Would You Guarantee Dubas' Job For 2022-23 If It Meant Holding On To Our Futures?

[myleafs]

Anybody with a brain would have signed those 3 players

I'm saying you're wrong when the buck stops at the GM

Well since no other team even has 2 players at 11 milly who are all these gms with a brain you are talking about?

 

[Dekes For Days]

Second best?

Didn't say that either.

You know those are (likely) the ones we have to face in the playoffs.

We weren't discussing the playoffs. We were discussing the regular season.

If dubas isn't the best gm, then why would firing him not help the team?

Multiple reasons, but the most obvious is that you can't just bring in somebody else's GM to your own team whenever you like. We already have a good GM. The better question is how firing him would help the team.

 

[4thline]

They just had a 56 game season where they did not play a single Top 10 NHL team. I think any rational person would agree that not playing a single Top 10 NHL team for an entire season (the only team to do so BTW) is pretty decent evidence that the competition was weaker.

There are arguments for it being a weaker division, but the aggregated standings of 4 isolated divisions isn't one of them. Without crossover play the parity within a division has more bearing on the result than the quality.

 

[Bluelines]

I sure hope Dubas does not do what every GM under pressure does, trade the future away thinking they are one or two prospects away from winning the cup. It absolutely F's you 4 to 7 years down the road. We need to be thinking about developing the next wave of forwards, and defensemen

 

[Bomber0104]

If this Leafs Hfboards represents any sort of cross-section of the larger fanbase as well as MLSE executives, you'd definitely have to think Dubas is firmly on the hot-seat with this season being his last chance.

Probably going to have a tight leash as well, i.e. no trading 1st round picks barring approval, etc...

It's been a while since I've seen this sort of overwhelming backlash and disapproval towards the Leafs GM (probably Nonis / JFJ).

Burke was quite popular until the day he was canned.

 

[Bluelines]

Flipping it around, why is there any legitimate reason for a Leafs fan to especially like Kyle Dubas or identify with him more than Lou Lamoriello? They’re just employees of a team you cheer for.

He has good hair, his glasses stand out and typically he is rocking a great sweater.... what is there not to like?

 

[tmlms13]

Lou was only here for 3 years.

Took over a 68 point team and ended up setting a franchise record in points just 2 years later. Now he's in the semi finals.

Dubas is trash.

Lou didn't get fired though. He probably knew going in he only had 3 years.

 

[egd27]

Sure. But that's where it breaks down. 11.5 x 7, 12x7, sure. That's a contract that comes from "What you gave him? Give me more." 11.63 x 5 is so far beyond that it just doesn't connect.

I don't think it necessarily breaks down at all. "I want more dollars than him, and I only want to sign until I can go UFA" What's so hard to accept about that possible scenario?

 

[Captain Crunch]

I'm nowhere near this boat you speak of, nor do I care so much if they get outside of the first round as they do what they can to win a cup.

You can measure a teams' growth by which round they lost in if you want, but I do not.

Okay, I’m just curious. How do you measure a teams’ growth?
I would certainly measure it in terms of the team’s overall performance, especially with how deep of a playoff run they make. And I understand that key injuries play a part, but to be up 3-1 in games only to come out as flat as they did for games 5 and 6, and then lose game 7 as well. There is something that’s just not right with this team.
And until I’m proven wrong, I believe this team will not be a serious Cup contender until they are more balanced.
I feel it’s time to move on from Shanny and Dubas.

 

[tmlms13]

Sure, if you're coming into a disaster and you have tear it down and start over. (like the other guy)

When you inherit a 105 point team it seems reasonable to assume that you shouldn't need quite as long a runway to show progress.

You can't honestly tell me that this year they didn't show progress over the entire year. Compare last year's regular season to this years. Yes the scar of losing the playoffs is still fresh, shit happens. Dubas is the one skating on the ice.

He built a much better team for the 2021 season than he did for the 2020 season. You absolutely cannot deny that.

 

[egd27]

It's shocking how fast some fans turned on babs. Starting to look more and more like he wasn't the problem.

Well he was a problem because he wouldn't play M&M together and tried to spread the offense around. Also he seemed to think giving forwards 24-25 minutes a night would make them less effective.

Thank goodness Keefe put a stop to that lunacy

 

[myleafs]

Ya that’s probably the root of the problem

Leafs were a gong show when Shanny arrived and he made some good moves to start. He brought in Lou and Babs to create accountability and a stable foundation which it did. Once that was established though he took a sharp left turn and decided to take the unbeaten dirt road rather than staying on the well paved road. It was a gamble that obviously he felt was worth the risk and now he is doubling down on his gamble. As a fan I hope it pays off but its looking more and more like that dirt road might just be leading us to the edge of an abyss. I want to be wrong and I hope I am but man there are lots of warning signals going off.

 

[hotpaws]

I've literally said that if the kids don't deliver he deserves to be gone for making the bet on them.

so betting on M and M is the excuse your going with as to why Dubie is going to get fired , i guess blowing 11m on JT doesn't factor in any of this , lol

make all the excuses you want for him but if this team fails again no one's going to hire Dubie as a GM after he shit the bed by blowing the golden opportunity he had here

also there's no need to try to set up a pre-emptive excuse to try to save your HF rep from the hit defending Dubie will take , just do what the Burke boys did after he was fired and that was take a few month break then do a user name change as well as blocking access to your page . lol

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Would think (or hope) Shanahan would step in to prevent this from happening.

 

[4thline]

I don't think it necessarily breaks down at all. "I want more dollars than him, and I only want to sign until I can go UFA" What's so hard to accept about that possible scenario?

Well firstly, he signed for more than straight to UFA. And within the context of player salaries/values that quote speaks to a mindset of valuing himself significantly higher than 11x7, of either a profound dissatisfaction or disregard for the the accepted (league wide) salary/term structure.

He knew of Eichel/McDavid for a full year before JT was signed. If he was going to accept that value curve a new internal comparable that fits within it wouldn't have changed that.

 

[hotpaws]

If this Leafs Hfboards represents any sort of cross-section of the larger fanbase as well as MLSE executives, you'd definitely have to think Dubas is firmly on the hot-seat with this season being his last chance.

Probably going to have a tight leash as well, i.e. no trading 1st round picks barring approval, etc...

It's been a while since I've seen this sort of overwhelming backlash and disapproval towards the Leafs GM (probably Nonis / JFJ).

Burke was quite popular until the day he was canned.

Burkie put on a better show , the outrage after he was fired on here was very entertaining .

 

[4thline]

so betting on M and M is the excuse your going with as to why Dubie is going to get fired , i guess blowing 11m on JT doesn't factor in any of this , lol

make all the excuses you want for him but if this team fails again no one's going to hire Dubie as a GM after he shit the bed by blowing the golden opportunity he had here

also there's no need to try to set up a pre-emptive excuse to try to save your HF rep from the hit defending Dubie will take , just do what the Burke boys did after he was fired and that was take a few month break then do a user name change as well as blocking access to your page . lol

Yes. The reason for an executive being fired tends to be the thing they stick their neck out on not working. For Dubas it's the combo of caving to their demands to try and keep them long term and refusing to adjust if/when they don't deliver. Matthews had leverage, but Marner should have been showed the door. Last summer.

I also don't care about my "HF rep" with borderline illiterates.

 

[egd27]

You can't honestly tell me that this year they didn't show progress over the entire year. Compare last year's regular season to this years. Yes the scar of losing the playoffs is still fresh, shit happens. Dubas is the one skating on the ice.

He built a much better team for the 2021 season than he did for the 2020 season. You absolutely cannot deny that.

This season was such an anomaly I think it's nearly impossible to determine whether or not progress was made. But even conceding regular season progress was made, it doesn't negate the fact he didn't walk into a failing situation that needed 5-7 years to turnaround.
The assertion was that 3 years after inheriting bottom feeder and 3 years after inheriting a 105 point playoff team should have differing expectations of the GM
IMO Kid Kyle's teams have fallen short of any reasonable expectations and, as a fan, I am not satisfied with his job performance and believe he should be replaced.

 

[hotpaws]

You can't honestly tell me that this year they didn't show progress over the entire year. Compare last year's regular season to this years. Yes the scar of losing the playoffs is still fresh, shit happens. Dubas is the one skating on the ice.

He built a much better team for the 2021 season than he did for the 2020 season. You absolutely cannot deny that.

if you took into account who they played this year compared to last you'd realize it's impossible to know if they progressed during the regular season

what we do know however is they didn't progress in the playoffs

 

[tmlms13]

Did you know that Crosby and Ovechkin were way better than Matthews and Marner on their ELCs?

Hence they got I higher % of the cap.... maybe M&M actually fell in line to where it should be?

 

[HoweHullOrr]

No, our futures aren't that great and he's already traded away most of our picks, so there's not much left to peddle. As long as he's not here for the teardown, I'm pretty indifferent to what happens in the next year or so with this team.

That what I was thinking as well. A lot of our futures have already been traded away. The prospects that are decent enough will need to get plugged into the lineup anyhow as the cap has been depleted and there isn't much in the way of better options.

 

[rumman]

But if I’m the owner I would be wondering about Kyle. Are you the visionary builder we hired you to be or are you job training on my time, dollar and patience?

definitely the latter.

 

[rumman]

Any fool knew that Hunter, Lou and Babs would not accept reporting to a f'n stick boy except our delusional President. Seriously is anybody awake at MLSEL to see where this team has gone since stick boy was given the keys to the candy store ??

word........

 

[Lightsol]

I sure hope Dubas does not do what every GM under pressure does, trade the future away thinking they are one or two prospects away from winning the cup. It absolutely F's you 4 to 7 years down the road. We need to be thinking about developing the next wave of forwards, and defensemen

I'm more worried about them being pressured into doing something really stupid and turning this iteration of the Leafs into the '96 Leafs or the '06 Leafs. Does anyone want another decade of picking 10-13 every year but never making the playoffs?

 

[hotpaws]

Yes. The reason for an executive being fired tends to be the thing they stick their neck out on not working. For Dubas it's the combo of caving to their demands to try and keep them long term and refusing to adjust if/when they don't deliver. Matthews had leverage, but Marner should have been showed the door. Last summer.

I also don't care about my "HF rep" with borderline illiterates.

the reason GM's get fired is for the team performing poorly or do you actually believe if a GM plays it safe (whatever the f*** that's supposed to mean) he has a job for life ?

oh you do care about your HF rep that's why your going down this path to no where with the M and M are going to cost Dubie his job crap and he's really a genius and it's not his fault the team failed because everyone would have bet on M and M