Whitecloud hit on Knies | Knies did not return to the game.

[geebster]

View attachment 933508
On contact, Knies' head moves first and independently from his body. No matter what, this is a penalty.

That's not the rule though. It has to be main point to contact AND avoidable. Avoidable has 3 different considerations. I posted a longform response in this thread going through each one but overall it's not avoidable head contact unless you are super charitable about it and say Whiteclouds body moving up into the hit was a body extension specifically done to target/"pick" the head. I wish it was against the rules but it isn't.

 

[2014nyr]

That's it, move the goal posts

You are the one that blamed Knies for skating up ice while carrying the puck 'hunched forward'

That's how you f***ing skate forward

He had his head down and looked up too late

Had nothing to do with being hunched forward

if a player carries it through the neutral zone with their head down...they should expect to get their doors blown off. the hit was square through the center of his body...you can't skate head first into a hit and complain about your head getting hit. you have to expect that, or worse, to be the result if you carry through the neutral zone with your head down. if you get casual with respecting that threat, eventually there's a reminder.

if people want to watch players skate around staring at their feet without any concerns of being yardsaled, they created roller hockey for that.

 

[1989]

View attachment 933508
On contact, Knies' head moves first and independently from his body. No matter what, this is a penalty.

The things this clip's angle clarifies perfectly is that Whitecloud did not leave his feet and that his arm was textbook tucked in the entire way, as well as the hit being entirely north-south - as is, there is no clipping or picking of the head but clearly a hit through to the body where the head is.

By this metric I would not expect any suspension based on Knies' body position because by the rules of the NHL as this is allowable head contact.

Whether one likes the hit or not is subjective but I just don't see how it is decried as illegal.

 

[f7ben]

Beautiful hit , exactly what we need more of in the league. If the millionaire whiners on the ice don’t want to get hit they should pick a non contact game or learn how not to put themselves in vulnerable positions.

I hate the Knights and I hate the NHL officiating and Dops but this they got right. Should state I also hate the leafs lol

 

[hirawl]

Straight through the core therefore clean. Unfortunately sometimes the head is also caught with a clean hit.

 

[f7ben]

Straight through the core therefore clean. Unfortunately sometimes the head is also caught with a clean hit.

100%

 

[1989]

Straight through the core therefore clean. Unfortunately sometimes the head is also caught with a clean hit.

I would argue that any hit with head contact can be described as dirty, but it doesn't make it illegal under current NHL rules. Or, for better explanation - dirty or clean is a subjective moral interpretation which is not defined by written rules.

I 100000% have no idea where the people saying there was an elbow to the head are seeing it. Even the still photos show Whitecloud has his elbow tucked prior to any impact.

 

[Peasy]

Feel like its pretty similar to Reaves hit.

Right on that line of good/clean hit. Since Reaves got 5 games plus tossed out of the game he was in, Whitecloud should get at least some games but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Nowhere near as bad as Reaves but Reaves hit was awful and deserved more than he got probably. Those type of hits have nothing to do with hockey, just picking someone head off. Throw the book at whoever does that.

There was clear head contact here and it was violently the first point of contact(partially due to Knies posture with his head down, he needs to know better). However he did have full body contact. I think it's a little bit predatory due to the fact that he's rising into his head as he makes contact. He timed it well enough that his skates stayed on the ice until contact so it's not charging, but IMO it was reckless. Knows Knies is a bit bent over and instead of trying to get only the body he willingly rising into the hit with his shouler at Knies head height. I don't think it's a suspension, but I think 5 and a game would be reasonable. 2 Minutes at worst. I don't think it's clean.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I don't think this is suspension worthy under the current ruleset. I also think that:
1. It should be
2. If a Leafs player committed the same hit there would be a hearing and probable 1-2 game suspension

More than 1-2 guaranteed. That's a min 3 gamer.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I will say though, it is mad how often a Leafs player gets injured, and misses a significant amount of time, without even a 2 min penalty being assessed. Knies has already gone through the same thing with the Bennett incident.

 

[Hobnobs]

Straight through the core. It's a good hit.

 

[D Wakaluk]

Herein lies the problem ..

Are you allowed to destroy someone in a hunched down position?

Yeah, sometimes.

 

[HabsForHire]

You’re right. The Whitecloud one was worse. Left his feet and got all head.

funny, his feet were off the ice after contact

 

[thusk]

no the same thing as read but the moment you jump to make that kind of hit, 100% no doubt than your goal was to hit high ( head) and should had been a major penalty no question about it.

I don't know how you can reverse a call on this one, primary point of contact is the head and the player did everything he could to hit the head...

 

[Warden of the North]

I don't think it's very comparable to Reaves, but it definitely deserves the 5 minute major. He left his feet.

The fact the Leafs ended up on a PK is embarrassing to the league.

 

[hatterson]

The Reeves hit is a dumb comparison because of the from the side nature of the hit that meant Reeves picked Nurses head.

Conversely, on this hit, the direction of contact was basically through center of mass.

The issue here is the upwards launch of the hitter. He crouches low before the hit and then explodes upwards just before the hit.

However, the NHL has repeatedly taken the viewpoint that as long as your skates are still touching the ice at the moment of contact, even if only by a hair, then it doesn’t count as jumping into a hit.

I think that’s a ridiculous approach as it’s fairly easy for a player to lean *into* a hit instead of jumping upwards, and launching upwards dramatically increases the chance of a head injury, but that’s what the NHL has said.

To be clear, I understand that players leaning into a hit won’t eliminate all head contact, and it’s still possible that someone in a position like Knies could take a big hit that has a lot of head contact. My point is that the NHL should be looking to eliminate actions that unnecessarily increase head contact, which is what happened here.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I don't think it's very comparable to Reaves, but it definitely deserves the 5 minute major. He left his feet.

The fact the Leafs ended up on a PK is embarrassing to the league.

I don't think the league feel embarrassed at all. They clearly have no time for the Leafs and there is a recurring theme of punishing the Leafs at every opportunity.

I wouldn't be shocked at all, if later today we hear that Grebenkin receives a fine for his hit on Theodore.

 

[Mitch nylander]

My problem with this hit is that the head contact is avoidable if he doesn't leave his feet. Instead he explodes, and gets nothing but head.

 

[Laus723]

Knies seems to be on the wrong end of big hits often.

 

[Peasy]

Knies seems to be on the wrong end of big hits often.

Wouldn't classify what Bennett did as a hit but you do you.

 

[Laus723]

So did Nurse. Still resulted in 5 and a game plus an additional 5 games. Leafs fans know not to expect anything from Parros on this hit.

Always the victims. Genuinely curious, what did the Leafs do to the League that has them on the wrong end of everything?

Wouldn't classify what Bennett did as a hit but you do you.

I know, he went full WWE on the poor lad.

 

[Dreakmur]

There is ONE difference.

Blood, and even that was caused by Nurses visor, not the actual hit.

That isn’t even one of the 50 I originally thought of….

 

[MCR74]

So did Nurse. Still resulted in 5 and a game plus an additional 5 games. Leafs fans know not to expect anything from Parros on this hit.

Wait til someone takes out McDavid with a similar hit. The goal posts will completely disappear.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Always the victims. Genuinely curious, what did the Leafs do to the League that has them on the wrong end of everything?

Since you asked: a) I believe it's possible he league doesn't want to come across as biased in favour of the Leafs. When the war room is in Toronto, it would look bad if decisions consistently went the Leafs' way so they err on the side of caution. b) Half the players and thus league management grew up despising the Leafs (you know, just like us plebs - you love them or hate them). c) The Leafs will always have fan support so the league doesn't feel any need to cater to us unlike smaller market teams.

And for fun, d):