Would it really be the end of the world if Matthews isn’t on the team in two years?

[Throw More Waffles]

Problem is, where do you get these guys ?? We have not drafted and developed many and the UFA market is a crap shoot. Need assets to trade for them. 15x5 is repeating the same mistake as his current contract. Look if Matty puts money ahead of building a better team, do you really want him?? I'd move him for blue chippers and high picks.

As a start, we could get a lot of decent assets in a Marner trade. Something often overlooked is just how embarrassingly front-loaded Marner's contract is, and how much of a bargain he is in real cash the final 3 seasons. It's around 5 mil a year. For a 100 point player. We'd fetch a kings ransom. I'd also consider trading Nylander to be honest. He'll get like 10 mil on the open market. Do we really want to give him that? And if not, may as well get assets now.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Problem is, where do you get these guys ?? We have not drafted and developed many and the UFA market is a crap shoot. Need assets to trade for them. 15x5 is repeating the same mistake as his current contract. Look if Matty puts money ahead of building a better team, do you really want him?? I'd move him for blue chippers and high picks.

Oh yeah, 3 goals in 10 games should not get you $15m when McDavid has 9g and 9a in 9 games and is making $12.5m IMO. Sorry Matty, go get your money somewhere else.

I'd probably give the Coyotes a call. I'd wonder if they'd be interested in Matthews (or alternatively Marner) and what kind of deal could be struck? A haul consisting of high 1st rounders and good recent prospects could be interesting.

May or may not work depending on whether Arizona would prefer the lower cost route of building around really good prospects and ELCs.

On the other hand, it could really kick start interest in their franchise and boost attendance especially when they get that new arena built (could be a few years out though).

 

[ToneDog]

As a start, we could get a lot of decent assets in a Marner trade. Something often overlooked is just how embarrassingly front-loaded Marner's contract is, and how much of a bargain he is in real cash the final 3 seasons. It's around 5 mil a year. For a 100 point player. We'd fetch a kings ransom. I'd also consider trading Nylander to be honest. He'll get like 10 mil on the open market. Do we really want to give him that? And if not, may as well get assets now.

Excellent idea but is Matty buying in ?? I had suggested trading all three for blue chippers and high picks and get all my ducks in line the next two years at which point Tavares comes off the books. With the right trades and picks we would be back like the Rangers are now.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

I'm remembering all those years where our #1C were players like Stajan, Bozak, Antropov, etc. The pain.

If somebody were to say to me during those 15-ish years "Would you give around 15% of cap to get a super star, Richard scoring, Hart winning utterly elite #1C?"

My answer would be screaming "YESSSSS" at the top of my lungs standing on the highest mountain until my vocal cords broke.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Coyotes might be interested. You could get a nice haul from them either in young prospects and/or some really high 1st round picks. You never know what could happen in the 2023 draft with Bedard floating around there.

I think you have to clean house in the management team though either first or simultaneously. There's more focus on firing Keefe and Dubas, but Shanny has to go as well because when its rotten at the very top, everything is rotten. All three have failed and are over their heads.

Keefe seems likely as the 1st to go as getting rid of the coach is tradition. But, I hope much more than that is done versus just focusing on the easy scapegoat.

Shanahan isn't going anywhere because apparently the ownership loves him.

However Keefe and Dubas have little rope left and are probably gone within 4 months.

I'm not convinced Shanahan will allow Dubas to mortgage the future for one last desperate trade to save his job.

Dubas isn't the best GM in the league but he's far from the worst. He's ideally suited for a player personnel role or assistant GM.

 

[4thline]

Excellent idea but is Matty buying in ?? I had suggested trading all three for blue chippers and high picks and get all my ducks in line the next two years at which point Tavares comes off the books. With the right trades and picks we would be back like the Rangers are now.

Doesn't need to be all at once. The talent level on this team would still be really high a hypothetical trade moving out one of the M's. Changing the mix could be the catalyst.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

1. Shanahan isn't going anywhere because apparently the ownership loves him.

2. However Keefe and Dubas have little rope left and are probably gone within 4 months.

I'm not convinced Shanahan will allow Dubas to mortgage the future for one last desperate trade to save his job.

3. Dubas isn't the best GM in the league but he's far from the worst. He's ideally suited for a player personnel role or assistant GM.

1. Could be true, but do you have something that backs that idea up? That would be a shame if it's true. Who was at the top of this management group that allowed or approved everything that happened? I think he could be the most incompetent of the bunch and everything has happened under his watch.

2. Firing the coach is tradition and the most predictable move. So, it might be all that they do. Unfortunately, that's just putting lipstick on the pig. It's still a pig. They might get rid of both Dubas & Keefe, but who would be making the selection (and/or approval) for the new GM & coach.? Allowing Shanny to make yet another bad choice and blunder gets us back to square one again.

3. Possibly, but I couldn't care less at this point. We've tried this, and it hasn't worked. Been there, done that. It's professional sports. The business is about winning. He's won NADA/ZERO. Bye, bye.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Excellent idea but is Matty buying in ?? I had suggested trading all three for blue chippers and high picks and get all my ducks in line the next two years at which point Tavares comes off the books. With the right trades and picks we would be back like the Rangers are now.

If Matthews won't stay unless his "pals" stay, all of whom fight tooth and nail for every penny... then yes, at that point I'd agree we have to move on from Matthews.

 

[RoadWarrior]

It would be the end of NHL hockey in Toronto.

No it wouldn't.

Matthews is rejecting Toronto with his play. Kessel did the same thing in his final months with the team.

Generally speaking outside of Swedes foreign players are not thrilled about the idea of playing in Canada and yes that includes Toronto. There's many reasons but taxes are one factor. Even some Canadian athletes like Stamkos shy away.

Gaudreau and Tkachuk couldn't wait to bail out of Calgary which is probably the most American city in Canada. In return Calgary picked up hard working Canadian players who are committed to the organization and it's revitalized the franchise.

The same can happen in Toronto but it probably means the leafs need Canadian or Swedish stars to lead the team. It's not an accident that Tavares, a hometown kid who grew up a leaf fan has been the best player on the ice to start the season.

I didn't mean for this post to sound 'cherryesque' but I think the leafs can learn from Calgary's experience this past summer.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

It would be the end of NHL hockey in Toronto.

I thought like you when Ballard traded Sittler. And here we are....

 

[Craigo85]

End of the world? No, since we haven't won a round with him now.

Would we be a better team? Unlikely, even with a great trade and draft that year we'd unlikely to be in a better position for years.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

This season will play out likely as past 6 have with a 1st round exit (maybe they don't get a playoff spot).. and then new mgmt will be recruited (50/50 Shanny stays on once ownership forces his hand) .. 1st job of new mgmt will be getting Matty signed up for 8 years .. if he says no then Matty trade will be sole focus .. and no one will pay full price for 1 year of Matty so he will effectively control his new destination/deal

 

[TML Dynasty]

If a team has to trade for him they will be gutted. At least of futures. Not sure he’d put himself in that situation. Leafs can offer him the most money and the best situation. But yeah I’m fricking nervous

 

[JT AM da real deal]

If a team has to trade for him they will be gutted. At least of futures. Not sure he’d put himself in that situation. Leafs can offer him the most money and the best situation. But yeah I’m fricking nervous

I wouldn't be nervous .. we either get Matty back or we get 5 1st rounders (or some combo of picks/players) back for him .. either scenario is fine .. or maybe we flip to Oliers for McJesus and then they flip him for 5 1st rounders .. either way Leafs will be fine

 

[ToneDog]

I wouldn't be nervous .. we either get Matty back or we get 5 1st rounders (or some combo of picks/players) back for him .. either scenario is fine .. or maybe we flip to Oliers for McJesus and then they flip him for 5 1st rounders .. either way Leafs will be fine

It will be hard to get 5 1sts unless Leafs take on some bad money and/or retain. Be happy to take 3 or 4 from Zona if one is Bedard.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

It will be hard to get 5 1sts unless Leafs take on some bad money and/or retain. Be happy to take 3 or 4 from Zona if one is Bedard.

if you rfa signed him to big money aav you get back 4 1st rounders and then add another for a top 5 player in league .. or some combo of 5 guys including say 3 1st rounders and last years 1st round prospect and a say Jakob C (still 5 guys though with 1st round pedigree) .. but any of those deals requires him to do a sign and trade deal

 

[ToneDog]

if you rfa signed him to big money aav you get back 4 1st rounders and then add another for a top 5 player in league .. or some combo of 5 guys including say 3 1st rounders and last years 1st round prospect and a say Jakob C (still 5 guys though with 1st round pedigree) .. but any of those deals requires him to do a sign and trade deal

If Zona offers a combination of 5 which includes #1OA, I'd throw in Knies to make it happen.

 

[BertCorbeau]

It wouldn’t be the end of the world, but it would be a bad idea.

The Leafs aren’t in a position to go scorched earth at all. Doing so would be excessive and set the organization back very far.

 

[ToneDog]

It wouldn’t be the end of the world, but it would be a bad idea.

The Leafs aren’t in a position to go scorched earth at all. Doing so would be excessive and set the organization back very far.

If the wrong hands, probably but in the right hands and if you get Berard, you might be taking a step back to take 2 forward. Once JT is off the books you should be locked and loaded like the Rangers are today after writing that letter to their fans.

 

[kb]

Oh the takes in here.....screenshotted.

 

[cannucky]

I understand what the scenario is.

I just don't see it playing out like that. The Leafs can't take that risk. While they can't extend him, they can get an idea what his intentions are. Unless he decides to flat out lie to them, if he shows any inkling to want to play elsewhere they would move him before the NMC kicks in.

Except you don't actually get it because they can't just move him there has to be a team with cap space that wants him , maybe check out capfriendly and figure out who can afford him then ask yourself why would he extend with that team ? Do you honestly believe a team is going to give some giant return for a 1 year rental ? Why would even a team he wants to go too give the return it will take to keep the Leafs Nation from lynching management and torching the arena when they know they can get him for free if they wait a year ? Dumbass screwed the pooch when he gave him the NMC in the last year he should have given him a NMC for the first 3 or 4 years instead but that would be smart player management and nobody is ever going to accuse Kyle Dumbass of that .

 

[cannucky]

The number of NHlers who have property in the GTA is pretty massive, but it' hasn't exactly been an indicator they're all running to play here. I'm not so sure it's a good way to judge player intentions

It isn't about other players buying in the GTA it's about players making a place their home , the comparison was that there was some alternate reality where the Leafs and Oilers would make that trade and the players would waive their protections for it to happen , McDavid has made Edmonton his home Mathews has not made Toronto his home .
To the other guy that thinks renting is such a great tax strategy well maybe go learn math somewhere because the tax rebate on his rent isn't jack shyte compared with the growth of the real estate market , in the 6 plus years he's been in Toronto his house would have probably doubled had he bought one compared with the imaginary tax benefit of paying at most 50-60k a year rent on a condo , and there's no capitol gains on a residence so that alone would have surpassed the rent expense .

 

[cannucky]

It's my understand Matthews can't sign a new contract until July 1-2023.

Is there any restriction to talking prior to that and coming to an agreement and getting a MOA from Matthews that he will sign for the agreed terms in the MOA?

Mouser might know as he's very knowledgeable on the CBA.

If the answer is Leafs can't get that, I would seriously start shopping him NOW.
If the answer is they can but Matthews and his agent refuse to discuss and agree to sign a MOA I would seriously start shopping him now.

With his NMC kicking in July 1 2023, teams would be reluctant to offer a decent package of picks/players.

Moving him now, at least gives teams 2 years of him, which I know we have, but we aren't even close to competing for the SC.

I know many will hate my opinion but it's the long term Leafs fans should be concerned about.

Now here's a person that gets it . Pretty sure MOA's aren't a thing in the NHL so it probably is a CBA thing .

 

[cannucky]

Feed him to Arizona for Chychrun , Fischer or Crouse and their 2023 1st unprotected then pray they win us Bedard .

 

[Menzinger]

It isn't about other players buying in the GTA it's about players making a place their home , the comparison was that there was some alternate reality where the Leafs and Oilers would make that trade and the players would waive their protections for it to happen , McDavid has made Edmonton his home Mathews has not made Toronto his home .
To the other guy that thinks renting is such a great tax strategy well maybe go learn math somewhere because the tax rebate on his rent isn't jack shyte compared with the growth of the real estate market , in the 6 plus years he's been in Toronto his house would have probably doubled had he bought one compared with the imaginary tax benefit of paying at most 50-60k a year rent on a condo , and there's no capitol gains on a residence so that alone would have surpassed the rent expense .

I just don't think any of that matters.

NHL history is filled with guys who had long careers in a market, even won cups there, and not commit their lives to living there (see the majority of European players).