forward to in terms of promising center prospects.
 
Trolfoli said:
Losing Voynov wasn't the problem. Not replacing Voynov is/was the problem even with a player that isn't quite as good.
Click to expand...

It's one in the same. How can you say losing him wasn't the problem in a hard cap league? If you don't lose him, you don't have to replace him.

Drafted Voynov in 2008, and it was a full 3 year development process before he did anything in the NHL. He was young, right handed, signed to a great deal, and it took just using a 2nd round pick to get him. Unless you luck out and get another Voynov in the draft(with or without the wait), anyone that you bring in that could replace him will either cost you cap space, and/or a current good player. What free agent is on Voynov's level that would cost the same cap hit? What team is waiting to trade a guy on his level to you, just to help you?

You would trade Muzzin for Trouba, but maybe Winnipeg doesn't want Muzzin. Maybe Trouba doesn't want to sign with the Kings.

http://www.espn.com/nhl/freeagents/_/year/2015/position/d

http://www.espn.com/nhl/freeagents/_/position/d

A trade might be the only real option, and we can see trades aren't as easy to make anymore with the cap. Without a cap, you could trade Brown's 11 goals and $6m contract to Toronto where he could be their 14th forward. With a cap, the best you can do is trade him for an equally bad contract, which there are few of. I think Girardi might be the only similar player/contract ratio.
 
Ziggy Stardust said:
And their replacements have been soft as butter.

I'm not clamoring for guys like Stoll and Richards given how they were wastes of cap space and roster spots in 2014-15, but prior to that, the Kings at least had some center depth that could chip in occasionally in addition to playing on the PK, blocking shots and passes, playing with a physical edge, and winning key faceoffs.

Kopitar, Carter and Lecavalier aside (and I do admire what he brought to the team in his short tenure here), the Kings got very little from their centers. Shore was a major disappointment and didn't cut it, Andreoff and Lewis were better suited as wingers, and Dowd is a player yet to be determined.

It is no wonder that they are trying to see if Kempe can grab a hold of a center spot. They may need him to step in to that role seeing how bleak that position is throughout the pipeline. Amadio will likely be in Ontario over the next two seasons, and beyond him, there really isn't much else to look forward to in terms of promising center prospects.
Click to expand...

I think the thing is people seem to believe it's as simple as replacing the production of Stoll et. al. (or the former production really) but there ARE intangibles and chemistry in hockey no matter how much people will rail against it. Sometimes, no matter what you do, you CAN'T replace a guy, even if his replacement is better on paper.

I think the perfect example of the above is Mitchell.
 
KingsFan7824 said:
It's one in the same. How can you say losing him wasn't the problem in a hard cap league? If you don't lose him, you don't have to replace him.

Drafted Voynov in 2008, and it was a full 3 year development process before he did anything in the NHL. He was young, right handed, signed to a great deal, and it took just using a 2nd round pick to get him. Unless you luck out and get another Voynov in the draft(with or without the wait), anyone that you bring in that could replace him will either cost you cap space, and/or a current good player. What free agent is on Voynov's level that would cost the same cap hit? What team is waiting to trade a guy on his level to you, just to help you?

You would trade Muzzin for Trouba, but maybe Winnipeg doesn't want Muzzin. Maybe Trouba doesn't want to sign with the Kings.

http://www.espn.com/nhl/freeagents/_/year/2015/position/d

http://www.espn.com/nhl/freeagents/_/position/d

A trade might be the only real option, and we can see trades aren't as easy to make anymore with the cap. Without a cap, you could trade Brown's 11 goals and $6m contract to Toronto where he could be their 14th forward. With a cap, the best you can do is trade him for an equally bad contract, which there are few of. I think Girardi might be the only similar player/contract ratio.
Click to expand...

Signing Sekera before Voynov came back was the solution. Then, IF Voynov comes back you have to move someone. That was the solution... It sucks from a personnel stand point, but the team would have been much better off. Even if Sekera wasn't going to replace 100% of what Voynov brought he'd be better then Schenn.

Now the game plan is to sit around and see if someone turns into a top 4D. That's going to take a year or two. There's no guarantee that in 2 years the Kings aren't where they are today.

The other option is to try and poach one of the RFA's, which is unlikely.

WPG wants someone similar age to Trouba... that's not Muzzin. They don't need forwards/wingers... the team also wants to turn the corner and start competing. They have a huge hole on the left side. Muzzin is exactly what they need. Cost controlled guy that can play big mins in their top 4. They may not like it, but I see it similar to the PK/Weber trade. The question that leaves is Muzzin/Martinez or Martinez/Trouba better as a pairing? For me it's pretty close, what wins is Trouba's age vs Muzzin and the Kings looking like they're going into a quick retool.

Doesn't matter really. Don't have the cap to fix it this year. It would be good to position the team to make the issue easier to fix in the future.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
I think the perfect example of the above is Mitchell.
Click to expand...

Mitchell + Voynov both gone was the real hamstring exploiting how much Voynov's role played.

Mitchell had the compete level on the ice that made all the difference... it's not always all about skill. he was able to notice young forwards coming down on him and exploited the experience gap to force the forward into the first move. he was special imo. (and it isn't just having the longest stick in the league)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wok_GcIJgDc
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
I think the thing is people seem to believe it's as simple as replacing the production of Stoll et. al. (or the former production really) but there ARE intangibles and chemistry in hockey no matter how much people will rail against it. Sometimes, no matter what you do, you CAN'T replace a guy, even if his replacement is better on paper.

I think the perfect example of the above is Mitchell.
Click to expand...

It's not so much the numbers though (which of course would help), it's more of their style of play. The guys who have been tried in those positions have not been adequate on the physical side of the game. Even Sutter has said so.
 
Ziggy Stardust said:
It's not so much the numbers though (which of course would help), it's more of their style of play. The guys who have been tried in those positions have not been adequate on the physical side of the game. Even Sutter has said so.
Click to expand...

Not to mention being able to produce with Brown. This is a big part of Brown's problem. He plays a blue collar game. Kopitar is transitioning away from that type of game, Carter doesn't play it. Brown needs a center that plays his game.
 
Trolfoli said:
Signing Sekera before Voynov came back was the solution. Then, IF Voynov comes back you have to move someone. That was the solution... It sucks from a personnel stand point, but the team would have been much better off. Even if Sekera wasn't going to replace 100% of what Voynov brought he'd be better then Schenn.
Click to expand...

Maybe, although there's a bunch of cap questions in regards to signing Sekera. But to get Sekera in the first place, cost a 1st round pick, because they lost Voynov and wanted to replace him when it looked like maybe the Kings had something going. With Voynov, there's no need to get Sekera. Everything starts from losing Voynov.
 
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