WJC: 2016 — Canada Roster Talk (Part IV)

[DyerMaker66*]

So can everyone else. Beefing after the fact and saying, "If I had chosen the team, I would have taken...", serves no purpose.

Anyway, it just seems like the same old, same old.

It serves to demonstrate how out to lunch HC can be and as a reminder that the position others hold over us does not preclude us from ridiculing the poor decisions they've made, nor does it mean that every one of their decisions is better than what ours would have been.

People that mistake far too often.

 

[Leaf19]

Was it just my homer glasses or has Dermott been one of our best D-men so far? I want non-leaf fan opinions on his play.

He just plays such a simple and effective game with quick decisions. He's really good at holding the line and keeping the play in the offensive zone and I don't think I saw him make any mistakes today other than one play where he got beat but got back in time to stop the play. He kind of reminds me of Rielly in the way that once he gets the puck in his own zone, he turns around and skates to the blue line then makes a solid first pass to the forward and into the offensive zone. He also has a bomb of a shot from the point and he uses it to both direct the puck toward the net and to just keep the play going when hes holding the line. Personally he has impressed me more than Sanheim (no attack at all at on Sanheim, he's an excellent prospect) so far with his defensive play, offensively they've been pretty similar. Sanheim has been much more dynamic but Dermott more effective. But this could just be my homer glasses tbh

 

[Atomos2]

I said this in the game thread as a response to a poster but it makes more sense if I say it here:
Id rather they split up Hicketts and Chabot. I havent been all that impressed with that pairing. Chabot looked awesome in the pretournament games but has really been underwhelming in the first two real games. I expected more based on his earlier performances. I'd do

Fleury - Hicketts
Chabot - Dermott
Sanheim - Hickey
Mckeown

Hickey needs to play less minutes.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I'm looking for Fleury and Hicketts to rise to the top for us. Both should be Team Canada's best defencemen this year. And both can be as we get deeper into the tournament

 

[flyershockey]

None of the defensemen have separated themselves from the pack, imo. They've all had some nice plays and some bad ones.

 

[Peasy]

Regardless its going to be tough for Canada to finish first, so they'll likely end up facing a tougher opponent in the Fins or Czechs.

 

[Striiker]

I said this in the game thread as a response to a poster but it makes more sense if I say it here:
Id rather they split up Hicketts and Chabot. I havent been all that impressed with that pairing. Chabot looked awesome in the pretournament games but has really been underwhelming in the first two real games. I expected more based on his earlier performances. I'd do

Fleury - Hicketts
Chabot - Dermott
Sanheim - Hickey
Mckeown

Hickey needs to play less minutes.

Sanheim-Hicketts
Fleury-Dermott
Chabot-Hickey

The top two pairs should be getting roughly the same amount of icetime and significantly more than the third pairing.

Then if they're down a goal late and need offense put Sanheim and Dermott together (I think they fit well together today) and play the hell out of them.

 

[PWJunior]

I don't understand why Beauvillier and Barzal aren't attached at the hip. They clearly have chemistry together. They were linemates at the U-18's and were together at the rookie camp+training camp with the Isles. Beauvillier should be getting more ice time than he is, he's a goal scorer. Didn't he light it up in the pre-tourney games? What gives? Seemed like he had a girlfriend at the Draft, so I don't think he nailed the coach's daughter or anything.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Unless I miscalculated, we need to beat Sweden by 4 to win the pool and beat Sweden by 2 to finish 2nd.

If we win by 2, the U.S. wins the pool and we get 2nd because Canada will be even and Sweden -1.

Best case scenario, based on likelihood, is we finish 3rd and the Czechs beat Finland.

If Canada beats Sweden by 4 they will win the group if we win by 3 then it will come down to a goals scored tie breaker that is still to be determined so we will see how the next few days play out.

 

[YMCMBYOLO]

Sanheim-Hicketts
Fleury-Dermott
Chabot-Hickey

The top two pairs should be getting roughly the same amount of icetime and significantly more than the third pairing.

Then if they're down a goal late and need offense put Sanheim and Dermott together (I think they fit well together today) and play the hell out of them.

Meanwhile Hickey has been better than Fleury and Hicketts and is put on the 3rd pairing..

 

[86Habs]

I think shaking up the lineup depends on how risk averse Lowry is. The Stephens line is effective with Konecny as the main engine in the offensive zone. Virtanen is a good fit for an energy line, but that line as a whole might suffer if Konecny is gone. Not sure what should be done. Beauvillier clearly does need regular minutes. I wouldn't take Quenneville out of the regular rotation though (I would take Chartier out) because he is a big part of the PK.

It's difficult to figure out what to do with Virtanen. People are unhappy with him for reasons that I don't quite understand, but he is going to be important against more physical teams. He looked like a bad fit with Strome though.

I don't know what to think about Marner with Point. I didn't like Marner today, but he did produce. He's still too easy on the puck and needs to move more quickly against good teams. No one on the team has his vision or hands though. There has to be a place for him, not sure where it is.

Barzal is very good. Lowry penciling in Barzal as 13th forward earlier and Beauvillier as 13th forward now really makes me wonder.

I don't like what Lowry is doing with the last pairing. Pick two of Dermott, McKeown and Sanheim and play them regularly. I would prefer not McKeown, but it should at least be someone.

Overall I suspect Lowry will maintain the status quo for the Swiss game tomorrow in terms of line combinations and defence pairings.

I have a slight preference for Chartier over Quenneville as he brings more tenacity and offensive creativity (while Quenneville seems sturdier defensively), but I'm mainly indifferent. I thought Chartier was quite good today actually. The fact is neither guy is good enough to be playing top 6 minutes when Beauvillier and Gauthier in particular are seeing limited ice time, but it does make sense to get the PKers a somewhat regular shift to keep them warm.

I'm also at a bit of a loss with what to do with Virtanen. Again I suspect he'll be with Strome again tomorrow but that doesn't mean it's the right answer. I really do think a winger with more offensive creativity would work better with Strome, who is shaping up to be the driving offensive force on this team. Beauvillier and Gauthier (currently under-utilized) and Konecny (currently a good fit with his line) come to mind, but moving Gauthier up to Strome's wing would result presumably in Virtanen dropping down to the fourth line, which is a politically unwise move. You're right in that removing Konecny from the Stephens line may reduce the effectiveness of that line, but at this time I personally think it's worth trying something different to get Strome going 5 on 5. I really haven't been a fan of Virtanen's game yet this tournament and similar to last year he may have a difficult time meshing with his line mates. I didn't find him to be particularly effective against the U.S., despite him presumably being of more use against a more physical team. He's good when he's driving the offense from the wing on the rush, but not as adept at cycling or setting up a more structured attack on the o-zone. I'd like to see him in a more limited, north-south energy-type role in which he's not relied upon to produce offensively. But that's probably not going to happen.

I think today's version of Marner is probably the best we're going to see. This is largely the way he performs against OHL competition from what I've seen of him and London, and is prone to being too cute or turning the puck over at times. Obviously he makes up for these shortcomings and then some, when he's on his game. If he can maintain today's level of play and production against stiffer competition then that's all we can hope for I think.

Like you I'd like to see a clear cut third pairing (Sanheim and Dermott, preferably) instead of the current three-man rotation.

 

[Cotton]

Sanheim-Hicketts
Fleury-Dermott
Chabot-Hickey

The top two pairs should be getting roughly the same amount of icetime and significantly more than the third pairing.

Then if they're down a goal late and need offense put Sanheim and Dermott together (I think they fit well together today) and play the hell out of them.

Sanheim hasn't exactly played much better than Chabot though. If we are down a goal late I'd feel better seeing Dermott play the left side with Hicketts or using a 4th forward than playing Sanheim. I already know you'll disagree, but that's just my opinion.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

If Canada beats Sweden by 4 they will win the group if we win by 3 then it will come down to a goals scored tie breaker that is still to be determined so we will see how the next few days play out.

I believe you're incorrect. If we win by 4 (or more), we win the pool, Sweden is 2nd and the U.S. is third - it is moot; we are not winning by 4.

If we win by 1, 2 or 3, the U.S. is first and we are second, Sweden 3rd.

If we win in OT or lose, Sweden finishes first, the U.S. is second and we are 3rd.

As I said before, I do NOT want the Fins in the Quarters.

 

[Striiker]

Sanheim hasn't exactly played much better than Chabot though. If we are down a goal late I'd feel better seeing Dermott play the left side with Hicketts or using a 4th forward than playing Sanheim. I already know you'll disagree, but that's just my opinion.

Well yeah I do disagree but that's your opinion and there's nothing wrong with that.

I definitely think he's been better than Chabot and far more dangerous when in the offensive zone. I think Sanheim and Dermott are the two best offensive defensemen on this team and if Canada wants/needs a goal then they're their best chance as far as defensemen are concerned.

Like I said, the only time I've been worked up about posts pertaining so Sanheim is when it's something thats blatantly false. I'm not going to tell you that you that you have to love him or anything ridiculous like that. I know not everyone will agree with me and I'm not going to be able to convince people to see it the way I do, but that's fine.

 

[Heldig]

Let's hope the team plays well versus the Swiss and dont look at it as a gimme game. They may not be that good this year but they always seem to give Team Canada fits.

 

[Alerion]

A nice offensive effort today, but its tough getting a read on the line combinations against such weak competition. A few things are clear to me, though:

- Quenneville should not be in the top-6. Full stop.

- Marner and Point seem like a perfect match together and I thought both guys had great games today.

- Barzal and Konecny were both electric today. Both guys created opportunities every time they were on the ice, and Konecny is such a dynamic skater and puck handler that he seems a bit wasted on the third line.

- Virtanen had a relatively poor game today and didn't seem to mesh well with Strome. Based on what I've seen over the course of these two games I don't like Virtanen in a scoring role on this team; similar to last year he has a one-track mind with the puck on his stick, and shoots from wherever he happens to be. Strome likes to patiently set up shop in the offensive zone and work the play from there, and him and Virtanen never seemed to be in rhythm. Virtanen is probably better suited to an energy line role on this team.

- Beauvillier deserves more ice time than he's been given, but inexplicably hasn't appeared to earned Lowry's trust yet.

- Stephens, Crouse and Chartier had good games today. Crouse was especially noticeable.

- No real observations on the defence. I like Hickey a lot, as well as Hicketts. I thought Sanheim played well today. McKeown shouldn't see much ice as we move along.

I'd like to see the following forward group against the Swiss tomorrow:

Perlini - Point - Marner
Beauvillier - Strome - Konecny
Crouse - Stephens - Virtanen
Chartier - Barzal - Gauthier
Quenneville

While I thought Perlini was good today, I'd like to see his size, speed and forechecking ability as complimentary to the Point-Marner combination. He couldn't capitalize on some prime scoring chances today, but is doing the right things.

Beauvillier and Konecny both have better offensive instincts than Virtanen and have skillsets that should compliment Strome's nicely.

It's a shame Barzal and Gauthier ended up on the 4th line, but Lowry seems committed to Barzal at C and so far they are still seeing a good amount of ES and PP ice time.

Great post, I agree with every point. The CSK line has been together since the second pre-tournament game and is a great checking line, but Konecny certainly has the speed/skill beyond what Stephens and Crouse possess. I'd still like to see that line together in important shutdown minutes because it's defensively responsible while still offensively threatening thanks to Konecny's skill and Crouse's presence in front of the net. If we're pressed for offense, however, it makes sense to bump Konecny up.

If minutes were being handed out on merit right now Barzal would be playing on the top line and Virtanen would be plummeting down the roster. He doesn't seem to have any of the physicality that he had a year ago; whether that's a conscious effort due to the European officials (I swear they call it tighter when it's hosted overseas) or just him being off his game is up in the air, but Canada needs that chippy side of his play against Sweden and other teams of their ilk.

Lowry is in a tough position in that he has a logjam at center and then a couple passengers on the wing in the top 6.

 

[Alex91]

Best players: Strome, Barzal, Marner, Point, Dermott, Sanheim.

Need to improve: Virtanen, Konecny, Hicketts.

Konecny does not belong in that group. If anything he belongs in best players.

 

[saintflannel]

Too bad they don't keep ice-time as a stat in this tournament. I would love to see what Virtanen's ice-time was yesterday. I barely noticed him.

 

[snipes]

I know politics will play a role and prevent this, but Virtanen should be the 13th forward with the way he's played. He needs to have a big game tomorrow, I think he'll step up.

 

[leafsfuture]

I know politics will play a role and prevent this, but Virtanen should be the 13th forward with the way he's played. He needs to have a big game tomorrow, I think he'll step up.

He needs a goal.

As many have noted, he plays a pretty simple game - get the puck, go to the net, shoot it.

Problem right now is that he doesnt seem to have a lot of confidence in his shot.

 

[snipes]

He needs a goal.

As many have noted, he plays a pretty simple game - get the puck, go to the net, shoot it.

Problem right now is that he doesnt seem to have a lot of confidence in his shot.

Agreed and get the physical game going.

 

[Soups On]

He needs a goal.

As many have noted, he plays a pretty simple game - get the puck, go to the net, shoot it.

Problem right now is that he doesnt seem to have a lot of confidence in his shot.

Pretty much. He's not playing his game right now and it's obvious. He hasn't progressed like we Canucks have hoped and it's been disappointing, regardless if it's because of his shoulder surgery.

He has such a wicked shot but since that surgery, it's been wildly inaccurate and he has no confidence in it. In his draft year he was picking corners at will and his backhand was lethal too. It's just not there right now and it's frustrating as a Canucks fan and as a Canadian because if he was playing to his potential, everyone would be giddy over him. He can be an X factor but he's looked like the ultimate passenger. As tough as it is to say that as a Canucks fan, it's the truth.

Personally, I've liked Virtanen a lot more on the left wing. He has the big body to drive wide on the backhand and take the puck to the net on his forehand or back the defence off with his speed and cut to the middle to release his shot.

He's got such beast-like tools but without his confidence, he's playing too passive. It's like he read this board last year where everyone harped on him for not passing enough and now he's passing when he should drive the night and shooting when he should pass.

On a somewhat unrelated note, I was praying Benning could move up and grab Barzal. Figured he'd climb up the rankings this tournament and am not surprised he's been the best Canadian.

 

[A1LeafNation]

whens dermotts draft year. he looks like a soon to be solid nhl dman

 

[xxxx]

Regardless its going to be tough for Canada to finish first, so they'll likely end up facing a tougher opponent in the Fins or Czechs.

All the better imo. It would be nice to dominate three strong teams in the playoffs, on international ice, you know, where we haven't won the World Juniors since 2008

To win the group, a win by a 3-goal difference over Sweden is needed, if I got it right.

Swe - 1:0
Can - 2:4
Usa - 4:3

If the factor here is the score with each other, Sweden is automatically third if we beat them, and any win by 3 goals should give us the first place.

I think there's also a very good chance we meet Finland in the quarter-finals.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

All the better imo. It would be nice to dominate three strong teams in the playoffs, on international ice, you know, where we haven't won the World Juniors since 2008

To win the group, a win by a 3-goal difference is needed, if I got it right.

Swe - 1:0
Can - 2:4
Usa - 4:3

If the factor here is the score with each other, Sweden is automatically third if we beat them, And any win by 3 goals should give us the first place.

I think there's also a very good chance we meet Finland in the quarter-finals.

We are minus 2 and a 3 goal win would leave us at +1 and tied with the U.S. - to whom we lost. We need plus 4 to finish 1st - and that is not going to happen.