Value of: Would anyone take Barclay Goodrow?

[smoneil]

Did you not read the OP? The only reason we would trade Goodrow is for cap purposes. How does it help us to retain 30% of his contract, and take back a player with a 3 mil QO on top of that?

We are NOT retaining on Goodrow. 0%. If we need to move him and we can't find an acceptable trade for him, we can buy him out and save 3.8 mil next year.

That's insane. A buyout would run for 8 years. The full hit would be saved for the next two seasons, but then there would be a cap hit of 1.15m in 25/26, $3.65m in 26/27, and then 4 years of a $1.26m dead cap hit.

OR

And again, this is prefaced by the idea that the Rangers crunch the numbers and can re-sign the RFA trio with an extra 2m or so (ie: moving half of Goodrow's contract), they can retain 30%, gain an asset like an additional 2nd rounder in a VERY deep draft, and only have a dead cap hit of $1.1m for the next four years.

I didn't address Puljujarvi at all, as I had said that this is a summer move--the Rangers won't move Goodrow until they NEED the money (ie: this summer, unless they can make it work while still keeping him).

 

[GAGLine]

That's insane. A buyout would run for 8 years. The full hit would be saved for the next two seasons, but then there would be a cap hit of 1.15m in 25/26, $3.65m in 26/27, and then 4 years of a $1.26m dead cap hit.

OR

And again, this is prefaced by the idea that the Rangers crunch the numbers and can re-sign the RFA trio with an extra 2m or so (ie: moving half of Goodrow's contract), they can retain 30%, gain an asset like an additional 2nd rounder in a VERY deep draft, and only have a dead cap hit of $1.1m for the next four years.

I didn't address Puljujarvi at all, as I had said that this is a summer move--the Rangers won't move Goodrow until they NEED the money (ie: this summer, unless they can make it work while still keeping him).

The buyout is a last resort. It comes down to how much cap space we need. Honestly, I don't think we'll even need to move Goodrow. It will be tight, but I think we can fit everyone.

 

[Djp]

This is a bad take. First Goodrow is not a 4th liner. If you think that please tell me how many 4th line players are going to score around 35-40 pts on the year? Zero.

Next Garland is nothing like Goodrow or Laughton. Goodrow can play center and makes over 2 million less and is currently 1 point less in scoring. I dont even understand why Philly would trade Laugton unless they got a very good return. Lastly the cap is going up and probably significantly in 2 years. 3.625 for a 3rd liner who can play anywhere in the lineup and would bleed for the team and is a great teammate is a solid deal.

The only reason the Rangers would trade him is to get cap space to sign their RFAs.

Now no…end of contract YES.

the three are different so it depends on team need.

next year it might go up $1M. Who know what happens after that. I’m not banking on it.

again…who will have $4M in space to take him on? who wants take him on for 4 full years?
rangers are going to need to add a big sweetener like their 1st in the drsft to unload him.

 

[smoneil]

The buyout is a last resort. It comes down to how much cap space we need. Honestly, I don't think we'll even need to move Goodrow. It will be tight, but I think we can fit everyone.

I agree that they will try to fit everyone, though things do seem to keep getting tighter and tighter the better Chytil and K'AM play. The team's preference is clearly to keep Goodrow and the RFA kids.

But this is a hypothetical thread. If, by your own admission, they would be close to fitting the kids in, they probably wouldn't need to free up the full hit if they HAD to move Goodrow. In that hypothetical scenario (ie: they do have to move him for space, but don't need to move the full hit), what would be better? A buyout over 8 years (where the only benefit is the full hit being saved next year) or a 30% retention for four years, with a nice asset or two in return?

I can also see a scenario where they try to move his full hit to free up $$ to sign K'AM or Chytil to a longer term extension rather than a bridge, for that matter.

 

[smoneil]

Now no…end of contract YES.

the three are different so it depends on team need.

next year it might go up $1M. Who know what happens after that. I’m not banking on it.

again…who will have $4M in space to take him on? who wants take him on for 4 full years?
rangers are going to need to add a big sweetener like their 1st in the drsft to unload him.

Absolutely not. He's not massively overpaid. Maybe half a million. He's also exactly the kind of player contenders look for. He's also exactly the kind of player rebuilding teams look for (to establish a good culture). Coaches love him because of his flexibility.

At the full cap hit, with no cap coming back, there would be no value (positive OR negative) but there would be buyers (particularly teams who missed out on FA's, or get priced out of the FA market). It's worth picking up a guy who is overpaid by half a million because you'd essentially be getting him for free (a 4th/5th rounder).

As to him "not being a 3rd liner" by the end of his contract, where do you get that? He was among the league's elite 3rd liners w/TB. He's scored 25+ points in 3 of the past 4 seasons (and it would have been 4/4 if not for Covid, as he had 20 points in 55 games in 20/21). He's also 29 years old and having a career year. He'll be 33 at the end of his contract, not 45.

 

[Flan the incredible]

Now no…end of contract YES.

the three are different so it depends on team need.

next year it might go up $1M. Who know what happens after that. I’m not banking on it.

again…who will have $4M in space to take him on? who wants take him on for 4 full years?
rangers are going to need to add a big sweetener like their 1st in the drsft to unload him.

A 1st? Lol

Your takes are brutal. What is even funnier is that Buffalo is exactly the type of team that would trade for him and give up something of value.

 

[bernmeister]

Barabanov for Goodrow and Cuylle

no

Nothing would happen this year. Goodrow is a big part of the team. This is a next year move if they are forced to get under the cap

Plus Cuylee is a cheap bottom 6 option. He’s likely full time next year

But I’d rent Barbashev and Acciari for Kravtsov and a 3rd

no on moving Krav you wrong about Chytil and you are wrong about him

 

[bernmeister]

I think this is a bad thread.

Goodrow is a very good 3rd liner and extremely reliable. For someone with his skillset to be playing at a near 40 point pace is pretty invaluable.

He is a vital part of the team. Its not his fault GG puts him in unpopular situations but he works his ass off.

Should not be traded.

short term,, this
we are married to bread
we got Goodrow in part to stick to bread's ass to provide sufficient protection while adding useful play ability.
Going w/handedness on def/faceoffs, so you are not reaching over, ef bread, he can do RW, Goodrow LW w/Zib at pivot. Again, on offense, do what works, doesn't matter.

We can't have Panarin on a line w/a guy like Kreider and then if CK has to step up for some reason, and breaks his hand punching somebody out, we have a prob; if it happens to Goodrow yes still a prob but not as bad

 

[bernmeister]

He’s great depth Rangers have a major cap crunch and him and Lindgren are the only moveable pieces. Lindgren is a top pair d man so Goodrow would be the preference to move first.

This mostly but there are smaller options as well
as to Lindy, we have guys we should be breaking in now, like Robertson, stop w/stupid non development of assets in favor of vets, and he gets good picks
Goodrow can be had for market price but he is not available through this yr for sure and likely not until we move on from Panarin

 

[Djp]

Absolutely not. He's not massively overpaid. Maybe half a million. He's also exactly the kind of player contenders look for. He's also exactly the kind of player rebuilding teams look for (to establish a good culture). Coaches love him because of his flexibility.

At the full cap hit, with no cap coming back, there would be no value (positive OR negative) but there would be buyers (particularly teams who missed out on FA's, or get priced out of the FA market). It's worth picking up a guy who is overpaid by half a million because you'd essentially be getting him for free (a 4th/5th rounder).

As to him "not being a 3rd liner" by the end of his contract, where do you get that? He was among the league's elite 3rd liners w/TB. He's scored 25+ points in 3 of the past 4 seasons (and it would have been 4/4 if not for Covid, as he had 20 points in 55 games in 20/21). He's also 29 years old and having a career year. He'll be 33 at the end of his contract, not 45.

again…what teams have $4M in extra cap to take him on for 4 years.

the cap situation for many teams isn’t going to be changing much.

teams that might have space like Detroit and Ottawa could be looking to keep their own and sign UFAs

I do t carry about now. as players age to 32+ 95 out of 100 players fall off in production not justifying the cap hit. He will be 33 at least by the end of that contract.

teams like San Jose or Anaheim or Chicago could take him with rangers adding picks/ prospects.

if you are talking a pure hockey trade then he could be moved. Just trading him for futures isn’t going to happen with most teams.


most teams have a roster plan in 4 yrs with their drsfted players developing.

if he had just 2-2 yrs left he would be easily moveable. At 4… no.

A 1st? Lol

Your takes are brutal. What is even funnier is that Buffalo is exactly the type of team that would trade for him and give up something of value.

buffalo is not touching him with a 20 ft pole.

they don’t need a center with 4 full years left. They are expect to be close to the cap whrn he has 1 full season left.

do you not notice last year ehrn Columbus traded Bjorkstrand for a couple mid round picks. He has 4 full years left.

 

[Flan the incredible]

buffalo is not touching him with a 20 ft pole.

they don’t need a center with 4 full years left. They are expect to be close to the cap whrn he has 1 full season left.

do you not notice last year ehrn Columbus traded Bjorkstrand for a couple mid round picks. He has 4 full years left.

It's pretty clear you don't know anything about Goodrow. He isn't a center and he isn't a 4th line player. Guy plays every position and he excels in leadership, defense, grit and the PK. Buffalo is young sucks on the PK and can't keep the puck out of the net. He is exactly what they need.
You also don't understand the salary cap or how much revenue the NHL has taken in. Revenue is up significantly and the owners are almost paid back. Cap is jumping after next year.

 

[Vitto79]

no


no on moving Krav you wrong about Chytil and you are wrong about him

I hope im wrong about Chytil but I won’t be wrong on Kravtsov. Talk in a month

 

[Barnaby]

Trade him, keep him, or buy him out.

They will not be retaining. I feel comfortable saying no chance.

 

[Kocur Dill]

Leafs are interested on paper, but the fact he is the odd man out for the Rangers who lack quality depth is a red flag

Red flag in HFB pretend froopyland?

Because there is no red flag about Barky in the real world, based off a Rando's baseless for-funsies trade post.

 

[smoneil]

Trade him, keep him, or buy him out.

They will not be retaining. I feel comfortable saying no chance.

Despite the fact that I literally showed you the numbers where a buyout ends up putting MORE dead money on the cap for twice as long without returning an asset? That would be the dumbest asset management this team has done since the Buchnevich trade.

 

[smoneil]

no on moving Krav you wrong about Chytil and you are wrong about him

Bern, you know I'm a fan of the Rangers young forwards, but I've got to tell you I just don't see it with Kravtsov. He's only a couple of months younger than Chytil and he just hasn't shown anything other than a rare combination of physical and emotional fragility. I don't see a place for him in the lineup next year, sad to say.

 

[Barnaby]

Despite the fact that I literally showed you the numbers where a buyout ends up putting MORE dead money on the cap for twice as long without returning an asset? That would be the dumbest asset management this team has done since the Buchnevich trade.

What’s dumbest is retaining 1.6 million for 4 years and not getting a player who brings what he brings for the 2 million you now add to your books. You now have to replace him on your roster. You replace him with a guy making 1.5 and you’ve effectively downgraded to save 500k. No guarantee a ELC fills that spot. Meanwhile you’re giving someone a bargain contract.

You trade him and get an asset back if you can. Maybe send a mid round pick with him if necessary. He’s worth 3 and he brings a lot to the table so that’s not a stretch.

You keep him.

You trade him for an overpaid 4th liner making less than him with a year or two of term.

There’s something in there that will work without retaining long term or buying him out at this stage. Both of those ideas are ridiculous.

 

[smoneil]

What’s dumbest is retaining 1.6 million for 4 years and not getting a player who brings what he brings for the 2 million you now add to your books. You now have to replace him on your roster. You replace him with a guy making 1.5 and you’ve effectively downgraded to save 500k. No guarantee a ELC fills that spot. Meanwhile you’re giving someone a bargain contract.

You trade him and get an asset back if you can. Maybe send a mid round pick with him if necessary. He’s worth 3 and he brings a lot to the table so that’s not a stretch.

You keep him.

You trade him for an overpaid 4th liner making less than him with a year or two of term.

There’s something in there that will work without retaining long term or buying him out at this stage. Both of those ideas are ridiculous.

You specifically listed "buy him out" as one of the three things you would do while completely discounting retention. How does your post above (re: having a million and change on the books) NOT apply even worse to the idea of a buyout, when you would have SIX years of dead cap at around the same level (aside from year 3 where it would be far more)? Whether you buy him out or trade with retention, you STILL have to replace him, so I have no idea what you are trying to get to on that point.

I agree that you keep him if you can. That's option 1. I agree you trade him for basically nothing if you can as option 2, to lose the full hit. But if option 1 and 2 fail? It's mathematically and team-buildingly obvious that a retention trade (of ~30%) is the best option 3. It results in a shorter, smaller dead cap hit plus a solid asset.

And for the record, I HOPE the team can keep him. He's a phenomenal player to have in so many ways, and if they can just get to 2024, I think the cap issues will resolve themselves.

 

[tlk]

Leafs are interested on paper, but the fact he is the odd man out for the Rangers who lack quality depth is a red flag

Since when is it a fact though?

 

[tlk]

Not for sale. Hopefully.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Leafs are interested on paper, but the fact he is the odd man out for the Rangers who lack quality depth is a red flag

No, the 4 years left on the contract is the red flag

 

[Leafs87]

There’s certain signings that right away you know end up this way(team looking to get rid of them). Good player, exactly what they needed, just clearly overpaid for he brings

 

[innitfam]

Leafs offer: Pierre Engvall (pending UFA) + 3rd

for

Barclay Goodrow (50% retention)

With a 1st maybe. The Rangers still have to replace Goodrow if this happens

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Haha I just want him not for his type but because he has a big contract that can possible facilitate a Meier move that may include a Kakko, Chytil, Lafreniere, or a 1st rd pick.

Pretty sure NYR can trade Blais as a cap dump and fit Meier at 50% that way, plus whatever they'd give the Sharks in Lafreniere. I doubt Kakko will be moved since he's showing signs of life and no shot they trade Chytil since he's their best young player on the forward side at the moment

 

[pld459666]

On pace to match (possibly better) his career year last year.

He has value.

This is an off-season move, likely at the draft, or shortly after the silly season.

He won't be given away