2015/16 Wishlist

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I haven't been calling for Holland's head, but it's not like criticism is uncalled for. He hasn't really made a good pro transaction outside of re-signing a hall of famer(or signing a hall of famer to a one year deal sort of thing) since 2008. The majority of his contracts, signings, and trades have been mediocre to downright awful, even ones I thought would be good.(Like Weiss.) If Holland and his staff couldn't draft(which fortunately they have been very good at), I'd really hate to see where we'd be right now.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

The Wings have been irrelevant for 6 years. it's getting a little frustrating is all.

Now think of all those teams who have never really been relevant. The Wings don't have it so bad.

 

[Heaton]

I get the more recent term argument but really interesting to see 2009 wiped from his record where they had the best team in the league and lost in the finals.

In the next two years they had a team that was ultimately outcoached by a former assistant but had contender status. Even the Nashville loss was a team that was viewed as a serious contender until injuries completely derailed them after the trade deadline.

In the past three seasons they have been weaker as the rebuild on the fly hasn't allowed them to be quite as good. However I completely disagree with putting this back to whenever the last cup was, in my opinion that comes far short of evaluating the team enough.

We will see what he does this off-season, Holland didn't become an idiot over night and he hasn't destroyed our future just yet. For those interested he is still following the comments he suggested coming out of the big lockout that already brought us a championship once and a finals appearance. Curious to see what his tweaks are, they have been slower than any of us want, but he hasn't driven this thing off a cliff yet as many seem to suggest. Not following that and it certainly doesn't date as far back in terms of this team not icing a team with serious championship caliber and aspirations seem to indicate. Winning a Stanley cup is a little tougher than I think many give it credit for.

I understand frustration, but there really is still a lot to be excited about with this team and their future. Some disagree and I accept that, others like me simply don't have the sky is falling mentality. I also don't agree with the timeline when this all went sour being bandied about a lot in this thread.

Expectations are high with this team so they have disappointed for a variety of reasons. But they really can be quite good and return to the area we expect with a couple of tweaks through the trade deadline of next year. Important year for Holland.

the problem is there is no reason to think Holland can make those tweaks.

 

[InjuredChoker]

this team still has a lot of issues with myers. maybe more in the future considering the cost to get him. only pardy had worse corsi on jets D after myers was traded there. petry is also similar level player now, #3 and went for 2nd and 5th.

 

[Frk It]

We will see what he does this off-season, Holland didn't become an idiot over night and he hasn't destroyed our future just yet. For those interested he is still following the comments he suggested coming out of the big lockout that already brought us a championship once and a finals appearance. Curious to see what his tweaks are, they have been slower than any of us want, but he hasn't driven this thing off a cliff yet as many seem to suggest. Not following that and it certainly doesn't date as far back in terms of this team not icing a team with serious championship caliber and aspirations seem to indicate. Winning a Stanley cup is a little tougher than I think many give it credit for.

I understand frustration, but there really is still a lot to be excited about with this team and their future. Some disagree and I accept that, others like me simply don't have the sky is falling mentality. I also don't agree with the timeline when this all went sour being bandied about a lot in this thread.

Expectations are high with this team so they have disappointed for a variety of reasons. But they really can be quite good and return to the area we expect with a couple of tweaks through the trade deadline of next year. Important year for Holland.

Appreciate your optimism, though I think it is quite a bit of blind hope based on what Holland has done in the past.

Do tell though, how is the defense going to get better?

The one defenseman I thought had legit high-end potential, Sproul, looks like hot garbage right now. Marchenko looked totally lost in the play-offs, and is injury prone to boot. Ouellet really faded as the season went on, which I was hoping/thinking the opposite would happen. Jensen is about to be 25, with 0 NHL games to his name.

Then we have a GM whose free agent signings since Rafalski in 07 has consisted of: White, Commodore, Huskins, Quincey. He has been linked to trades that could have helped the team (Myers, Bogosian), but never been able to execute one.

So what is he going to do to fix this? Because nothing I've seen from him the last 4 years indicates to me at all that that is going to happen.

 

[Frk It]

this team still has a lot of issues with myers. maybe more in the future considering the cost to get him. only pardy had worse corsi on jets D after myers was traded there. petry is also similar level player now, #3 and went for 2nd and 5th.

If by similar player, you mean half as good offensively, then yes.

 

[Tatar]

He literally doesn't ****ing get it and that's why he fumbled away Tyler Myers. He's well past his prime, and that's why I'm looking forward to the rebuild. If he doesn't get it then hell, let's watch the bottom fall out and hope we can get a Doughty or Toews like prospect to prepare for the eventual rebound.

I'm glad we didn't get Meyers. I watched him extensively when the trade rumors began whirling, he buckels under pressure, makes poor defensive decisions and his skating is far below par. Im also fairly certain he has max out his potential. After the conclusion of his current contract in 2018, he'll want a Chara type contract for 7+ million. To pay what Buffalo would have wanted for a trade and have him eat 1/10 of our cap after 2018 is ludicrous.

 

[evolutionbaby]

I'm glad we didn't get Meyers. I watched him extensively when the trade rumors began whirling, he buckels under pressure, makes poor defensive decisions and his skating is far below par. Im also fairly certain he has max out his potential. After the conclusion of his current contract in 2018, he'll want a Chara type contract for 7+ million. To pay what Buffalo would have wanted for a trade and have him eat 1/10 of our cap after 2018 is ludicrous.

Myers was very, very good with the Jets after the trade.

The one thing about Holland is, we are remaining competitive, maybe on the brink of much more. He will keep us at that level no matter what, but if he does finally get a hit on a trade or FA with the types of offers he's been sending out, then maybe we take it to the next level.

 

[Retire91]

Appreciate your optimism, though I think it is quite a bit of blind hope based on what Holland has done in the past.

Do tell though, how is the defense going to get better?

The one defenseman I thought had legit high-end potential, Sproul, looks like hot garbage right now. Marchenko looked totally lost in the play-offs, and is injury prone to boot. Ouellet really faded as the season went on, which I was hoping/thinking the opposite would happen. Jensen is about to be 25, with 0 NHL games to his name.

Then we have a GM whose free agent signings since Rafalski in 07 has consisted of: White, Commodore, Huskins, Quincey. He has been linked to trades that could have helped the team (Myers, Bogosian), but never been able to execute one.

So what is he going to do to fix this? Because nothing I've seen from him the last 4 years indicates to me at all that that is going to happen.

LOL let's add Carlo Colaiacovo to that list who Holland felt the need to use a get out of jail free buyout on.

 

[Frk It]

LOL let's add Carlo Colaiacovo to that list who Holland felt the need to use a get out of jail free buyout on.

It's just been repeated crap from the 99 cent bin.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Throughout these past six years, the Wings were never one player away from contending, and even if they were, that one player wasn't Carlo Coliacovo, an aging Mike Modano, Marek Zidlicky, etc, etc...

Wings got beat by the Sharks both those years because the roster wasn't good enough and Holland thought bringing in a player from the scrap heap was the difference between a win and a loss. He refused to take even the the smallest risk to improve the roster, and we were left watching teams that were destined to lose in the playoffs.

Lidstrom's retirement was the end of any chance at lucking into another trip to the Finals.

The Wings defense has been the culprit for every playoff loss since 2009-2010, and Holland has either done nothing to address that problem or made the wrong move.



Another player on my wish list is Hedman. He is a FA in two years and i really hope the Wings at least get the opportunity to steal him away, but it sounds very unlikely to happen since Yzerman isn't an idiot.

 

[SirloinUB]

Throughout these past six years, the Wings were never one player away from contending, and even if they were, that one player wasn't Carlo Coliacovo, an aging Mike Modano, Marek Zidlicky, etc, etc...

Wings got beat by the Sharks both those years because the roster wasn't good enough and Holland thought bringing in a player from the scrap heap was the difference between a win and a loss. He refused to take even the the smallest risk to improve the roster, and we were left watching teams that were destined to lose in the playoffs.

Lidstrom's retirement was the end of any chance at lucking into another trip to the Finals.

The Wings defense has been the culprit for every playoff loss since 2009-2010, and Holland has either done nothing to address that problem or made the wrong move.

You raise valid points. Maybe Had holland gotten bold, we could have had another deep playoff run.

That said, Holland's risk adverse nature over the last 5ish seasons has left the team in a fairly strong position. We have cap space to play with, young, valuable forwards, and a great crop of prospects. Its not always easy, but there certainly is some merit to the patient, risk adverse mindset.

 

[Frk It]

You raise valid points. Maybe Had holland gotten bold, we could have had another deep playoff run.

That said, Holland's risk adverse nature over the last 5ish seasons has left the team in a fairly strong position. We have cap space to play with, young, valuable forwards, and a great crop of prospects. Its not always easy, but there certainly is some merit to the patient, risk adverse mindset.

Up front, yes. Still in the same boat on the blue line. You know, the POS row boat we have been bailing water out of for 4 years.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

You raise valid points. Maybe Had holland gotten bold, we could have had another deep playoff run.

That said, Holland's risk adverse nature over the last 5ish seasons has left the team in a fairly strong position. We have cap space to play with, young, valuable forwards, and a great crop of prospects. Its not always easy, but there certainly is some merit to the patient, risk adverse mindset.

Forward position looks good, assuming Mantha rebounds and Larkin is legit. You also have some excellent complimentary players in Nyquist and Tatar.

Unfortunately he has not shown he is capable of fixing the Wings primary weakness. You can have the best forwards on the planet, but if your defense is suspect, you just aren't going to have any success in the playoffs. Whether it's FA or drafting, Holland has failed miserably on both fronts. If you can't draft and can't attract FA's, you can't build a cup contending defense.

 

[Bench]

Up front, yes. Still in the same boat on the blue line.

I'll keep beating this drum.

Kronwall -
DeKeyser -
Ericsson -

That entire right side needs new players. Ericsson on the PK and 3rd unit suddenly looks a hell of a lot better, we all agree. I'm not going to bend over to ship out the only defender in the Wings organization with some actual muscle to his game, either.

 

[Frk It]

I'll keep beating this drum.

Kronwall -
DeKeyser -
Ericsson -

That entire right side needs new players. Ericsson on the PK and 3rd unit suddenly looks a hell of a lot better, we all agree. I'm not going to bend over to ship out the only defender in the Wings organization with some actual muscle to his game, either.

I'm all for gutting this defense.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

I'll keep beating this drum.

Kronwall - Some random
DeKeyser - Quincey could work
Ericsson - Ouellet

That entire right side needs new players. Ericsson on the PK and 3rd unit suddenly looks a hell of a lot better, we all agree. I'm not going to bend over to ship out the only defender in the Wings organization with some actual muscle to his game, either.

fixed

 

[WingedWheel1987]

I'll keep beating this drum.

Kronwall -
DeKeyser -
Ericsson -

That entire right side needs new players. Ericsson on the PK and 3rd unit suddenly looks a hell of a lot better, we all agree. I'm not going to bend over to ship out the only defender in the Wings organization with some actual muscle to his game, either.

Ericsson's physicality isn't worth 4.25 million right now. Can you imagine the train wreck he will be three years from now? His contract will still have another two years left on it by that point. I wouldn't be so upset with his deal if i thought the Wings had a GM who didn't think almost every player on the team was part of the core.

That roster spot is locked up for the next five years.


Regarding Bruce Joker's post about Quincey.

I personally don't think bringing Quincey back is a good idea He is a FA in one season and you can be sure that he is going to want some financial security. You are looking at another Jonathan Ericsson type contract. Probably looking at four more years of Quincey and at his age, he will only get worse.

 

[odin1981]

I'll keep beating this drum.

Kronwall -
DeKeyser -
Ericsson -

That entire right side needs new players. Ericsson on the PK and 3rd unit suddenly looks a hell of a lot better, we all agree. I'm not going to bend over to ship out the only defender in the Wings organization with some actual muscle to his game, either.

The one problem Bench is that Big Rig has spent his whole NHL career on his off side. Now it isn't a big deal but more than likely that solidifies a 2nd pairing of DDK and Big Rig. XO can take the third pairing ld spot. Our left side is set for years. But the big issue we have had is that the right top pairing is left open. And in all reality outside of Strahlman last year and Suter top pairing d really do not hit the market often.

If Seabrook hits UFA we have to aggresively go after him. I wouldn't want a max term deal but I would offer a 5-6 year 7.5 million no problem.

 

[wings95]

Nice to know he can rest on the laurels of his success from 1997-2008 to excuse him from any criticism.

Did I say he has excuses or rest as you say? No. We,as fans, do not know 100% of what goes on behind closed doors with contract or trade negotiations, or do some?? Like some of you, I feel some changes/upgrades need to be made but at what price? Why sell off your most prized prospects when you have kids down on the farm who may or may not be as good a fit as the other player and when you get rid of the Tats, Larkins or Peter than what do you have to replace them???

 

[Debrincat93]

The one problem Bench is that Big Rig has spent his whole NHL career on his off side. Now it isn't a big deal but more than likely that solidifies a 2nd pairing of DDK and Big Rig. XO can take the third pairing ld spot. Our left side is set for years. But the big issue we have had is that the right top pairing is left open. And in all reality outside of Strahlman last year and Suter top pairing d really do not hit the market often.

If Seabrook hits UFA we have to aggresively go after him. I wouldn't want a max term deal but I would offer a 5-6 year 7.5 million no problem.

Seabrook is great and all but lets be realistic here.
5-6 years put him into 36-37 territory, on top of playing A LOT of playoff games (being beat up). He is durable right now but lets not get ourselves completely destroyed once again by a long-term deal on an aging player. I really, really like Seabrook but I think by the time he is a UFA, we might need to be looking at someone else. But only time will tell.

 

[Bench]

Ericsson's physicality isn't worth 4.25 million right now.

It's not about value, it's the right fit. If he's overpaid, that's fine, he fills a need on the current blueline. That could change moving forward, but right now he's the only guy that other defenders even fear other than the dying Kronwalling.

The one problem Bench is that Big Rig has spent his whole NHL career on his off side.

That's fine. It's not so much about side as it is recognizing Quincey, Smith, Kindl, and Zidlicky shouldn't have a future on this current team. Book is out on Marchenko and Ouellet. We'll see. Their ceilings don't appear to be too high, though.

 

[InjuredChoker]

If by similar player, you mean half as good offensively, then yes.

myers isn't that good offensively.

 

[SirloinUB]

Up front, yes. Still in the same boat on the blue line. You know, the POS row boat we have been bailing water out of for 4 years.

I believe as a whole we are in a relatively strong position. As you said, the forwards look good. Kronwall should have a good 3 years of solid hockey in him. DDK is a nice piece, Marchenko and Ouellet are certainly useful. I completely agree the D needs work, but at least we have pieces to dangle in an effort to improve the D. And I don't think the D is *that* far off.

Its funny, at the time I was adverse to moving Nyquists, Ouellet, a Pick, etc. for a Myers or Petry. With the benefit of hindsight, both of those players looked a lot better when they got on a real team.

I'm at the point where I want Holland to make a move. If he does something bold(ish), I won't even hold it against him if it backfires. I guess what I am saying, Is I'll give Holland a get out of jail card on his next move If he bucks up and does something of decent significance..

It's a little bit impulsive/reactionary, but please, can we just take a swing on something.

A Nyquist for Vatanen would sting. As would 6 Million for Petry. Maybe these TYPES of moves, bite us in the butt over the long term, but its time we attempt to address the issues on the back end. Its beyond clear that the solution isn't coming from inside the organization.

 

[Frk It]

myers isn't that good offensively.

Myers
Career PPG- .426

Petry
Career PPG- .257

I guess Petry is slightly better than half as good offensively. But the two aren't close.

You see Myers during his 24 games in WPG? I'll bet you see him surpass 35 pts next year.