Player Discussion Will Cuylle

[GAGLine]

Shesty is a bit question mark.
If we sign guys without signing him, we could absolutely force the issue with him.

That's a risky proposition. I know a lot of people are of the belief that we can win with an average goalie, but anyone who actually watches this team should realize that isn't the case, at least not as currently constructed.

Cuylle will get a bridge deal and Shesty will likely get his 12 mil. To quote Scott Gomez, "It is what it is."

 

[bhamill]

Jumping the gun will cost us cap space as well. The only difference is when. We either pay more now in the hopes we save later or save now and potentially pay more later. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to this.

More often than not, we don't have a choice because we are too close to the cap to offer players longer-term deals. If you look at those deals that turn into bargains, most of them are signed when a team is terrible and has plenty of cap space. Teams that are perennial cup contenders don't typically have that luxury.

If we can move Trouba's full cap hit, maybe we can afford to give Cuylle a longer-term deal with a higher AAV that will one day be a bargain. Or maybe that extra cap space will go to re-signing Kakko instead, or to signing someone to replace Lindgren. More than likely, Cuylle will get a bridge deal and we'll be tight up against the cap yet again. It's just the reality of our situation.

A boy can dream.

 

[Luger]

Trouba has 1 year left after this one and the actual salary is $6M next year. Someone would take Trouba at full salary and pay for him in the summer. Potentially, we could get a good return at the TDL because someone would have Trouba for 2 playoffs at the cost of 1 year of the cap hit, but we're Cup contenders and won't be dumping players at the TDL. But next summer, he's getting shipped out. His no-trade list will be reduced from 15 to 12 teams, so 20 teams will be fair game.

 

[Deas]

So how good is his upside? 60 point 2nd-liner?

 

[Rempe73]

So how good is his upside? 60 point 2nd-liner?

I see him as more of a Jesper Fast type. Elite bottom 6 forward who can play anywhere but won’t drive a line ever. He has more offensive tools than Fast but is not as good defensively.

 

[leetch99]

Geesh...do we have to relive the Fast saga again ?

 

[ReddestRum]

Geesh...do we have to relive the Fast saga again ?

 

[Fitzy]

So how good is his upside? 60 point 2nd-liner?

Been thinking about this a little more recently as he seems to have made a little bit of an improvement with his hands and stickhandling.

The path to go from a bigger, faster, better Brendan Lemieux to an actual power forward is a long one, and the reputation is that power forwards take a while to reach their full potential. So it's hard to know and ceilings are really difficult because when you can skate and have size, it often means the sky is nearly the limit but there's a huge distribution curve in terms of 'random error'

I think his 'likely' upside is 25-20-45 on a 2nd pp unit. But with a player like that there's always the outside chance he becomes more. Wilson, Bertuzzi both took like 5 seasons to take their offense to the next level.

I don't think he ever becomes even a poor man's version of that, but there's always the outside chance.

 

[LeetchisGod]

Cuylle should be the eventual Kreider replacement on the power play. He needs to be practicing deflections.

 

[will1066]

Geesh...do we have to relive the Fast saga again ?

Cuylle should be the eventual Kreider replacement on the power play. He needs to be practicing deflections.

They're priming Kakko for that role

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Does this guy hold the record for most disallowed goals?

 

[NickyFotiu]

What is the hurry to label him. Last season he was Cam Neely. This season a 13-15 goal 3rd line guy that can hit. Me, I'm just waiting to see. No need for me to guess. I like seeing big players that can skate and shoot but Will definitely hit a wall in the 2nd half of last season.

 

[noncents]

What is the hurry to label him. Last season he was Cam Neely. This season a 13-15 goal 3rd line guy that can hit. Me, I'm just waiting to see. No need for me to guess. I like seeing big players that can skate and shoot but Will definitely hit a wall in the 2nd half of last season.

nobody's insisting on a label. people just like to have discussions on this, y'know, discussion board.

 

[NickyFotiu]

nobody's insisting on a label. people just like to have discussions on this, y'know, discussion board.

Fair enough.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Does this guy hold the record for most disallowed goals?

Did they ever say on the broadcast why his 2nd goal was reviewed? Was at game.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Did they ever say on the broadcast why his 2nd goal was reviewed? Was at game.

kicking motion. went in off his foot.

 

[patnyrnyg]

kicking motion. went in off his foot.

Gotchya. After I posted I saw a highlight, but not in slow motion, so thought it might have been that. Thank you.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I see him as more of a Jesper Fast type. Elite bottom 6 forward who can play anywhere but won’t drive a line ever. He has more offensive tools than Fast but is not as good defensively.

Fast?

I don't see that even remotely.

 

[Rempe73]

Fast?

I don't see that even remotely.

What I mean is his role and upside. Not stylistically. He clearly has more offensive upside than Fast, but I don’t know about him being a staple top 6 guy. That being said, I can see him playing anywhere and being successful as a complementary winger.

Geesh...do we have to relive the Fast saga again ?

What do you mean?
Edit: Oh. Lias Andersson haha. But what I mean is that he won’t necessarily be a line-driving top 6 forward, but he’ll have a ton of value as a complementary player with actual skill who you can plug anywhere.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Since we are and aren't using labels. If you want a Rangers comparable, his game has elements of Graves. Hite everything, skates well, nose for the net and defends his teammates. Not saying Will is a 30 or 50 goal scorer.

Modern day comparable is guys like Alex Tuch or Killorn. Not line drivers but guys that are glue guys for more skilled players while not holding them back.

 

[dshea19]

The only thing I know is that Kakko wishes to be the player Cuylle is at this point. I really want Kakko to bloom into a star, but Cuylle feels like he has more upside at this point.

 

[bhamill]

The only thing I know is that Kakko wishes to be the player Cuylle is at this point. I really want Kakko to bloom into a star, but Cuylle feels like he has more upside at this point.

I disagree. We’re hoping Will has a 40 point season, Kakko already has, did it a year younger than Cuylle is now. Kakko is head and shoulders above Will on D and possession. Will is a far superior hitter but both are good forecheckers, Kakko being better at actually getting the puck. They have similarities and differences but most objective observers would likely agree that Kakko is the better overall player right now AND has a higher ceiling.
This isn’t a knock on Cuylle. Love him as a player, but saying he’s ahead of Kakko is kind of wild to me. Think this is just frustration at Kakko's not looking like a 2OA tainting the comparison.

 

[tlk]

Cuylle needs a miracle to become a top6 player lol.

 

[NYR Viper]

Cuylle and Kakko COMPLIMENT eachother. It shouldn't be a one or the other, it's both. Cuylle has the straight line speed and strength to get in on the forecheck but Kakko has the puck protection and strength to win the puck and make a play with it. Chytil being the puck transporter just works on that line too.

 

[dshea19]

I disagree. We’re hoping Will has a 40 point season, Kakko already has, did it a year younger than Cuylle is now. Kakko is head and shoulders above Will on D and possession. Will is a far superior hitter but both are good forecheckers, Kakko being better at actually getting the puck. They have similarities and differences but most objective observers would likely agree that Kakko is the better overall player right now AND has a higher ceiling.
This isn’t a knock on Cuylle. Love him as a player, but saying he’s ahead of Kakko is kind of wild to me. Think this is just frustration at Kakko's not looking like a 2OA tainting the comparison.

As far as raw talent, Kakko has far more. No question on that. However, in the many years that Kakko has been here, how many times has he scored a goal the way Cuylle did on the offsides goal? Zero. Kakko lacks everything Cuylle has as far as the attack dog mentality. Yes, Kakko is definitely better in those areas, but the kid lacks finish. Cuylle has a level of finish, or finish attitude, that Kakko just seems to have lost at some point. Cuylle just seems to make the most of what he has vs Kakko just seeming to fall way short of what he has. Cuylle is a middle six forward. Never going to be a 1st line guy and can definitely be a 2nd with the right line mates in the perfect situation. Great 3rd liner. Kakko should never be worse than a solid 2nd liner with the tools he has. He just doesn't attack in the way he should. He should be a monster coming off the wall and attacking the net and he seems like he is content to be a Craig Janney style playmaker.