Pre-Game Talk: 2013-2014 Rangers pre-season discussion

[eco's bones]

Dorsett pretty much cemented his spot in the NHL by the time he hit 23. Prust did the same at 25. Neither was playing for particularly good teams. Dorsett is three years younger and has played almost the same amount of games with about the same ratio and amount of production. He is a bit better skater. He is a pretty good penalty killer. Prust is a very good penalty killer too. He's a tougher player. He's also a real leader--not that Dorsett is a problem to have in your locker room. Generally they play the same style of game. Who the better player is just about like choosing who is the better looking of two identical twins but I'd give the edge to Dorsett for being younger and a slightly better skater. I wasn't thinking in terms of cap hit but there's that too. It's also true that Derek is more prone to the dumb ass penalty. Prust again beats Dorsett 9 out of 10 times in a fight. Dorsett is a very willing guy but he doesn't win all that many. Prust does and more that just occasionally has embarrassed much bigger opponents. He's good at sorting out who is really tough from who is not.

 

[NYR2007]

You are basing Prust off the one career year he had with us. do you remember the year after that, because that type of player is the one that prust is most years.

Their offense is EXTREMELY similar. Dorsett actually hits more then Prust and imo is more effective when he is on the ice.

He takes way more shots and has more natural talent then Prust. He is younger, on a much better contract and brings more to the table then prust imo.

Just because he isn't as good a fighter, doesn't make him a lesser player.

Regardless of contract, if i had to pick one for my team, it would be Dorsett. We got Prust for a career year, one that he will likely not replicate again. Prust is not a 13-15 goal scorer.

well said

 

[NYR Viper]

Ok guys a little I picked up digging around
As I stated at the draft team likes Mashinter and his size . They gave him a few shifts with Nash last time he played. And he may stick as extra forward or first call up once they pushed around.

JT Miller jumped past Kreider last night in coaching staffs eyes in one game ..
Bickel still here cause he is dirt cheap but I was told they have sent feelers out for a trade ..
More then one player of interest on waivers but nhl contracts are at a premium

Connor Allen has really impressed the staff with his work ..
Team is down on d numbers 7-9 big time none have stood out or looked impressive at all..
Now more bad news the undertaker knee still not 100% and did not play a second pre season game because of being to sore! not a good sign
Haley just didn't show enough physically or offensively he did impress on ok.

Dagoon very much appreciated

 

[16 To Stanley*]

There's no maybes.

It's an easy choice.

No it's not and like a lot of Rangers fans, you have an inflated opinion of the player that Prust is, because he and Boyle had a career year here.

Everyone was so shocked when Prust fell back to earth after scoring 13 goals for us. Like it or not, that "earth" player is him, not the one we saw score and put up "points" with Boyle.

Dorsett is the better all around player. He has less miles on him, is younger and is more effective. Prust is a very highly glorified 4th liner.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

Ok guys a little I picked up digging around
As I stated at the draft team likes Mashinter and his size . They gave him a few shifts with Nash last time he played. And he may stick as extra forward or first call up once they pushed around.

JT Miller jumped past Kreider last night in coaching staffs eyes in one game ..
Bickel still here cause he is dirt cheap but I was told they have sent feelers out for a trade ..
More then one player of interest on waivers but nhl contracts are at a premium

Connor Allen has really impressed the staff with his work ..
Team is down on d numbers 7-9 big time none have stood out or looked impressive at all..
Now more bad news the undertaker knee still not 100% and did not play a second pre season game because of being to sore! not a good sign
Haley just didn't show enough physically or offensively he did impress on ok.

Thanks, who is the undertaker...sorry.

 

[NYR Viper]

I was high on Mashinter last year. He isn't as bad of a skater as many here believe he is. He is a good overall player for someone who can fight heavies every now and then and he has good hands for his role. I was hoping one of Haley or Mashinter would make the team. Now my hopes lie with Mashinter.

Get rid of Bickel please...

 

[3rdlineglory]

No it's not and like a lot of Rangers fans, you have an inflated opinion of the player that Prust is, because he and Boyle had a career year here.

Everyone was so shocked when Prust fell back to earth after scoring 13 goals for us. Like it or not, that "earth" player is him, not the one we saw score and put up "points" with Boyle.

Dorsett is the better all around player. He has less miles on him, is younger and is more effective. Prust is a very highly glorified 4th liner.

And in that career year he also got tons of minutes considering how many of the other forwards were injured.

 

[NYR2007]

Prust and Boyle playing so well that year got us to be the Eastern Conf. Champs

 

[silverfish]

Ok guys a little I picked up digging around
As I stated at the draft team likes Mashinter and his size . They gave him a few shifts with Nash last time he played. And he may stick as extra forward or first call up once they pushed around.

JT Miller jumped past Kreider last night in coaching staffs eyes in one game ..
Bickel still here cause he is dirt cheap but I was told they have sent feelers out for a trade ..
More then one player of interest on waivers but nhl contracts are at a premium

Connor Allen has really impressed the staff with his work ..
Team is down on d numbers 7-9 big time none have stood out or looked impressive at all..
Now more bad news the undertaker knee still not 100% and did not play a second pre season game because of being to sore! not a good sign
Haley just didn't show enough physically or offensively he did impress on ok.

Thanks for this, Dagoon.

 

[E-Train]

I was high on Mashinter last year. He isn't as bad of a skater as many here believe he is. He is a good overall player for someone who can fight heavies every now and then and he has good hands for his role. I was hoping one of Haley or Mashinter would make the team. Now my hopes lie with Mashinter.

Get rid of Bickel please...

Agreed. The way the roster is shaking out I would think Mash makes it. He's a better fighter than Bickel and a better 4th line option.

 

[nyr2k2]

Thanks, who is the undertaker...sorry.

McIlrath.

 

[3rdlineglory]

Also can anyone objectively tell me if Pyatt deserves to still be around? A part of me wants him gone considering how boring and ineffective his play is on the surface. But another part of me realizes that he is not the flashy type and has put up solid numbers prior to coming to the Rangers. Maybe with a lesser role and additional competition for a roster spot he could hopefully do better. I know he wore the A in one game and there are claims that A.V. "loves" Pyatt, but it could just be people trying to be provocative on here (like usual.)

 

[3rdlineglory]

Prust and Boyle playing so well that year got us to be the Eastern Conf. Champs

Gaborik scoring 40+ and Hank having a Vezina caliber season got us there.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

Prust and Boyle playing so well that year got us to be the Eastern Conf. Champs

Ok....and the relevence of that is??

He was still playing above his head. If you look at every other year he has had, he doesn't come close to those numbers.

 

[3rdlineglory]

Ok guys a little I picked up digging around
As I stated at the draft team likes Mashinter and his size . They gave him a few shifts with Nash last time he played. And he may stick as extra forward or first call up once they pushed around.

JT Miller jumped past Kreider last night in coaching staffs eyes in one game ..
Bickel still here cause he is dirt cheap but I was told they have sent feelers out for a trade ..
More then one player of interest on waivers but nhl contracts are at a premium

Connor Allen has really impressed the staff with his work ..
Team is down on d numbers 7-9 big time none have stood out or looked impressive at all..
Now more bad news the undertaker knee still not 100% and did not play a second pre season game because of being to sore! not a good sign
Haley just didn't show enough physically or offensively he did impress on ok.

Haley just didn't seem to mesh with anyone. I want him to improve and stick around, but throwing around a bunch of random hits and "showing heart' isn't good enough.

 

[Blue Blooded]

Re: Line combos when everyone is healthy.

Forwards:

1. Nash is our main offensive threat who is one of the most dangerous 5v5 players in the league. However, he needs to play with possession players to be at his most effective. Which means he has to play with one of Hagelin and Zuccarello and preferably have Stepan as his center. Nash should always be priority #1 so even if other players prefer similar linemates (Callahan and Richards have similar needs) Nash's needs should always come first. Nash scored points at a 100% higher rate 5v5 when Hagelin was on the ice (4.26 vs 2.13 P/60). 4.26 P/60 is a mind blowing rate of production. They outscored the opposition 16-2 in their time together while dominating possession. The most dangerous duo in the league by far, beating even Crosby-Kunitz and Crosby-Dupuis.

2. Richards and Callahan should never be on the same line, they have powerful anti-chemistry. Both are mediocre at best possession players, and putting both on the same line has consistently led to the Rangers being hemmed in their own end. Richards had chemistry with Zuccarello last year, but I think that was mostly due to Zuccarello raising the game of pretty much anyone he plays with. Still, it couldn't hurt to put them together since Richards may be useless otherwise.

3. Callahan makes things tricky. He is at his best with Stepan and Hagelin, but both of them are better with other players. If he can't play with them he's had most success with grinders such as Boyle and Pyatt.

Hagelin-Stepan-Nash
Richards-Brassard-Zuccarello
Pouliot-Miller/Lindberg-Callahan
Boyle-Moore-Dorsett

Richards' uselessness forces me to break up Pouliot-Brassard-Zuccarello, but it is the only way to go if you want to keep him and Callahan apart while still icing one of the absolute best lines in the league: Hagelin-Stepan-Nash who have been too good together to break up IMO. Pouliot gets a tough break here despite his good pre-season, but someone has to play on a line with Callahan as well. If Miller or Lindberg can bring a good possession game, this line could be successful as well.

Defence:

As most of you have heard me saying during the summer, I really want to see more of the McDonagh-Strålman pairing. Del Zotto still seems to struggle with the right side and Moore has played it better in his career AFAIK. This also works with AV's premise of an offensive (McD-Strålman) and a defensive (Staal-Girardi) pairing.

McDoangh-Strålman
Staal-Girardi
Del Zotto-Moore

 

[NYR2007]

Ok....and the relevence of that is??

He was still playing above his head. If you look at every other year he has had, he doesn't come close to those numbers.

Lol I never said he is gonna come close to those numbers. I was just showing the result of having a fourth line/ third line players having career years.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

Haley just didn't seem to mesh with anyone. I want him to improve and stick around, but throwing around a bunch of random hits and "showing heart' isn't good enough.

Agreed. Mashinter has impressed me, much more than Haley. Which is surprising, because coming in I had Haley above Asham and Mashinter.

I think Asham has looked good as well.

A 4th line of Asham-Moore-Dorsett is about as nasty as it gets, while having grit and skill.

Powe hasn't shown me anything. I'd send him down/waive him. Keep the cheaper Mashinter around.

Fast-Richards-Nash
Zucc-Brassard-Pouliot
Kreider-Miller-Boyle
Asham-Moore-Dorsett

D is obvious.

When Hagelin, Stepan and Cally come back, your remove Asham, and 2 of Kreider/Miller/Fast, unless one of them blows you away, in which case, i think you sit Boyle.

So a month in, hopefully it will look something like this

Hagelin-Stepan-Nash
Zucc-Brassard-Callahan
Kreider/Miller/Fast-Richards-Pouliot
Boyle-Moore-Dorsett
Mashinter or Asham

That's an extremely deep lineup. The D is fantastic. The 4th line is basically a third line and better than pretty much any third line we iced last year.

The third line could be very good too, if one of the kids can have a solid year.

It's a very Boston-Esque lineup. No real "stars" sans Lundqvist/Nash. But a very deep and solid lineup.

If a role guys goes down it shouldn't really ruin our chances either, with Miller/Kreider/Fast etc waiting to be called up.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

O, i forgot Pyatt. Get rid of him

 

[NYR2007]

O, i forgot Pyatt. Get rid of him

NHL 14 brah .. Trade him for a second rounder

 

[Ail]

Last round of cuts will be tough. I'm not even sure who I would keep in my own bias. Miller, Fast and Hrivik all deserve to stay for some regular season action. I would like to see more from Lindberg, but let him prove it in the AHL first. Kreider is a tough call. I want him up, but don't want him taking a spot for one of the aforementioned guys if he isn't going to make an impact relatively soon.

 

[16 To Stanley*]

Last round of cuts will be tough. I'm not even sure who I would keep in my own bias. Miller, Fast and Hrivik all deserve to stay for some regular season action. I would like to see more from Lindberg, but let him prove it in the AHL first. Kreider is a tough call. I want him up, but don't want him taking a spot for one of the aforementioned guys if he isn't going to make an impact relatively soon.

I love your signature.

 

[silverfish]

Assuming Hags and Cally still hurt, and Stepan unsigned?

Opening night, NYR, as of right now:

Pyatt (seriously) - Richards - Nash
Pouliot - Brassard - Zuccs
Boyle - Lindberg - Miller (could also have Miller at C and Fast/Hrivik at RW)
Dorsett - Moore - Asham
Powe

McD - G
Staal - DZ
Moore - Stralman
Falk/Bickel

Hank
Biron

I have Pyatt on the top line because Kreider is clearly not ready for that, and Miller can't play up there yet either. Hrivik is really pushing me to put him there, but he's got to continue and even take another step in the final two games.

I would also love to try a top line of Nash - Richards - Zuccarello; but I think the staff is set on playing Nash at RW.

Obviously, missing Stepan, Callahan, and Hagelin is a huge loss to this team. That's half the top 6 missing from the opening night roster.

D, and goalie are VERY strong. Offense needs to come from everywhere.

Falk and Bickel as the spares so Allen can get top minutes in the AHL. If a D goes down, Allen is the call up if he can get there for the game, and Falk/Bickel continue to be "practice squad" guys.

 

[TruBlue99]

Bickel lives to see another day.


Just like Jack Bauer

 

[16 To Stanley*]

Assuming Hags and Cally still hurt, and Stepan unsigned?

Opening night, NYR, as of right now:

Pyatt (seriously) - Richards - Nash
Pouliot - Brassard - Zuccs
Boyle - Lindberg - Miller (could also have Miller at C and Fast/Hrivik at RW)
Dorsett - Moore - Asham
Powe

McD - G
Staal - DZ
Moore - Stralman
Falk/Bickel

Hank
Biron

I have Pyatt on the top line because Kreider is clearly not ready for that, and Miller can't play up there yet either. Hrivik is really pushing me to put him there, but he's got to continue and even take another step in the final two games.

I would also love to try a top line of Nash - Richards - Zuccarello; but I think the staff is set on playing Nash at RW.

Obviously, missing Stepan, Callahan, and Hagelin is a huge loss to this team. That's half the top 6 missing from the opening night roster.

D, and goalie are VERY strong. Offense needs to come from everywhere.

Falk and Bickel as the spares so Allen can get top minutes in the AHL. If a D goes down, Allen is the call up if he can get there for the game, and Falk/Bickel continue to be "practice squad" guys.

If Pyatt's on the top line I will literally die.