2016-2017 Kings Roster Talk Part IV

[tny760]

I have hope for next year.

LA doesn't have top end skill but they have managed to produce NHL players.

I like Forbort, Gravel, and LaDue.

Dowd shows flashes and I think can turn into a solid player.

Not sure if Shore will find his scoring touch.

Kempe and Brodzinski are both capable of popping 15-20.

Interesting to see if a system change will help these guys.

i don't think shore's gonna amount to anything. that said, he was the prototypical sutter guy so maybe he was being stifled since he was so good at the system

dowd is frustrating, awful 5 on 5 but has the creativity and vision the team's been sorely lacking for a long time. but i said that about linden vey too..

 

[Reclamation Project]

Shore would have an impressive season if he can crack 10 goals.

Also, LOOOOOOOOOOOL these are our current expectations. Pathetic.

 

[KINGS17]

It's really no different than other teams who are also barren of top skilled prospects. This organization is seriously lacking in skill at every level, from the parent club to the minors and juniors/college/overseas.

I agree, and it won't get better in just a few seasons.

To make it worse the Kings best forwards are leaving their prime production years, and their best defenseman is going to be due for a new contract at a very unfortunate time.

 

[Docgonzo]

Only player I don't have a lot of faith in is Dowd. I like him but I think at his age he won't get much better. Our D prospects are older but Dmen don't hit their prime till later. And Brods is just a total ? to me. Don't know what to think of him.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I agree, and it won't get better in just a few seasons.

To make it worse the Kings best forwards are leaving their prime production years, and their best defenseman is going to be due for a new contract at a very unfortunate time.

Probably true. Definitely true about Drew.

Only player I don't have a lot of faith in is Dowd. I like him but I think at his age he won't get much better. Our D prospects are older but Dmen don't hit their prime till later. And Brods is just a total ? to me. Don't know what to think of him.

Brodz was generating opportunities like a madman though.

 

[EXTRAS]

What do you guys see as Forborts upside?

 

[damacles1156]

i don't think shore's gonna amount to anything. that said, he was the prototypical sutter guy so maybe he was being stifled since he was so good at the system

dowd is frustrating, awful 5 on 5 but has the creativity and vision the team's been sorely lacking for a long time. but i said that about linden vey too..

Nick shore:

70 GP: 6G 11A 17P -2, ALL AT Even Strength. Time on ice: 12:47 avg, PP: 0:18 avg, SH: 1:18 (Awesome).

Shore had an awesome season for an exclusive 4th/3rd line center with no PP time.

Nic Dowd: 70GP 6G 16A 22P -15, 5G and 9A at Even Strength. Time on ice: 12:27 avg, PP:1:34, PK: 0:04.

Dowd received lots of PP time.

 

[damacles1156]

What do you guys see as Forborts upside?

What you see, is what you get.

A steady 3/4 guy, that can skate, and has good reach/size. If the Kings were able to move Forbort down a line, he would be really good.

 

[damacles1156]

Top three offensive teams in the league, 4th line Center production.

Pitt: Matt Cullen: 13G 18A 31P, Best in the league.

Minny: Tyler Graovac: 7G 2A 9P.

Wash: Jay Beagle: 13G 17A 30P (Year before that, he only had 17P in 52GP)

Gives you an idea: There are no 15G scorers(this year) in there. Its hard to get 15G, out of your bottom six guys.

Beagle/Cullen are both Excellent veterans playing 4th line roles, Cullen is former 25G scorer.

If your 4th line Center cracks 10 ES Goals in a year, you have one of the best in the league.

 

[Reclamation Project]

What do you guys see as Forborts upside?

Solid bottom four pairing defenseman.

 

[damacles1156]

Shore would have an impressive season if he can crack 10 goals.

Also, LOOOOOOOOOOOL these are our current expectations. Pathetic.

If You get 15 ES goals out of your 3rd line Center, 10 ES goals out of your 4th line Center, you have some of the best bottom six Centers in the entire league. I could see Kempe putting up 15 ES goals at 3C, maybe.

Folks need to keep their expectations realistic.

 

[Legionnaire]

Top three offensive teams in the league, 4th line Center production.

Pitt: Matt Cullen: 13G 18A 31P, Best in the league.

Minny: Tyler Graovac: 7G 2A 9P.

Wash: Jay Beagle: 13G 17A 30P (Year before that, he only had 17P in 52GP)

Gives you an idea: There are no 15G scorers(this year) in there. Its hard to get 15G, out of your bottom six guys.

Beagle/Cullen are both Excellent veterans playing 4th line roles, Cullen is former 25G scorer.

If your 4th line Center cracks 10 ES Goals in a year, you have one of the best in the league.

This is true. However, I don't think the issue is so much the production out of our 3rd and 4th lines, it's more the ability to produce when placed in other roles. You've got to have depth to win in this league and injuries are just one factor.

 

[tny760]

Nick shore:

70 GP: 6G 11A 17P -2, ALL AT Even Strength. Time on ice: 12:47 avg, PP: 0:18 avg, SH: 1:18 (Awesome).

Shore had an awesome season for an exclusive 4th/3rd line center with no PP time.

Nic Dowd: 70GP 6G 16A 22P -15, 5G and 9A at Even Strength. Time on ice: 12:27 avg, PP:1:34, PK: 0:04.

Dowd was a PP player, pretty much it.

guess that's fair, i didn't really account for his PK time. if he was a bit more of an offensive threat i guess i'd be less dismissive.. same goes for every player on the team though

i'm not sure i feel dowd exactly benefitted from his linemates last season though, wasn't he one of the biggest line blender victims? i've been trying to progressively wipe last season from my memory so i might be off base

What you see, is what you get.

A steady 3/4 guy, that can skate, and has good reach/size. If the Kings were able to move Forbort down a line, he would be really good.

would certainly be nice if muzzin bounced back and ladue took a step forward, doughty-muzzin was quite good offensively when muzzin wasn't stinking up the joint, ladue-forbort sounds like a nice pairing long term and that gets us the rhd-lhd pairings. guess that makes gravel the odd man out again, especially so if fantenberg becomes part of the conversation

.. i'd go absolutely insane as an NHL GM, i'm not even thinking money at this point

 

[The Tikkanen]

This is true. However, I don't think the issue is so much the production out of our 3rd and 4th lines, it's more the ability to produce when placed in other roles. You've got to have depth to win in this league and injuries are just one factor.

Yes, that was really the issue with the Kings. They have so many players on their roster where if you did reward them with more ice time or PP time their stats would remain constant. If you're talking about having a roster that is faster and attacks the center of the ice more Nick Shore is not your guy. Kempe at 3C is a much better option with unknown upside. Your 3d line needs to be capable of playing on the 2nd line, if you did a 3d line of Brodz-Kempe-Brown I think you have that.

 

[Kings4thecup]

This is true. However, I don't think the issue is so much the production out of our 3rd and 4th lines, it's more the ability to produce when placed in other roles. You've got to have depth to win in this league and injuries are just one factor.

Totally true on this team last year. The big problem was that top line players didn't produce or were injured, thus making 3rd and 4th line players have to play up in the line-up and also not produce. If the top line players were producing somewhat and the Kings were top 15 offensively, no one would care if Shore only had 6 goals but played a great defensive game, wins his faceoffs, and plays the PK.

 

[damacles1156]

Totally true on this team last year. The big problem was that top line players didn't produce or were injured, thus making 3rd and 4th line players have to play up in the line-up and also not produce. If the top line players were producing somewhat and the Kings were top 15 offensively, no one would care if Shore only had 6 goals but played a great defensive game, wins his faceoffs, and plays the PK.

Correct,

The Bottom six actually played really well, and was productive for the Kings last season.

 

[BigKing]

Shore is just fine as a 4C that can play PK and take face offs.

Problem is more at 3C where Dowd can't survive with his lack of defensive skills. He's kind of like Vinny from 2016 where it is all offense and he needs someone with some skill to play with.

Very small sample size, but he looked much better with Brodz on his wing. Dowd has good vision but needs another guy with vision/IQ to have there be any benefit or else he is completely wasted.

Dowd is a passer first and foremost, at least at the NHL level. Brodz is a sniper. Sutter used to talk about "pairs" with the forward lines: this could be one next season.

 

[WHOneedsSOX]

Correct,

The Bottom six actually played really well, and was productive for the Kings last season.

I matched up line vs line, D vs D in terms of goals for, for the Kings and Hawks with about a month to go in the season. At that time the Kings defense had outscored the Hawks defense. Kings 3rd and 4th lines had maybe 3 fewer goals than the Hawks 3rd and 4th lines. Kings 2nd line of Pearson-Carter-Toffoli had maybe 5 fewer goals than Panarin-Anisimov-Kane had. Kings top line of Gaborik-Kopitar-Brown had more than 30 fewer goals than Panik-Toews-Hossa. So yes, the Kings bottom 6 was fine.

 

[deeshamrock]

Yes, that was really the issue with the Kings. They have so many players on their roster where if you did reward them with more ice time or PP time their stats would remain constant. If you're talking about having a roster that is faster and attacks the center of the ice more Nick Shore is not your guy. Kempe at 3C is a much better option with unknown upside. Your 3d line needs to be capable of playing on the 2nd line, if you did a 3d line of Brodz-Kempe-Brown I think you have that.

I think that is what most Kings fans are asking for, and I would guess Stevens will implement changes like that. And hopefully Luc and Blake and move some pieces out to acquire a forward to help with that. They have AMart and Muzzin they could use if the right trade came along

 

[kings11]

I know that this is off topic/off thread but now that we've gotten a full season to see Michael Amadio, what are your opinions as to how soon we might see him up with the Kings?? In my opinion he grew his game exponentially in all areas and with an offseason of physical maturation he could be coming into camp at 6'-2", 205-210lbs with an NHL ready defensive game and untapped offensive potential.

I believe that currently he's already a better option than Nic Dowd with Trevor Lewis Taking over 4C duties and flanking Amadio with 2 vets...

Brown - Amadio - Gaborik

Clifford - Lewis - ???... whom ever we can sign or acquire for Dowd...

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I think he should at least get a cup of coffee sometime this year. He did grow a lot in Ontario. Still a bit too timid for my liking though--he was noticably more assertive in North Bay (for obvious reasons) and still needs to grow into that guy. But he sure is a hell of a playmaker. And I think his initial projection still fits--probably a very good bottom sixer with a 2C ceiling. I think if we rushed him in he could hold his own but he's better off continuing to develop his pro identity, especially on the offensive side as well as his man-strength for the board battles. Part of the reason he was so good in junior was because he was crushing those contested pucks on the boards.

 

[Legionnaire]

I know that this is off topic/off thread but now that we've gotten a full season to see Michael Amadio, what are your opinions as to how soon we might see him up with the Kings?? In my opinion he grew his game exponentially in all areas and with an offseason of physical maturation he could be coming into camp at 6'-2", 205-210lbs with an NHL ready defensive game and untapped offensive potential.

I believe that currently he's already a better option than Nic Dowd with Trevor Lewis Taking over 4C duties and flanking Amadio with 2 vets...

Brown - Amadio - Gaborik

Clifford - Lewis - ???... whom ever we can sign or acquire for Dowd...

I'd put him on Carter's wing to start.

 

[regulate]

I know that this is off topic/off thread but now that we've gotten a full season to see Michael Amadio, what are your opinions as to how soon we might see him up with the Kings?? In my opinion he grew his game exponentially in all areas and with an offseason of physical maturation he could be coming into camp at 6'-2", 205-210lbs with an NHL ready defensive game and untapped offensive potential.

I believe that currently he's already a better option than Nic Dowd with Trevor Lewis Taking over 4C duties and flanking Amadio with 2 vets...

Brown - Amadio - Gaborik

Clifford - Lewis - ???... whom ever we can sign or acquire for Dowd...

Amadio needs a another year to grow his game and physically mature. He might get a short cup of coffee depending on where the Kings are at the end of the year. And he is still very week in the face-off circle, something that needs drastic improvement for him to be an NHL center. And center is where he should play. He is defensively responsible but got lost a couple of times in the playoffs against SD that hurt the team. He really improved starting around Christmas to give a few glimpses of the player he could be. Definitely some NHL potential there.

 

[EXTRAS]

Put Justin Auger on the 4th line all ready. Geeze.

 

[King'sPawn]

I think the Kings will be better offensively than they are given credit for.

We saw the success they had in 3-on-3 when they COULDN'T play Sutter's system, due to the open ice.

Of course 5-on-5 changes the dynamic, but I think they will be near the top half of the league in goals for.