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World Cup: World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team USA Part III

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JTD said:
If the NHLers go to South Korea, I would hope this management group either gets canned or is so embarrassed by this display that they realize their "gritty" and "tough" players will sink them. US will have a lot of incredible talent available to them. This embarrassment might be enough to see them actually realize they need all the skill they can get
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Au contraire, they should keep this coaching staff and management group together...And send them ALL to Korea...























NORTH KOREA
 
Why in the world, out of all the great american coaches, did they go with Torts. That's like team canada going with Therrien. Doesn't make sense.
 
In an attempt to wash the filth of this tournament from my mind, I've decided to throw together a potential 2018 Team USA:

Forwards (x13):

Brandon Saad - Auston Matthews - Patrick Kane
Johnny Gaudreau - Jack Eichel - Blake Wheeler
Alex Galchenyuk - Vincent Trocheck - Phil Kessel
Dylan Larkin - Tyler Johnson - Kyle Okposo
Max Pacioretty

Defense (x7):

Ryan McDonagh - Seth Jones
Shayne Gostisbehere - John Carlson
Ryan Suter - Justin Faulk
Jacob Trouba

Goalies (x3):

John Gibson
Connor Hellebuyck
Quick/Bishop/Schneider

Notes:
  • What a concept to put together a FAST and SKILLED team. I also hope there's a massive shift to the younger generation. There should still be a few veterans on this squad, but it should be a young team. It's time to give the new guard (management, coaches, and players) control.
  • Who knows if this team would win, but with the skill and skating on this team, at least if they lost it would be player performance related and/or a tip of the cap to a better team, whereas the last two best-on-best tournaments USA Hockey has chosen not to send its best possible team.
  • Obviously with a young team there's some projections here, but nothing out of the ordinary. If none of these guys were in contention in 2 years, something drastic in their development would have happened.
  • Other Forwards Considered: Parise, Pavelski, Palmieri, Atkinson, Stepan, Miller, Kreider, van Riemsdyk, Nelson, Ryan
  • Other Defensemen Considered: Shattenkirk, Leddy, Krug, Fowler, Hanifin, Werenski, Slavin, DeKeyser
  • Other Goalies Considered: Whichever 2 of Quick/Schneider/Bishop doesn't make the team
  • Time to Move On Barring Remarkable '18 Season: Backes, Kesler, Oshie, Stastny, Abdelkader, Dubinsky, Byfuglien, Niskanen, Johnson, Johnson
 
me2 said:
Everyone assumes Kessel was left off because these guys are incompetent boobs (they probably still are), but maybe they had reasons for some players.

In Kessel's case they would have been asking about players health and maybe Pittsburgh said he needed surgery and they would prefer it if he didn't postponing it until October and sit out 3 months worth of NHL games (or even delaying it a year and play hurt) just so he could play for the USA over 24s team. If that's the case I don't see anything wrong with Pittsburgh valuing it's 2016-17 season.
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It wasn't that. Lombardi and co. talked specifically about Kessel when they named the first part of the roster in March, and Kessel addressed the snub in May. His surgery may have ended up forcing him off the team, but it shouldn't have been because they preferred Abdelkader, Dubinsky, etc.
 
William H Bonney said:
In an attempt to wash the filth of this tournament from my mind, I've decided to throw together a potential 2018 Team USA:

Forwards (x13):

Brandon Saad - Auston Matthews - Patrick Kane
Johnny Gaudreau - Jack Eichel - Blake Wheeler
Alex Galchenyuk - Vincent Trocheck - Phil Kessel
Dylan Larkin - Tyler Johnson - Kyle Okposo
Max Pacioretty

Defense (x7):

Ryan McDonagh - Seth Jones
Shayne Gostisbehere - John Carlson
Ryan Suter - Justin Faulk
Jacob Trouba

Goalies (x3):

John Gibson
Connor Hellebuyck
Quick/Bishop/Schneider

Notes:
  • What a concept to put together a FAST and SKILLED team. I also hope there's a massive shift to the younger generation. There should still be a few veterans on this squad, but it should be a young team. It's time to give the new guard (management, coaches, and players) control.
  • Who knows if this team would win, but with the skill and skating on this team, at least if they lost it would be player performance related and/or a tip of the cap to a better team, whereas the last two best-on-best tournaments USA Hockey has chosen not to send its best possible team.
  • Obviously with a young team there's some projections here, but nothing out of the ordinary. If none of these guys were in contention in 2 years, something drastic in their development would have happened.
  • Other Forwards Considered: Parise, Pavelski, Palmieri, Atkinson, Stepan, Miller, Kreider, van Riemsdyk, Nelson, Ryan
  • Other Defensemen Considered: Shattenkirk, Leddy, Krug, Fowler, Hanifin, Werenski, Slavin, DeKeyser
  • Other Goalies Considered: Whichever 2 of Quick/Schneider/Bishop doesn't make the team
  • Time to Move On Barring Remarkable '18 Season: Backes, Kesler, Oshie, Stastny, Abdelkader, Dubinsky, Byfuglien, Niskanen, Johnson, Johnson
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Korea is only a year and a half away. Not sure Mathews is really ready by then nor will Pavelski fall off that hard.
 
Xokkeu said:
Korea is only a year and a half away. Not sure Mathews is really ready by then nor will Pavelski fall off that hard.
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If Matthews has a comparable rookie year to Eichel (and he should) then there's no reason he shouldn't be on the potential Olympic team, especially after his performance at the World Championship, plus here so far in the World Cup. Not to mention that all of our high-end centers are young sans Pavelski.

Pavelski I left off more just in favor of speed (Wheeler, Pacioretty), but he's a likely choice for the team assuming his game doesn't fall off as he can play both center and wing. Given the lack of results from Wheeler and Patches in the last two tournaments, I'm probably being generous with them both there.
 
William H Bonney said:
If Matthews has a comparable rookie year to Eichel (and he should) then there's no reason he shouldn't be on the potential Olympic team, especially after his performance at the World Championship, plus here so far in the World Cup. Not to mention that all of our high-end centers are young sans Pavelski.

Pavelski I left off more just in favor of speed (Wheeler, Pacioretty), but he's a likely choice for the team assuming his game doesn't fall off as he can play both center and wing. Given the lack of results from Wheeler and Patches in the last two tournaments, I'm probably being generous with them both there.
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Never been a huge fan of pacioretty. Good player but pretty one dimensional. I like wheeler though.
 
LordNeverLose said:
No, hee shouldnt have been forced to play for Torts alongside JJ
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Jack Johnson doesn't deserve to be on the team either but I don't give him the benefit of the doubt by saying he had to play next to Buff.

He wasn't paired with JJ tonight and he sucked.
 
Xokkeu said:
Nobody was good. They treated this like an exhibition tournament
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I think they thought more of themselves after the first win vs. Canada. And then didn't realize everyone else was kicking into gear after it. Even the remaining 2 exhibition games didn't clue them in. After the loss to Canada, they were "ok, we got a split, we're tied, we can win the series later", and in the Finland win, Finland played awful for 40 minutes and yet had a chance to tie with a 6-on-4 at the end of the game.

If the tournament was a true round robin, I think they'd go 2-5 with the only wins vs. the Czechs and Finns, and either of those I think they could lose. It's not like their 2 defeats to Europe and Canada were flukish or could've gone either way, they were deserved losers.
 
rj said:
I think they thought more of themselves after the first win vs. Canada. And then didn't realize everyone else was kicking into gear after it. Even the remaining 2 exhibition games didn't clue them in. After the loss to Canada, they were "ok, we got a split, we're tied, we can win the series later", and in the Finland win, Finland played awful for 40 minutes and yet had a chance to tie with a 6-on-4 at the end of the game.

If the tournament was a true round robin, I think they'd go 2-5 with the only wins vs. the Czechs and Finns, and either of those I think they could lose. It's not like their 2 defeats to Europe and Canada were flukish or could've gone either way, they were deserved losers.
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Yeah they definitely seemed to bring it for the exhibition games when the rest of the teams were kind of just going through the motions. I was wondering why they were trying so hard. Like beating Canada in the prelims and losing in the knockouts is bad. But no point beating them in the damn exhibition game!!
 
William H Bonney said:
If Matthews has a comparable rookie year to Eichel (and he should) then there's no reason he shouldn't be on the potential Olympic team, especially after his performance at the World Championship, plus here so far in the World Cup. Not to mention that all of our high-end centers are young sans Pavelski.
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Matthews will be on the 2018 Olympic team. No doubt out it. Pavelski looked a bit lost without Thornton feedimg him. Maybe Bowman finds a way to keep Pavelski in the lineup.
 
SanDogBrewin said:
Matthews will be on the 2018 Olympic team. No doubt out it. Pavelski looked a bit lost without Thornton feedimg him. Maybe Bowman finds a way to keep Pavelski in the lineup.
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No way Pavelski is out. The Korea Olympics are only a year and a half away. It's not that long. Waiting to see Mathews rookie year before proclaiming him in personally. Could be wrong though!
 
Xokkeu said:
Yeah they definitely seemed to bring it for the exhibition games when the rest of the teams were kind of just going through the motions. I was wondering why they were trying so hard. Like beating Canada in the prelims and losing in the knockouts is bad. But no point beating them in the damn exhibition game!!
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That's not what I'm saying. More just the team in that first exhibition win vs. Canada never showed up again or improved on that performance. I didn't watch the loss to Canada in Ottawa, but I did see the win in Columbus and the Finland game. The U.S. team in the Finland game was as listless as the one that lost to Europe. It's just so were the Finns for 40 minutes, and guess what, they're 0-2 and out of the tournament as well. Contrast to a team like the Russians who are hardly hitting on all cylinders either but they've been able to raise their game at points and will likely make at least the semifinals.
 
Goalies (x3):

John Gibson
Connor Hellebuyck
Quick/Bishop/Schneider

I think Schneider would be my starter, as of today, but wait n see on Bishop, Hellebuyck and Gibson as backups. The goalie position is a definite strength for the US.
 
LordNeverLose said:
Parise -- Pavelski -- Kane
Pacioretty -- Johnson -- Kessel
Backes -- Kesler -- Wheeler
JVR -- Stepan -- Palmieri
X - Ryan

Suter -- Byfuglien
McDonagh -- Carlson
Leddy -- Faulk
X - Shattenkirk

Schneider
Bishop
Quick


That would've been so much better a lineup.

IN: Kessel, Tyler Johnson, Ryan, Leddy, Faulk, Shattenkirk
OUT: Abdelkader, Dubinsky, Oshie, Erik Johnson, Jack Johnson, Niskanen
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Okpose-Johnson-Kane
Parise-Pavelski-Kessel
Pacioretty-Stastny-Wheeler
Palmieri-Stepan-Atkinson
Bjugstad, Oshie

Suter-Faulk
Fowler-Carlson
McDonagh-Shattenkirk
Leddy

Schneider
Bishop
Quick
 
They should all be ashamed of themselves. Not a good day for USA Hockey. Coaching sucked, players didn't show up. Disgrace.
 
I really thought Torts should have gone to Bishop after it was 3-1, try and shift the momentum.

Worst part of it all, USA played pretty well in the 2nd and 3rd periods.
 
The only upside here is this wasn't an IIHF tournament with "real world" implications. I tried to be positive about this team-but that was clearly irrational. This squad was doomed from the start due to how poorly it was envisioned/constructed/managed/coached. Poor leadership as well. I might have given the team a pass if there was consistent effort but there was none. I think this is a real eye opener as to the capabilities of several players at crunch time.
 
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