William Nylander Discussion: 2016 v2

[burpsalot]

Hi guys, I've missed the last three games or so. How has Nylander looked? No blue goggles analysis please

He played with multiple brain farts last night, especially in the first period. I thought his game improved after the 1st, but it still was not anything to brag about.

The previous two games Nylander looked pretty good, probably could have had 5 or 6 points. He gave some gift passes that should have been finished & missed an empty net himself.

PAP might have missed some opportunities, but he is probably the best finisher on the Leafs right now. Greening & Hyman are actually very similar players. I would like to see Nylander play with more skilled players. Kapanen & Nylander have played pretty well together with the Marlies & they seem to have chemistry. But Lindberg, Bozak & Kapanen looked pretty good yesterday so I don't think that will be broken up.

 

[burpsalot]

I think his play away from the puck is pretty good for someone his age. Defensively, he's in good position for the most part. He does need to work on his puck pursuit. That will come with age/time as he gets stronger though, and he will just need to be more aggressive in the dirty areas.

I also think his point totals are a bit misleading. He's had some very nice set-ups that weren't capitalized on by other players. He'll definitely benefit from having more talented wingers. Most of his issues stem from not having the puck enough - he'll need to work on being more aggressive to get it away from players rather than waiting for it to come to him.

I'm very encouraged by his debut .. Hope he tears it up with the Marlies once he's back down.

Good points & correct. I'm more concerned with whether players create the offensive opportunities. Nylander made a great pass to Boyes in the Florida (I think) game. Boyes scores Nylander has an assist, he missed no point. The great pass wasn't any less great just because there was no goal scored.

 

[TLeafsFan]

We do love to make the could have, should have, would have excuses for our players, don't we?

If X happens Nylander would have more points, if Y happens, Kadri would have more points, if Z happens GRABNER would have more points.

Fact is, Nylander was an 8th overall, Kadri a 7th and so far in their first taste of the NHL comparable, they are scoring at the same rate.

 

[Nithoniniel]

Nylander was abysmal against the Sabres. Weak on the puck, lost in his own zone, gaining no space so he could get no use of his skills.

However, I'm also in agreement with Bert. A lot of it was due to him not having the puck. Part of that problem is that he needs to be better at getting the puck himself, part of it is because Parenteau can't retrieve the puck and Greening is much worse at it than Hyman.

That's the key for Nylander. Hopefully he'll develop his game so that he'll retrieve the puck himself, but he can still be a very effective player even if that doesn't happen, it just means that he'll have dependencies. That's fine, most players have them.

We do love to make the could have, should have, would have excuses for our players, don't we?

If X happens Nylander would have more points, if Y happens, Kadri would have more points, if Z happens GRABNER would have more points.

Fact is, Nylander was an 8th overall, Kadri a 7th and so far in their first taste of the NHL comparable, they are scoring at the same rate.

Yes that is a fact. Just like it's a fact that Clarkson was a 30 goal scorer.

 

[Damisoph]

I think it's time for Willie to go back and get ready for the Calder Cup run. He's bound to light up some team in the last 5 games. CBJ probably.

 

[BertCorbeau]

We do love to make the could have, should have, would have excuses for our players, don't we?

If X happens Nylander would have more points, if Y happens, Kadri would have more points, if Z happens GRABNER would have more points.

Fact is, Nylander was an 8th overall, Kadri a 7th and so far in their first taste of the NHL comparable, they are scoring at the same rate.

They're scoring at the same rate, but Nylander is faster, better positioned, and more defensively responsible than Kadri was breaking into the league.

 

[TLeafsFan]

They're scoring at the same rate, but Nylander is faster, better positioned, and more defensively responsible than Kadri was breaking into the league.

Sounds like a product of a Babcock system vs. a Rotten Ronnie system to me.

Nylander wasn't like that defensively, overseas.

Large part of the reason he was brought out of SHL and onto the Marlies to develop in the first place.

Plus he had the benefit of being AHL eligible at his age.

 

[Mad Brills*]

Eh. Be great in the calder cup run, and come back in september ready to never play a game in the ahl again.

 

[Liminality]

Sounds like a product of a Babcock system vs. a Rotten Ronnie system to me.

Nylander wasn't like that defensively, overseas.

Large part of the reason he was brought out of SHL and onto the Marlies to develop in the first place.

Plus he had the benefit of being AHL eligible at his age.

Which has benefited Nylander greatly and enforces the idea that Nylander is having a better first showing than Kadri.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

Funny seeing that picture of Nylander with Eichel when they were kids. He played the same tournament with Marner and the Vaughan Kings around that age which they also won.

I cant figure out who he is...

 

[TLeafsFan]

Which has benefited Nylander greatly and enforces the idea that Nylander is having a better first showing than Kadri.

Not really. He's having roughly the same first showing, he's just fresh in your mind.

Kadri's first training camps were also better than Nylander's.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

Sounds like a product of a Babcock system vs. a Rotten Ronnie system to me.

Nylander wasn't like that defensively, overseas.

Large part of the reason he was brought out of SHL and onto the Marlies to develop in the first place.

Plus he had the benefit of being AHL eligible at his age.

He played just fine defensively with MoDo in the SHL. At least positioning wise.

The reason he was brought over was that MoDo was in the relegation zone and the whole situation up there was a big mess and they used Willy as their 1st line C, that is a lot of responsibility for a then 18 year old. They wanted him to get use to the smaller rink and get him out before pressure became to much for him.

 

[Liminality]

Not really. He's having roughly the same first showing, he's just fresh in your mind.

Kadri's first training camps were also better than Nylander's.

Not really. I remember Kadri's showing, it wasn't that long ago. It's fine if that's your opinion, I just remember it differently I guess.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

Not really. He's having roughly the same first showing, he's just fresh in your mind.

Kadri's first training camps were also better than Nylander's.

Yeah, I think you are confusing "putting on a show" with playing good hockey. Kadris biggest problem when he came up and until just recently is that he plays like a junior player, something Nylander has not done since he was drafted.

 

[Mats13]

I'd still consider Nylander way more well rounded than Kadri at the same age. Kadri in that year was 40% faceoffs, while Nylander is at 51%.

Kadri is more of a one on one on the rush type of offensive player while I consider Nylander a better player in the offensive zone because of his possession with the puck.

Kadri does bring more grit but I'd still consider Nylander's first season a greater impression than Kadri's.


It's interesting because Kadri's rookie season wasn't that long ago so most of us still remember what he was like and what he brought to the team back then.

Let me start by saying I agree with most of what you said and I think Nylander will turn out to be much better than Kadri.

But, the bolded is not true. I don't know if you remember it or not, but Kadri's first pre-season was incredible. He was something else, Rotten Ronnie ruined him and I'll never get over that (not that he's bad now, but what could have been)

 

[Menzinger]

Definitely experiencing growing pains (as is expected) - but has shown flashes of brilliance, particular with offense and even puck possession).

He should easily have 5 more points that he has at present.

 

[ACC1224]

Let me start by saying I agree with most of what you said and I think Nylander will turn out to be much better than Kadri.

But, the bolded is not true. I don't know if you remember it or not, but Kadri's first pre-season was incredible. He was something else, Rotten Ronnie ruined him and I'll never get over that (not that he's bad now, but what could have been)

No reason to believe that.

 

[Mats13]

No reason to believe that.

IIRC it was Wilson who wanted Kadri to gain weight (did the same thing to Schenn). Kadri used to be fast and electrifying, he didn't just forget how to skate fast.

 

[Liminality]

Let me start by saying I agree with most of what you said and I think Nylander will turn out to be much better than Kadri.

But, the bolded is not true. I don't know if you remember it or not, but Kadri's first pre-season was incredible. He was something else, Rotten Ronnie ruined him and I'll never get over that (not that he's bad now, but what could have been)

Yeah he had a good preseason. I was talking more about the regular season when the other poster brought up the points per game stats.

 

[burpsalot]

Yeah, I think you are confusing "putting on a show" with playing good hockey. Kadris biggest problem when he came up and until just recently is that he plays like a junior player, something Nylander has not done since he was drafted.

Lol.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Nylander has shown flashes of tremendous skill especially with his shooting and passing. However Babcock has challenged him by deliberately not playing him with skilled players like Kadri so most of Nylander's brilliant passes are wasted. Babcock is trying to force him to drive the offense.

He's also challenged him defensively by playing him against the other teams best centers like Eichel. I think he wants Willie to understand how much work it's going to take before he's able to compete with the top players in the league.

In terms of weakness the most glaring has been Nylander's abysmal board play. I can't recall him winning a single one on one battle for the puck along the boards. Some of this is a product of him being 19 yrs old going up against stronger 30 year old players but a good chunk of this is related to a lack of determination.

Right now I'd say that Brown, Soshnikov, Hyman and Lindberg are more NHL ready than Nylander keeping in mind that Willie is still a teenager playing center which is really difficult. Long term Nylander will develop into a star.

 

[Silver91]

IIRC it was Wilson who wanted Kadri to gain weight (did the same thing to Schenn). Kadri used to be fast and electrifying, he didn't just forget how to skate fast.

Kadri was never fast. He was slippery, which he still is, but even in Junior he was never considered a speedster. I think many people want to blame the early career struggles on Wilson, which is fair, but him not breaking camp that year did nothing to change his future. He would have caused the same frustrations he did when he turned pro, only he would have been younger and probably would have hurt his development a lot more.

 

[ACC1224]

IIRC it was Wilson who wanted Kadri to gain weight (did the same thing to Schenn). Kadri used to be fast and electrifying, he didn't just forget how to skate fast.

So it was Wilson who got him hooked on Big Macs?

 

[deletethis]

They're scoring at the same rate, but Nylander is faster, better positioned, and more defensively responsible than Kadri was breaking into the league.

He is definitely ahead of Kadri at the same pro experience level. However Nylander does make some facepalm decisions with the puck at times.

IIRC it was Wilson who wanted Kadri to gain weight (did the same thing to Schenn). Kadri used to be fast and electrifying, he didn't just forget how to skate fast.

I don't know what you're remembering. I think Kadri skates better now than he did as a 20 year old (as he should). If Kadri is slowed down due to bulk/weight, he's the slightest built overweight athlete I've even seen.

 

[Mess]

I think his play away from the puck is pretty good for someone his age. Defensively, he's in good position for the most part. He does need to work on his puck pursuit. That will come with age/time as he gets stronger though, and he will just need to be more aggressive in the dirty areas.

I also think his point totals are a bit misleading. He's had some very nice set-ups that weren't capitalized on by other players. He'll definitely benefit from having more talented wingers. Most of his issues stem from not having the puck enough - he'll need to work on being more aggressive to get it away from players rather than waiting for it to come to him.

I'm very encouraged by his debut .. Hope he tears it up with the Marlies once he's back down.

He has some nice moments that show real potential and promise.

However Babcock will be looking for more particularly without the puck. His offensive skill is undeniable.

Compete level and intensity will be issues with the coach.