Where did Yzerman go wrong with the rebuild?

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

This thread is nonsense ...

The title is intentionally provocative. The discussion it’s generating is in my opinion actually a lot better than usual for this board.

 

[heyfolks]

Team has improved every year.

Season 2024-25 - ?? points
Season 2023-24 - 91 points
Season 2022-23 - 80 points
Season 2021-22 - 74 points
Season 2020-21 - 48 points
Season 2019-20 - 39 points

I could argue, that the team direction is right - not wrong.

I agree with the above post, but understand the baseline was very low. I know many thought Walman trade was intended to be a primer for a big move but Yzerman must lock up Seider and Raymond. If I have a concern/complaint, it is that neither is under a new deal. Without this, it is tough to go after Trouba or sign Stamkos.

Goaltending - One can argue the team has improved with the signings.

Defense - Edvinsson replacing Walman is a big improvement. Gus equals Ghost. I think Johansson pushes Petry to 7 and Holl to waivers. That's improvement.

Forwards - Kane for the full year and Raymond's emergence make the the top 6 better but the subtractions make this neutral, at best.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

I wouldn't say he is going wrong. His books are good. I just wish we had more high end offensive prospects in the pool.

 

[Gyldenlove]

I agree with the above post, but understand the baseline was very low. I know many thought Walman trade was intended to be a primer for a big move but Yzerman must lock up Seider and Raymond. If I have a concern/complaint, it is that neither is under a new deal. Without this, it is tough to go after Trouba or sign Stamkos.

Goaltending - One can argue the team has improved with the signings.

Defense - Edvinsson replacing Walman is a big improvement. Gus equals Ghost. I think Johansson pushes Petry to 7 and Holl to waivers. That's improvement.

Forwards - Kane for the full year and Raymond's emergence make the the top 6 better but the subtractions make this neutral, at best.

I agree that the team on the surface did not do much to improve. While I would have loved to add Stamkos, only 1 team was going to be able to do that and it turned out to not be the Wings.

As was stated the team has improved year be year and I do think there is room for improvement this coming season without major addition. Goaltending was below average last season for much of the year, Seider was decent but not dominant, the defense in general was lacklustre defensively. Goaltending should hopefully improve this year, and I hope adding Edvinsson will help the defense improve overall and hopefully Seider will take another step up to true elite status.

Kane for a full year, another year of growth for Razor, more room for the young guys from GR to come up with a few forwards out such as Perron and Sprong, all in all I expect the forward group to improve from last year, although probably not much.

And in terms of adding players, I think the team needs to show they can compete for playoffs before resources are sold off and if all goes to what I assume is the plan they will be in the hunt to add a player at the deadline who can retained.

 

[dalem177]

Goaltending - One can argue the team has improved with the signings.

Certainly my blood pressure will improve with not having to watch Jimmy Rhymes flop around the crease like a sapped sockeye.

 

[Our Lady Peace]

Yzerman went wrong by coming back to Detroit and taking over a Holland-run franchise 3 years removed from its last berth of a 25 year playoff streak riddled with aging veterans and a barren prospect pool

 

[Rolo Tomassi]

Despite my long-winded, rambling poster earlier, I want to be clear that I do not think the rebuild went wrong. I like what Yzerman is trying to build. Aside from some of the UFA signings and maybe the Walman mystery, I don't have many complaints about his work as GM, thus far.

Is it happening as fast as we'd all like? Probably not. But, looking at the roster, contracts, and prospects he was left with when he took over, it is understandable. He had to clean up the cap situation, start to build an NHL roster from basically nothing (except Larkin), and completely rebuild the farm system. Holland left him with an absolute dumpster fire...

With a little lottery luck, things could look a lot different. If Holland had just drafted Hughes instead of Zadina, things would also look a lot different. These are all things he couldn't control.

I am cautiously optimistic about the future. My concern is that people are going to crank up the pressure on him to make the playoffs and he may start making bad moves to do so, before he is ready. I think, if he is allowed to stay the course, stay true to his long-term vision, the team will eventually be VERY competetive.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Certainly my blood pressure will improve with not having to watch Jimmy Rhymes flop around the crease like a sapped sockeye.

Someone needs to make a gif of his game-losing duck under a shot.

 

[Bench]

Someone needs to make a gif of his game-losing duck under a shot.

I've never seen such terrible instincts from an NHL goalie in an actual game. Ducking from the thing you're paid to stop is just so funny to me.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I've never seen such terrible instincts from an NHL goalie in an actual game. Ducking from the thing you're paid to stop is just so funny to me.

Especially since there's several other goalies who I've seen intentionally head a shot like they're playing soccer.

 

[PavelDatsyuk13DET]

Can't relate to the notion that the team is heading in the wrong direction.
- Last season was special in the way that Seider and Raymond was still on ELC. That meant that we could spend more on expensive veterans.
- With Ray and Seider getting paid market value, the room for players like Ghost and Perron disappear
- SY couldn't have done much about the goalie situation. Cossa and Augustine need time to mature. Having faith in them means that we shouldn't trade for expensive veterans in net. Connor Hellebuyck could probably been had, but SY choose to go the Cossa/Augustine route instead
- Vrana or Zadina coulnd't been handled differently
- Only the Walman deal is still a head scratcher, but I believe it will be resolved later this summer with SJ taking on some bad contracts as a third part in a trade (Ekblad, Trouba or other)
- Great to first a) get Kane, then b) resign him at a good price and term
- I have nothing against the Copp or Compher deals
- The Holl deal is the bad move made. I hope we can get rid of it to SJ later
- Husso deal won't hurt us long term
- Petry is cheap
- I also believe that there is a reason for Berggren to get dumped to GRG. Vrana type of reason

In contrast, Holland kept doing moves all the time that hurt the team. Bad contracts, strange trades, bad drafting.

Regarding the part about SJS taking on bad contracts, are they even allowed to do that? I thought I read somewhere that they've reached the limit for the number of contracts they can retain on. Is that true?

 

[TCNorthstars]

Regarding the part about SJS taking on bad contracts, are they even allowed to do that? I thought I read somewhere that they've reached the limit for the number of contracts they can retain on. Is that true?

They are at the max for retaining, but that is just them paying for players they shipped off (or facilitated as a 3rd party). They can take on as many bad contracts as their cap and contract limit will allow.

 

[Henkka]

Regarding the part about SJS taking on bad contracts, are they even allowed to do that? I thought I read somewhere that they've reached the limit for the number of contracts they can retain on. Is that true?

Yes, they have the retaining slots full in Burns, Karlsson and Hertl.

Burns spot will open at season after. Karlsson is retained for 2 seasons, and Hertl for 6 seasons.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808615645074108552

This defense is really bad and so is the goaltending.

 

[Run the Jewels]

I'm going to wait until Yzerman's presser. I'd like to see another move but understand that may prove difficult until he's got Mo and Ray's contracts finalized.

 

[SirKillalot]

Hasn't really gone wrong other than not being able to draft top 3 with the worst years.
It's just some people who think this is a playstation game and rebuild take 3-4 years when in reality it takes double.

Lack some high end talent, some talents just haven't taken the right steps from before he came and during the drafting have been quite good.
Maybe signing too many 4th to 6th defensemen and a few of those plus some forwards on to big and longer contracts than necessary at the same time stop gap players have been needed.

In general, need more high end guys, whether through development and rising up there or signing. Which, signing free agents more difficult now than before, until the team start winning.

 

[RabidBadger]

which would be insane if they never thought about drafting him.

No doubt. I never heard of the Wings being interested in Michkov. Kasper seemed the choice of the people in the know his draft year...*poof*, we get Kasper. Same with Nygard.

I'd say the Michkov talk is a machination of people that were hoping for him or they're parroting Mike Vallenti who has been vocal lately about how they should have drafted him and he's coming over to NA sooner than projected.The same Mike Vallenti who said we should aquire Austin Matthews at all costs, including offering Seider. My balls retreat to my abdomen when that fool talks hockey.

 

[RabidBadger]

I think it was commonly known that Arizona (picking at 6) wanted a defenseman (Reinbacher or Simashev, they weren't likely taking Sandin Pellika due to having Soderstrom) and could have gotten a D by trading down. It was becoming more well known in the week leading up to the draft that Philadelphia (picking at 7) was targeting Michkov more heavily, so if you're Yzerman and the Wings, you'd have to trade up to 6 with Arizona to get Michkov. You're not giving up 17, but you could have easily given up 42 and 43 (essentially became Gibson and later Cleveland) to move up to 6. These things were discussed at the time, at least somewhat.

Yzerman has traded up to get his guy before; Cossa and Buium come to mind. I never heard the Wings were targeting Michkov. Do you know something about that or is this fan chatter based on people not getting the pick they wanted?

I mean, I don't think Yzerman was scratching his head the next day wondering why he didn't trade pick 42 to get Michkov if he really wanted him.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Yzerman has traded up to get his guy before; Cossa and Buium come to mind. I never heard the Wings were targeting Michkov. Do you know something about that or is this fan chatter based on people not getting the pick they wanted?

I mean, I don't think Yzerman was scratching his head the next day wondering why he didn't trade pick 42 to get Michkov if he really wanted him.

Just fan chatter after it was apparent Michkov wasn't going to be selected by San Jose at 4, unlikely to be taken at 5 by Montreal, and week of draft speculation that Philadelphia wanted him at 7.

 

[Euro Twins]

Someone needs to make a gif of his game-losing duck under a shot.

That f*** could be attributed to costing us the first playoff berth in 8 years

 

[RabidBadger]

That f*** could be attributed to costing us the first playoff berth in 8 years

I can only name four players who wouldn't make the list of costing us a playoff berth.

 

[Euro Twins]

I can only name four players who wouldn't make the list of costing us a playoff berth.

Are any of them a goalie that f***ed from a gwg?

 

[Ezekial]

Are any of them a goalie that f***ed from a gwg

The puck startled him! Don't be so hard on the guy

 

[WaW]

I dont think Yzerman went the wrong direction with the rebuild. I think as Henkka pointed out on the front page the fact that we improved every year so far has been impressive.

I do however think Chris Illitch was tired of missing out on playoff revenue and as of the end of the 22-23 season, told Yzerman that the rebuild had to be over even though we got royally f***ed by the draft lottery year after year and it probably should not have been finished.

I still think Yzerman can get this team into the playoffs, but as a fan my aspirations don't end at 86-89 game seasons. I want a future cup contender and I personally don't see that in the cards as of right now with what we currently have in the pipeline.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I dont think Yzerman went the wrong direction with the rebuild. I think as Henkka pointed out on the front page the fact that we improved every year so far has been impressive.

I do however think Chris Illitch was tired of missing out on playoff revenue and as of the end of the 22-23 season, told Yzerman that the rebuild had to be over even though we got royally f***ed by the draft lottery year after year and it probably should not have been finished.

I still think Yzerman can get this team into the playoffs, but as a fan my aspirations don't end at 86-89 game seasons. I want a future cup contender and I personally don't see that in the cards as of right now with what we currently have in the pipeline.

I don’t really understand that line of thinking. Take a 1:1 copy of last season’s team and add a legit #1 goalie (Cossa? Augustine?), another couple of top 4D (Edvinsson? ASP? Wallinder?), and maybe a decent depth defensive winger (MBN? Mazur?) and that’s easily a 100 point team or more.

That doesn’t even involve Kasper/Danielson being anything special or MBN becoming a star instead of a depth guy or Raymond continuing to improve.

The path is fairly easy to see imo.