Will Mitch Marner become star?

[WTFMAN99]

I honestly don't mean to crap on Bozak, but his game has really deteriorated. The Bozak Kessel had was fine for Mitch, this one isn't good enough...a winger shouldn't have to continually "drive" a line. It's not an excuse, it's a reality, Bozak is a diminishing asset.

He was playing on the top line with some great wingers and now in a sheltered role he can't even do anything despite elite wingers.

 

[LeafFever]

Lb for lb Marner is dominant.
It’s just he’s 158.
And the rest of the league is 210+

Yeah but there's guys the same size who are putting up great production. The NHl has changed, it's more focused on speed and skill

 

[DarkKnight]

Yeah but there's guys the same size who are putting up great production. The NHl has changed, it's more focused on speed and skill

Further to that, the average weight of players has been declining since 2004.

 

[Mess]

Further to that, the average weight of players has been declining since 2004.

Last season the average NHLer was reported as 6-2/ 201 lbs.

 

[ULF_55]

Last season the average NHLer was reported as 6-2/ 201 lbs.

They were talking BMI the other day (Fan960) and laughing about how tight it is now with meeting the BMI targets compared to a few years ago.

So that likely has an impact on weight, but not muscle mass.

 

[DarkKnight]

Last season the average NHLer was reported as 6-2/ 201 lbs.

Yes, it was 208 in 2004.

 

[Mess]

They were talking BMI the other day (Fan960) and laughing about how tight it is now with meeting the BMI targets compared to a few years ago.

So that likely has an impact on weight, but not muscle mass.

For his size, its been reported Marner is fairly strong and as far as weights in the gym goes anyways.

The hope is that in time Marner gets strong enough so that he can move up from a 3rd line/PP specialist of 15:00 min ATOI player to one the coach no longer needs to be sheltered/insulate and he moves up into the top 6 forwards.

That said Babcock knows he has a talent mismatch using Marner as 3rd liner against easier QofC nightly.. Last night was a good example as Bozak 3rd line went head-to-head all night against 3rd line Jim Dowd's line and it allowed Leafs to exploit that when Bozie scored to tie the game.

 

[Mess]

I thought last night it was going to be a Marner vs Boeser comparing players from the same 2015 draft class as compatibles, but it turned into a Matthews vs Boeser contest instead of the 20 year old Americans snipers matched up in comparison.

Marner was never mentioned in terms of Boeser comparison.

 

[Apotheosis]

Is it time to put him with Matthews again and see what they can do? Marner has found his game again and Matthews is slowly rounding back in to form.

 

[Menzinger]

Yeah but there's guys the same size who are putting up great production. The NHl has changed, it's more focused on speed and skill

I’m surprised we’re still having this debate.

Smaller players are here to say, and are playing key roles on winning teams

 

[Apotheosis]

Run something like;

Hyman - Matthews - Marner -> Top offensive line, best possession players.

JVR - Nylander - Marleau (or switch Marleau with Nylander position) -> Sheltered offensive line feasting on opposing teams lower pairings.

Komarov - Kadri - Brown -> Gritty match-up line.

Martin - Moore - Leivo -> Stereotypical 4th line.

In line with Babcock's tendencies as much as possible.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Is it time to put him with Matthews again and see what they can do? Marner has found his game again and Matthews is slowly rounding back in to form.

Is he snake bit? 1 point in last 5 games while getting ample PP time. Seems like he is rounding into form then goes into another point slump. Also, only 5 goals isn't going to cut it. Lots of chances but can't finish. Not being critical just commenting on what I am seeing. Probably still has some ways to go before he is a star.

 

[Legion34]

Is he snake bit? 1 point in last 5 games while getting ample PP time. Seems like he is rounding into form then goes into another point slump. Also, only 5 goals isn't going to cut it. Lots of chances but can't finish. Not being critical just commenting on what I am seeing. Probably still has some ways to go before he is a star.

He was better than stamkos and kucherov put together 3 games ago. Sooo there’s that.

 

[PromisedLand]

Run something like;

Hyman - Matthews - Marner -> Top offensive line, best possession players.

JVR - Nylander - Marleau (or switch Marleau with Nylander position) -> Sheltered offensive line feasting on opposing teams lower pairings.

Komarov - Kadri - Brown -> Gritty match-up line.

Martin - Moore - Leivo -> Stereotypical 4th line.

In line with Babcock's tendencies as much as possible.

I have been dreaming about

1. JVR-Matthews-Hyman (babs can keep hyman there - two 2-way forwards in Papi and Hyman)
2. Marleau-Nylander-Marner (; Nylander transitions to center in a sheltered role)
3. Komarov-Kadri-Brown
4. Martin/Sosh - GOAT - Leivo

PP1

• Matthews-JVR (screen) - Brown - Rielly - Nylander

PP2

• Kadri - Marleau - Leivo(Screen) - Gardiner - Marner

PK1
Komarov Hyman
Hainsey Polak

PK2
GOAT Sosh/Brown
Rielly Zaitsev


Get something for Bozak; and if we can unload Komarov - Kappy comes in to take Leo's duties.

Come on Babs and Lou; make it happen!!!

 

[PromisedLand]

For his size, its been reported Marner is fairly strong and as far as weights in the gym goes anyways.

The hope is that in time Marner gets strong enough so that he can move up from a 3rd line/PP specialist of 15:00 min ATOI player to one the coach no longer needs to be sheltered/insulate and he moves up into the top 6 forwards.

That said Babcock knows he has a talent mismatch using Marner as 3rd liner against easier QofC nightly.. Last night was a good example as Bozak 3rd line went head-to-head all night against 3rd line Jim Dowd's line and it allowed Leafs to exploit that when Bozie scored to tie the game.

If Martin St.Louis can do it; why can't Magic Mitch?

for folks that forget - St.Louis was 5'8" and this is what he was in NHL:

Magic Mitch will get there. St. Louis is a great story, an inspiration to many "small" players.

 

[stickty111]

Marner is a small player and those kind of players have a higher chance to become great players in the NHL, and is already proving that. Marner is very close to being a star if he isnt there already.

 

[Stephen]

I thought last night it was going to be a Marner vs Boeser comparing players from the same 2015 draft class as compatibles, but it turned into a Matthews vs Boeser contest instead of the 20 year old Americans snipers matched up in comparison.

Marner was never mentioned in terms of Boeser comparison.

Aside from draft year Boeser vs Marner doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

[Stephen]

Is it time to put him with Matthews again and see what they can do? Marner has found his game again and Matthews is slowly rounding back in to form.

One issue I have with the idea of Matthews and Marner is the fact that Matthews and Nylander are so good together playing their keep away game. I don't see that out of Marner to be honest.

 

[Apotheosis]

One issue I have with the idea of Matthews and Marner is the fact that Matthews and Nylander are so good together playing their keep away game. I don't see that out of Marner to be honest.

Marner has been a better possession player than Nylander for a good while now. No reason why he can't do the same with Matthews.

 

[Mr Hockey]

Marner has been a better possession player than Nylander for a good while now. No reason why he can't do the same with Matthews.

and Bozak, JVR is also better possession players than Matthews and Nylander, using your understanding of possession. lol

 

[Mess]

Marner has been a better possession player than Nylander for a good while now. No reason why he can't do the same with Matthews.

Babcock is trying to turn the team into a more dump and chase team and so the Matthews line is much better at winning puck battles and getting the puck back after giving up possession and a lot of that is due in part to Hyman and his dog on a bone attitude.

The Bozak line doesn't compete hard enough to dump pucks in and then go get it again , and I can't see Babcock asking Marner to ever be the first man into the corners or battling in Dmen behind the icing line to regain the puck... Marner drives a line offensively but likes to carry the puck and dangles with it, where that leads to better possession #'s, but when the opposition clogs up the ice and disrupts the attack it can also make a rush line less effective. Babcock doesn't want the Matthews line to be a rush line.

It will be interesting to see what happens with Marner if Leafs walk away from JVR and Bozak this summer and who his new linemates will become. I think Babcock like will keep the Matthews line intact as is, and Connor Brown might replace Komarov on the Kadri -- Marleau is uncle Leo moves on.

 

[Menzinger]

The sooner that dump and chase experiment ends the better.

This isn’t the 2012 LA kings, a team full of grinders.

 

[IPS]

The sooner that dump and chase experiment ends the better.

This isn’t the 2012 LA kings, a team full of grinders.

I'd like to think our team more resembles the Hawks instead of the Kings. Hawks never did a dump and chase system and frustrated teams with lighting quick transition and puck movement. Also helps they have Kane who's probably the best player in the league at controlled zone entries.

 

[Menzinger]

I'd like to think our team more resembles the Hawks instead of the Kings. Hawks never did a dump and chase system and frustrated teams with lighting quick transition and puck movement. Also helps they have Kane who's probably the best player in the league at controlled zone entries.

The forward group in particular is very similar to the Hawks (though the Leafs have better centre depth). Stylistically when the Leafs arenplaying their best, it’s certwinly like how the Hawks played. As you said - using speed and skill for lethal effect.

 

[Mr Hockey]

The sooner that dump and chase experiment ends the better.

This isn’t the 2012 LA Kings, a team full of grinders.

Why do you think Babcock would switch from a controlled zone entry team to a dump and chase entry team?

• #34,29,16,43,44 are our successful zone entry guys, the rest would just create turnovers at the o'zone blueline.