Why did Quebec not get a team?

[ORRFForever]

At the end of the day, Bettman has us / Canada by the <fill in the blank>...

Canadians love hockey. Canadians love the NHL - we pay insane prices few would pay. Canadians are NOT willing to turn their back on the NHL - even when Bettman continually treats us like the Ugly Step Sister.

In summary : Canada has no one to blame but ourselves. Our loyalty to a league that shows NO loyalty back is foolish - to put it mildly.

I am off for a swim.

 

[LuckyDay]

I don't think Gary was ever afraid of tapping into the non traditional markets.

The mission presented to him when he was brought on board was to get a legitimate national TV deal in the US. In order for that to happen, he needed to get more teams particularly in the south, which is exactly what he did.

The southern movement started almost immediately under his watch with moving teams to Texas, Arizona, and north Carolina and then expanding to Tennessee, and Georgia.

Infact, the nhl had already started the process of expanding their southern exposure prior to bettman with new teams in Florida, and California.

Most of these franchises appear relatively healthy and are still standing, so I don't think there would have been much apprehension by the time they got to 2017 and Vegas came in.

Don't forget he got the second team in Florida as it turns out John Ziegler didn't vet Tampa's Japanese investors well enough and they tried to flip the team as soon as they won the franchise rights. (TB and Ottawa were the only two perspective owners that were willing to pony up the $50m, no questions asked and no attempt to negotiate. Hamilton and another team (in Florida?) were supposed to be shoe-ins but suddenly the league was stuck with two teams who's finances were questionable).

 

[cowboy82nd]

P.S.

BCE is a HUGE company. You seem to be imply an NHL team is too big a cost for BCE. If that's what you think, you're way off base.

Never implied such a thing. I just stated that if you think Bell (TSN) should get a team, let them go through the process.

 

[njdevil26]

They have an arena.... the metro area has the same population as Winnipeg...

I've been up there a few times and souvenir shops and other stores still sell things with the Nords logo on it. I know the people that live there want the team.

I wonder if it just comes down to an ownership group willing to part with a billion dollars to get the ball rolling.

 

[Salsero1]

At the end of the day, Bettman has us / Canada by the <fill in the blank>...

Canadians love hockey. Canadians love the NHL - we pay insane prices few would pay. Canadians are NOT willing to turn their back on the NHL - even if Bettman continually treats us like the Ugly Step Sister.

In summary : Canada has no one to blame but ourselves. Our loyalty to a league that shows NO loyalty back, is foolish - to put it mildly.

I am off for a swim.

There are 7 teams in Canada. Far more than any other pro sports league. Why do you think they owe you more?

 

[rojac]

If Bettman can look past Atlanta folding twice, he can look past 10,000 empty seats.

As we both know, Bettman has NO interest in adding a team in Canada and the seating in QC is irrelevant. QC could sell out both games and have a 20,000 season ticket waiting list and Bettman would yawn.

Like I said before, foall the money Sportsnet/TSN pays to televise NHL hockey, they should pressure the NHL to add a Canadian team. If Sportsnet/TSN said, "We want another Canadian teams to make the NHL Canadian package profitable and we're not buying in until we get a guarantee of an 8th team", Bettman would start the process of adding another Canadian team tomorrow.T

Currently, TSN pays no money to the NHL. They do pay money to a few individual teams for regional rights.

Can the NHL guarantee an 8th team in Canada? Would there be enough competition for that franchise to guarantee that the expansion fee will be high enough to not reduce franchise values of all teams? For how long is the NHL guaranteeing 8 NHL teams in Canada? If a Canadian teams becomes unviable, is the NHL forced to only allow it to move to a Canadian market and if so, what impact will that limitation have on franchise valuations?
Is such a move worth it for Canadian broadcasters? Are there enough additional national advertising to pay for the production of ~30 new national broadcasts? Are there enough additionalregional advertising dollars to pay for the production of ~50 new regional broadcasts? And what impact will have this new team have on their current regional advertising dollars..

The Canaidan national TV deal is worth ~350M a year to the NHL. The US national TV deals are worth ~650, almost twice as much. Surely if the US broadcasters got together in the same way and demanded fewer Canadian teams, then the NHL should start forcing Canadian team owners to relocate or fold their teams, right?

Just a few of my thoughts on attempting such a move.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Sure, blame Gary.

Obviously, who else should I blame?

 

[rojac]

Don't forget he got the second team in Florida as it turns out John Ziegler didn't vet Tampa's Japanese investors well enough and they tried to flip the team as soon as they won the franchise rights. (TB and Ottawa were the only two perspective owners that were willing to pony up the $50m, no questions asked and no attempt to negotiate. Hamilton and another team (in Florida?) were supposed to be shoe-ins but suddenly the league was stuck with two teams who's finances were questionable).

The expansion to south Florida was approved the same day that Bettman was confirmed as commissioner (a job he wouldn't start for a few months), so I'm not sure how much, if anything, Gary had to cDo with it. That expansion also had more to do with getting Huzienga as an owner. If Huzienga had wanted a team in Ohio, I suspect they would have added a team in Ohio.

 

[waitin425]

I hope some day!

 

[Nogatco Rd]

Obviously, who else should I blame?

The guys writing his checks

 

[hangman005]

The guys writing his checks

I was going to blame Moldova, I don't feel they get blamed for enough in todays world.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Currently, TSN pays no money to the NHL. They do pay money to a few individual teams for regional rights.

Can the NHL guarantee an 8th team in Canada? Would there be enough competition for that franchise to guarantee that the expansion fee will be high enough to not reduce franchise values of all teams? For how long is the NHL guaranteeing 8 NHL teams in Canada? If a Canadian teams becomes unviable, is the NHL forced to only allow it to move to a Canadian market and if so, what impact will that limitation have on franchise valuations?
Is such a move worth it for Canadian broadcasters? Are there enough additional national advertising to pay for the production of ~30 new national broadcasts? Are there enough additionalregional advertising dollars to pay for the production of ~50 new regional broadcasts? And what impact will have this new team have on their current regional advertising dollars..

The Canaidan national TV deal is worth ~350M a year to the NHL. The US national TV deals are worth ~650, almost twice as much. Surely if the US broadcasters got together in the same way and demanded fewer Canadian teams, then the NHL should start forcing Canadian team owners to relocate or fold their teams, right?

Just a few of my thoughts on attempting such a move.

So the US tv deal finally past the CDN deal from a decade ago. Remember when the US deal was free lol. So the current US deal is nearly double, but have 3 and half times the teams.

TSN currently has leafs, Sens, habs and jets as regional broadcasts, had more but a couple of changes now. So that is North of $150 million.

If a new team is awarded, another broadcast team is hired, so ya if Quebec came back they would have no issues getting broadcasters. Actually would have 2, French and English.

 

[cowboy82nd]

Obviously, who else should I blame?

The league owners, you know the people that actually run the league.

 

[ORRFForever]

Never implied such a thing. I just stated that if you think Bell (TSN) should get a team, let them go through the process.

Sure you did, when you said, "and don't forget their deposit".

There are 7 teams in Canada. Far more than any other pro sports league. Why do you think they owe you more?

Because of the amount of NHL revenue that comes from Canada. Plus, fixing Q.C. would be the right thing to do.

 

[ORRFForever]

Currently, TSN pays no money to the NHL. They do pay money to a few individual teams for regional rights.

Can the NHL guarantee an 8th team in Canada? Would there be enough competition for that franchise to guarantee that the expansion fee will be high enough to not reduce franchise values of all teams? For how long is the NHL guaranteeing 8 NHL teams in Canada? If a Canadian teams becomes unviable, is the NHL forced to only allow it to move to a Canadian market and if so, what impact will that limitation have on franchise valuations?
Is such a move worth it for Canadian broadcasters? Are there enough additional national advertising to pay for the production of ~30 new national broadcasts? Are there enough additionalregional advertising dollars to pay for the production of ~50 new regional broadcasts? And what impact will have this new team have on their current regional advertising dollars..

The Canaidan national TV deal is worth ~350M a year to the NHL. The US national TV deals are worth ~650, almost twice as much. Surely if the US broadcasters got together in the same way and demanded fewer Canadian teams, then the NHL should start forcing Canadian team owners to relocate or fold their teams, right?

Just a few of my thoughts on attempting such a move.

As I have said many times, keep the Canadian TV money in Canada - and use that to support the Canadians teams.
The U.S. teams can split the American TV money.

Let's do the math :

$350M / 7 CDN teams = $50M per team.
$650M / 25 US Teams = $26M per team.

In fact, keep ALL Canadian revenue North of the border. If we do that, we can add Canadian teams without worry. A Win-Win.

 

[joestevens29]

All it really comes down to is there an owner willing to spend more than 1 billion for an expansion team and if there is enough corporate support.

Having loyal fans is all fine and dandy, but you need the first two

 

[ORRFForever]

All it really comes down to is there an owner willing to spend more than 1 billion for an expansion team and if there is enough corporate support.

Having loyal fans is all fine and dandy, but you need the first two

That's fair but if the NHL was willing to move hell and high water to keep a team in Arizona for 28 years, they should make things right in Quebec City. Help a team out in QC for 3 decades like they did with the Coyotes and then, if they can't make it work, move them.

**

A big part of the problem is the current Canadian teams. Toronto is doing far more to prevent another team in Southern Ontario than Bettman is. Montreal is doing the same with Quebec City. They have monopolies over a large chunk of prime hockey crazy real estate and they don't want to give it up. TBH, if I was them, I wouldn't want to, either.

Typical Canada : Shooting ourselves in the foot.

**

I'm proud of the people of Quebec City for NOT buying tickets. Why should they? They are NOT getting a team so why give the NHL their money? They should also stops buying Habs merchandise / stop supporting that team as well.

 

[ORRFForever]

So the US tv deal finally past the CDN deal from a decade ago. Remember when the US deal was free lol. So the current US deal is nearly double, but have 3 and half times the teams.

TSN currently has leafs, Sens, habs and jets as regional broadcasts, had more but a couple of changes now. So that is North of $150 million.

If a new team is awarded, another broadcast team is hired, so ya if Quebec came back they would have no issues getting broadcasters. Actually would have 2, French and English.

As I said, GJ, Canadians have no one to blame but ourselves. As Bruce Arthur once wrote (paraphrasing), "Canada is like the plain girl at the prom, forever trying to get the attention of the handsome valedictorian (the NHL) who ignores her".

Canadians pay obscene prices for NHL tickets, we watch on TV by the millions, we buy their crappy merchandise and we do everything we can to help the league but, when we ask for another team, we're told, "Sorry, the brothel's full".

I'll never spend another dollar on the NHL. Every Canadian should join me.

 

[Golden_Jet]

As I have said many times, keep the Canadian TV money in Canada - and use that to support the Canadians teams.
The U.S. teams can split the American TV money.

Let's do the math :

$350M / 7 CDN teams = $50M per team.
$650M / 25 US Teams = $26M per team.

In fact, keep ALL Canadian revenue North of the border. If we do that, we can add Canadian teams without worry. A Win-Win.

Good points, and when the US deal was free, it was divided 7/30 and 23/30

 

[ORRFForever]

Good points, and when the US deal was free, it was divided 7/30 and 23/30

Yes.

U.S. posters LOVE to say that QC can't survive but, if ALL the Canadian money stayed in Canada like it should, that would NOT be an issue.

Bettman needs to throw Canada a bone on the expansion front. One flippin team! Even if he sells us an expansion team at a discount. But, of course, that will NOT happen unless Rogers/BCE demand it - they need to say, "We want more Canadian teams to keep the Canadian TV package profitable".

 

[maskingagent]

This is an honest question. And I'm not a super angry Canadian who thinks the NHL hates us. I'm just honestly confused because I thought they had an NHL ready arena and some super rich dude that was willing to pony up. Was it simply the East vs West thing needing to be worked out? Or were there other reasons. The NHL has shown it's willingness to go back to former Canadian markets so I have to believe that isn't it. As a Habs fan I kinda hoped it would happen because that was a damn good rivalry back in the day.

Quebec is simply too small of a hockey market in today's NHL, with today's franchise money. I don't see them ever getting another franchise as the NHL has outgrown their budget. The Canadian dollar will never allow them to, the tax situation in Canada, nor will there be a dramatic population increase to help make it a "large hockey center."

Bettman sees Canada as a safety net for relocation not an expansion opportunity.

Canada and its weak dollar will not even be able to handle a relocation.

 

[maskingagent]

Yes.

U.S. posters LOVE to say that QC can't survive but, if ALL the Canadian money stayed in Canada like it should, that would NOT be an issue.

Bettman needs to throw Canada a bone on the expansion front. One flippin team! Even if he sells us an expansion team at a discount. But, of course, that will NOT happen unless Rogers/BCE demand it - they need to say, "We want more Canadian teams to keep the Canadian TV package profitable".

Never going to happen unless the Canadian dollar increases in value. Talk to the PM about that.

 

[ORRFForever]

Never going to happen unless the Canadian dollar increases in value. Talk to the PM about that.

Your post makes NO sense. What does keeping Canadian revenue in Canada to support Canadian teams have to do with the Canadian dollar or the P.M.?

The $350M Rogers pays to the NHL annually is in US$. Just split that among the CDN teams. The U.S. teams can keep their TV revenue and split it among their teams. Do that and we'll be just fine.

 

[maskingagent]

Atlanta will get another expansion team in 2027, move to Quebec in 2035

never going to happen

Your post makes NO sense. What does keeping Canadian revenue in Canada to support Canadian teams have to do with the Canadian dollar or the P.M.?

canada revenue is faced with too many taxes. bettman will never throw a bone unless the Cdn dollar increases in value. simple

 

[ORRFForever]

never going to happen


canada revenue is faced with too many taxes. bettman will never throw a bone unless the Cdn dollar increases in value. simple

We agree on one thing : Bettman's not going to do it.